rjrdomer
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Posts posted by rjrdomer
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That’s a nice double beard. A trophy for sure. Both beards look equal in length and thickness. Many times there is one solid beard and a few thin ones when you have a multiple bearded tom. But it’s the number of filaments that matters. One old turkey hunter once told me a multiple bearded bird is like shooting a buck with drop tines.
My first bird ever was a triple bearded tom. 9.5, 8.5, 8. 3 solid beards. it was in 2011 in Schoharie County. A record book bird with the NWTF and SCI. I went turkey hunting for the first time and went with my dad who has always been an avid deer hunter but never turkey hunted. Beginners luck and the trip got us hooked on turkey hunting ever since. I know I’ll never match that bird. I got a full mount done.
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Third season hunting my own land and was finally able to connect today. My first NYS bird in 9 years as well. Had lots of activity before the season on cameras and scouting for early morning gobbles. Seeing mostly jakes and hens on camera. Dead quiet Saturday. Setup in a blind this morning in a small clearing with a hen decoy where I’ve had activity on my camera. My property is otherwise 95% wooded. Of course I heard gobbles at 5:20 on another end of the property deep into the hardwoods. I got up, grabbed the gun, left everything and hustled about 300 yards into the woods stopping to listen periodically for the gobbles on the roost to steer me correctly. Settled at 5:30 or so against a tree by a stone wall facing the gobbles which were about 125 yards away but it was light out and didn’t want to spook them.
After a few calls, the gobbles stopped momentarily. I thought a hen had cut me off. Then I cut at them really hard, and they started again and seemed committed and then I shut up and waited. I scratched the leaves and I saw a bunch of blue heads sprinting in my direction. Possibly 3 or 4. Tough to see over the terrain and I had my gun up at the ready. They were behind some brush and the stone wall above me. Once the first bird popped his blue head over the wall to peek at the “hen” that yelped, I dropped him at 30 yards. The others scattered and I was never able to make out if they were jakes or toms. I had assumed this was a jake given how fast they charged in. I didn’t see his beard and he never strutted before I saw the blue head.
Turns out he was a nice 2 year old with an 8” beard. And to top it off, today is my 38th birthday. Great day all around.
Good luck to everyone and congratulations to those who bagged their bird.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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It is my understanding...of course try to confirm this with Scott Moxham....If you aren't enrolled in the program this year, then you shouldn't have to pay the 6% stumpage tax to the county. Also, you don't have to pay any back taxes, if you agree to fulfill the next 9 years of your plan (the remaining years of the form submitted last year). However, you don't get the abatement either for the next 9 years. You just have to follow the plan, but then you are released from it when the 9 years are up.
If you want back into the plan, I think you may have to wait 3 years after the logging job otherwise you're on the hook for the 6% stumpage tax.
The plan has its positives and negatives. I hope they heed some advice and make it a little less cumbersome for some.
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Thanks all. So one vote for hens and a few for jakes. I’ve attached a couple more pictures. These are all I have right now as I left the camera card at my hunting camp. One picture is a few days later than the other two but I assume it’s the same birds coming through.
the more I study the heads, they look like jakes to me as well, however I usually see more pronounced beards on jakes 2-3” so that’s what threw me off.
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My trail cam snapped some pictures of turkeys traveling through. I had assumed these were hens all along. When I showed them to a friend, he said it may be a jake. But I’ve never seen heads so pink on hens and the jakes I’ve seen are darker feathered. Then I noticed what may be a tiny beard. I don’t see any spurs though
So is it a jake? A hen with a small beard? Or just a plain old hen? Thoughts?
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Nope. First I use the butt-out tool. If you don't have one, get one. Cheap and easy. A couple of twists and the entire intestinal tract/anus comes out. I cut that off, toss it aside. Then I cut an incision carefully above the sex organs or udders...I pull away the skin to make sure not to puncture the stomach. Once I'm inside the cavity, i continue to cup upward with the blade facing me. I stop right at the sternum. I reach in, pull all the stomach and intestines out. Then I yank the liver out. Sometimes some cowl fat needs to be cut away. Then I yank/cut away at the diaphragm. Once that's out, I reach up into the chest cavity and cut the esophagus...hold it in one hand, knife in the other. And the lungs and heart come out together. It takes about 3-5 minutes usually. I also usually turn the deer over to let some blood drain out to the extent that I can.
I leave the guts where they are in the field. I bring my deer to a processor. I've never had an issue with tainted meat.
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I've had a mature doe make me in a stand while a buck was following her. She stomped, snorted, and ran away taking the buck with her. She circled back 15 minutes later to eat acorns with the buck trailing her. I've shot deer from this stand several years in a row and multiple times during the same season/same day/same weekend. Short answer, keep your stand where it is if it's an area where deer are frequently seen.
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My observations: I hunt 4G/4R and belong to a club where guys hunt 4F as well. Its all northern Catskills type land...mountains/hills/woodland bordering agriculture (hay, corn, cattle, etc). We had 19 guns out on Opening Day and only 1 spike was taken by a youth hunter. I was told by others in the area that it was the quietest opening day weekend in recent memory, and I also heard a handful of distant shots early Saturday morning and that was all for the rest of the weekend. After opening day, a few deer were taken by our club, but not in the numbers of prior years. I took a nice 8 over Thanksgiving weekend that happened to be following a doe around while she was eating some acorns. Just dumb luck really as they were the only 2 deer I saw in 4 days of rifle hunting.
I think several things may have affected this. On my cameras, I had a lot of activity at night and during foul weather in early November/late bow season. The activity in rain and wind surprised me. I hunted a couple of those late bow days that were clear and saw only 2 deer but did not have a shot at them. I did not see much activity on my camera the week after Opening Day. I'm not sure when the timing of the rut was but to those saying the rutting activity wasn't there, that's false. It is there every year in November, like clockwork. It always happens whether or not you see it is a different story. The timing varies by a few days and there are different stages of the rut, so it all depends on when you're in the woods. I think the buck I got may have been following a doe as she got closer to her second estrous. So perhaps the first estrous was in the first week of November.
The late spring may have kept some deer in the ag fields longer versus in the woods on typical runs and working scrapes. As others said, some corn was still standing late into the fall. Also, there were acorns all over the place this year. So deer did not have to travel much for food, even in the later season. I also think there may be fewer hunters out there in general, at least in my part of the state. By watching YouTube videos and reading this forum, there are stark differences between the size and number of deer in the western vs eastern part of NYS and the way they are hunted too. I think due to the ARs in most of the catskills and the relative few DMPs issued, you are just seeing fewer people walking through the woods pushing deer around. That said, when I have seen bucks, they've usually been 2.5-3.5 year old 6 or 8 pointers....different than the spikes and forks we saw all over the place 5-10 years ago. So in a way that's a positive, but I do think the ARs while having some benefit, may be keeping the casual downstate/city guy from making a day or weekend trip up to the mountains pushing deer around.
So I feel given the abundance of food (a positive thing for the herd) and fewer walking hunters, deer just didn't have to move very far. When they don't move, we don't see them.
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On 12/3/2019 at 11:00 PM, Enders said:
I got my hunting license at the end of October, went out on 5 hunts before this one and today with the help of friends I got a button buck which I thought was a doe so I took it. Even though I hate the idea of taking such a young buck I can’t take it back so here he is. My fist deer ever. It was a hell of a hike and a grueling hike back. Until next season.
Congratulations! Don't feel bad at all. Any deer taken on public land from the ground is a trophy for sure. Hopefully you also learned in the process since you are new to the sport. Each time I go out, I learn something new. To me, that's the most fun about it all. Enjoy that meat!
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Grampy is right, but also, try to position yourself where you can see a little better. You don't want to just be shooting at something that may be legs. If you can get up from a higher vantage point, that helps you see as well. But try to hide your outline like others said. You don't want to be sitting on a peak with nothing behind you. Sit against a tree or rock..something to break you up.
Is this public or private land? If it's private land, you should setup a ladder stand or tree stand of some type about 50-75 yards off of this spot maybe next year. Snow is very helpful in showing deer movement and patterns. There are obviously deer around here which is good. They likely chose that area to feed as there are oak trees mixed with some hemlocks. The hemlocks provide cover/stopped the snow from piling up. The oaks provide acorns, which deer and turkeys eat right now. So if you can position yourself over an oak flat,, that's great. What are you hunting with? If you have a good rifle, you don't need to sneak up on them.
And unless you are tracking a monster buck through the snow in the Adirondacks, just sit tight. I feel that too many people walk and hunt. It's one thing if you're doing a drive, but it's tough to walk up on a deer alone. Don't get up and try to "cut them off." They know those woods better than you do and will be 150 yards ahead of you at all times just out of your sight. So get in there, sit down, and don't move until the day is over. You know where the deer are, now you just need patience and time. Patience has killed more deer than any luck or skill out there. Good luck.
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6 hours ago, Rattler said:
Bucks are currently traveling far looking for any doe that hasn't been bred already. This is why you will see bucks that were never on any of your trail cams. It is not uncommon to see them cruising during daylight hours now too. Many don't think so, but now is a good time to stay on stand all day long.
Yes, agreed. And if you have hunters in the woods pushing the deer on nearby properties, everything gets scrambled up even more.
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I don't know if it's really a second rut per se. The rut sort of continues as does go into estrous at different times...their cycles may vary by a few days. Some will be in heat on November 5, some November 15. And any doe that isn't bred during her first heat will go into a second estrous cycle 28 days later. So now you may have some does who were in heat in early November but not bred, going back into heat. So there will still be some chasing going on. I saw a mature buck chasing a doe at 2:00pm right after I got into my stand in 2017 on Thanksgiving weekend. They were galloping like horses...I was never able to get a shot off as I had just climbed in and was settling in as it unfolded.
Same goes this weekend I took a buck that was a few yards behind a lone doe. He wasn't all out chasing her, but tending her from about 10 yards behind as she ate and wandered through the woods.
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A spring season would make a lot of sense, but NY doesn't do anything that makes sense. I can go on and on but the fish and game department should be separate from the environmental department for starters. Then maybe the game seasons would make sense. I digress..
If NY (or even NJ) really wanted to control the bear population, they'd have a spring and fall hunt. Spring hunt with bait, fall hunt as is (Basically incidental to deer hunting). They could limit the spring hunt to areas where there is a perceived bear problem....perhaps the same WMUs that have the early season in the fall. This way you don't have to worry about people baiting the deer since again, for some reason, that's a cardinal no-no in NY parlance. Many northern states and Canadian provinces have spring bear seasons with good results. I've hunted Alberta in May and had a blast. The meat may not be good, but maybe the state could setup some program where the carcasses can get donated to something...even swine feed. In Canada they use them as wolf/coyote bait. The hides are great in the early spring..nice thick coats and great for making rugs. If NY had a spring hunt, a cottage industry of guides/outfitters may even spring up and add more money to the local economies in an otherwise dead time. April/May....before summer vacation seasons, before deer hunters take over the woods, and after ski season.
But like I said, why would NY do anything that makes sense?
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I took a 92.0 point bird in 2011, had 3 beards...but I guess that's below your criteria.
There are only 12 atypical birds in NY greater than 105 and 14 greater than 75 with the NWTF. Are you limiting your book to just 26 entries?
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Probably best if you keep this to yourself and deal with it yourself. You're going to get a wide range of opinions from people here. You know what they say...opinions are like.......everybody has one.
Do what you feel is right. If you are not sure who to call, you may want to start with the DEC. But I wouldn't look to the internet for moral guidance to clear your conscience.
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Ignoring people mocking the original poster for not being rugged enough...to answer the question.
I believe it also has to do with the terrain. Out west, there are typically cell towers along interstates and the signal can project for miles because there aren't any trees in the way. In the Adirondacks, you have hills, mountains, valleys, and lots of trees blocking signals. The reason why they don't install the towers to improve coverage is there is no return on investment. Not enough phone subscribers in the area. It would take the state to put in a bunch of money to improve service.
And forget not having service in the Adirondacks. There are many, many parts of the Catskills still without service, even along some main roads. Granted, I can eventually get it by driving 10 minutes or walking to a high clearing, but still...it's not adequately covered either. Again, largely due to terrain and demand. And there are way more people down there than up in the Adirondacks.
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A number of interesting points have come up here. Short answer is, I am mixed. I don't know if the ARs are working. Anecdotally, I'm seeing more larger deer on camera and in the field. Still seeing more does than bucks, for sure. I've also heard others in the area say they've been seeing more larger deer than prior years. This is WMU 4R/4G/Schoharie/Delaware/Greene Counties. It's tough to say if this is a direct result of ARs or if it is something related to better habitat, better hunter education, better hunting through technology (we didn't have trail cameras years ago).
Are we seeing more deer than 30-40 years ago? For sure. That's clear. Versus 10 years ago...I'd say maybe. It's one of those things that is difficult to really test for since there are so many variables. Do the ARs stop people from shooting small bucks? Maybe...it should....but there are unscrupulous people out there who don't follow the rules. Especially in WMUs that border non-AR units, but I understand you have to draw the line somewhere. But what the ARs did do, is encouraged some hunters to go elsewhere. Why make the day trip to an AR area if you can go to another WMU? So maybe the combination of fewer hunters in AR areas coupled with the actual restrictions are increasing big buck numbers. Was the state's intention to keep the city folk from day tripping to the catskills, hopping out of the truck, walking through the woods, and shooting a spike and going away? Yeah maybe. It's tough to say. NYS has never been a hunter friendly state, so it's quite possible they just want fewer people in the woods.
I think the ARs by themselves would work well if they also increased the number of doe tags in a unit. Are numbers really that low that they don't want to issue doe tags? My ratio of does to bucks is probably 10:1. Science behind ARs is mixed....but it has been proven, kill a few more does and you'll likely see more bucks. Granted, there has to be a balance so you don't wipe out the population. Also, if someone cheats the AR rule, it defeats the whole purpose. That 4 pointer on your property could be a 6 or 8 next year unless someone cheats and shoots it.
Texas has an interesting view on ARs that have seemed to work. I understand this is Texas and a very different environment than NY. But in TX, you are allowed to shoot a spike or a deer with a wide spread (the measurement escapes me). Thought being, keep the spikes from reproducing...they've proven, at least in Texas that spikes pass on inferior antler genes to the next generation. And then the medium deer get to grow.
So there's probably more the state could do if they really wanted to help things. ARs likely work, but like I said, I'm sort of mixed because they can probably pull more levers with doe tags and other things. I'd also allow predator (coyote) hunting during spring turkey season and all deer seasons if taken incidental to turkey and deer hunting.
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Oh and I think that tree you photographed may be a black cherry. I'm not an expert but the bark sure looks ragged enough. If you have a few of those, you have money. Softwoods aren't worth much...oak and cherry is where the money is.
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What county is it in? Pricing can vary depending on area of the state and what sort of improvements the land already has done to it. Raw, driveway, logging trails, power, etc. If it's not accessible from a paved road, it would be cheaper than something with frontage (read: it gets plowed in the winter).
In terms of the trees, assuming you don't need to scoop it up immediately for whatever reason, I'd recommend hiring a reputable forester consultant who works in your area to do a fast timber cruise. They'll go through the acreage and tell you with a range of what the standing timber is worth. Then you have options. You can harvest some immediately, or down the road. But at least you'll have a rough idea of what's on the property and what its value is. If it was logged at any point in the last 10 years, there may not be anything of value. Check with the seller as to when they last logged it. Also, how was it done? Sometimes landowners just hire a logger who scrapes everything of value leaving you with the junk (called high grading). Other times someone who cares comes in and only takes selective trees leaving some to continue to grow and provide food and habitat. A consulting forester can help you with a plan if you wish (At a cost). They can also broker any type of timber harvest deal for you (at a cost).
I purchased 80 acres of land last year that had never been logged. I immediately posted it and hired a consulting forester to help me. I told him what I wanted to do (recoup some of my initial outlay, manage for the long-term, get better access, and keep mast for deer and turkey). He went through, marked trees that needed to be cut, wrote up a management plan for me, and put the logging job out for bid. Got 3 very different bids...sold to the highest bidder. Got paid up front. Had I called a logger alone, they probably would have scalped it, left me with garbage, ruined my land, and paid me as they went to the sawmill. But every logger is different and every forester is different. For me, it was worth it.
State list of consulting foresters:
http://www.dec.ny.gov/docs/lands_forests_pdf/coopforlist.pdf
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Middle of the middle. It allows more room for error. If you shoot too far forward, you run the risk of hitting the thick and large shoulder blade. It may result in a wounded bear or a dead bear about 1000 yards from where you last saw it. Good luck finding it. I went on a bear hunt in Canada and the outfitter said always shoot middle of the middle and you'll find your bear within 40 yards. Everyone in camp got a bear except for one...someone who shot too far forward and hit the shoulder.
It's hard for the deer hunter to adjust, but trust me...middle of the middle. Farther back than you would on a deer.
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Went to Texas twice. Look at Four County Outfitters near Seymour TX. Did a 4 night combo turkey and hog hunt. They do deer and ducks as well. Hogs in TX can be hunted any time of year, day or night, no bag limit. If you want to go cheap, you can probably find a motel 6 and knock on some doors. Farmers want to get rid of them. But using an Outfitter makes things much easier as they have feeders and stands setup on leases for you to use. And you get food and lodging. I think it was like $1200 for 4 nights. 3 hours from Dallas. If money is a real concern, don't go at all. But if you want to have a fun hunt, just spend the money.
Most hunting in TX is rifle, but I'm sure you can get setup with a bow spot.
The second hunt i did was on a private ranch I was invited to through my job. Again it was a turkey and hog combo hunt. I shot a 75 pound hog and they sent it to a processor and covered all those costs so it was nice. I got 22 pounds of meat back and it was some of the best tasting meat I've had in my life. They say the trick is to get one about 50-100 pounds to get some good meat. The small ones are good whole, and the larger ones are tough. You need one in the sweet spot.
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Been to Canada via plane. Never filled out anything for US customs on the return. Once they pulled me aside and ran the firearm serial number only to ensure it wasn't stolen. It's US customs, so all they care about is stolen weapons and whether or not you are a felon. US customs cannot enforce local NYS rules regarding firearm ownership.
In terms of Canada, at the airport, declare the firearm to customs. They'll then send you to a separate line with your baggage and you need to pay a tax of around $50 to possess the firearm in Canada. It's good for 60 days if you happen to return. The officer may question you as to what you're hunting, where you are going, etc. Pretty basic innocuous stuff.
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Late to the topic but may be able to provide some helpful information here based on recent experience.
NYS places property taxes and school taxes on both land and building but assigns two different assessed values one to "land" and one to "building". So it's incorrect to say you don't pay school taxes or less school tax if you don't have a house there. You still pay both school and property taxes on land. You pay less tax in general because you'll only have a "land" line item on the tax bill. Once you put up a structure, and by structure I mean something not on wheels you're going to get hit with a higher assessment and pay both higher school and regular property taxes. You receive two separate bills in Schoharie County. One from the county in January for property taxes, and one in September from the school district you are zoned for for the school taxes. Two separate payments to two taxing authorities.
Next, in terms of building a cabin or shed. NYS has strict requirements for dwellings these days. You can attempt to get away with something, but if the assessor or code enforcement officer/building inspector catches wind of it, you may be in some trouble and it will wind up costing you more in the end. You can put a camper/RV/something on wheels and that's exempt from everything. Once you tie it to the ground or have it on a foundation, it's a building, needs a permit and has to meet code. Code in NY is very strict. About 10 years ago they adopted some international building standards and wow, it is bonkers. Gone are the days of having your buddies come up with a case of beer and slap some shack together. It has to meet insulation requirements, the foundation has to be a certain depth with insulation, if it's a manufactured home (trailer), it needs to be tied down a certain way. All sorts of stuff you never would imagine, and much of it is in the name of energy efficiency. They let you put up a shed without a permit, however, that's not considered a dwelling. The only way to get around it is to quietly build a cabin/shed and not have any electricity or running water to it. Once you want to put in a septic or a well, you need a county permit and engineer to come out and design it so you can get that permit.
If it's in the NYC watershed, oh boy, that adds another layer of issues when it comes to wastewater.
My advice to you, if looking for a place to hang your hat a few nights a year for hunting, buy an RV or something and have no services to it. If you need something a little more permanent, you're going to have to invest money to get power to the property, well, septic, tree clearing, driveway, etc. Regardless if you're putting a $100k trailer or a $1 million mansion, the basic infrastructure costs are the same. Oh and anything over 800 sq feet typically needs to have real plans stamped by a licensed engineer or architect. If you buy a manufactured home, the home builder will provide a set of plans for the building permit process.
I know all of this because I am currently building a home in Schoharie County. It's more complicated and costing me a lot more than I initially expected. Feel free to reach out should you have any questions.
Truelife Taxidermy in Middletown NY / Pricing
in Taxidermy
Posted
Bob at True Life has done a lot of taxidermy work for myself and family/friends. Whatever he charges is well worth it. He did 2 bear rugs for me (Alberta black bear) back in 2015/16 and they’re beautiful. His mounts hold up well, the detail is perfect, and everyone says wow when they see it. You won’t even think about what you spent when it’s done.
I have a turkey he did for me 10+ years ago and everyone who has seen it says they’ve never seen a turkey mount that good.
go and don’t look back