Another mass shooting...

[Mr VJP]

Its still not about guns, self defense, liberty, etc.

Whether in a vacuum or not the real issue is decision-making. Spinning it onto any other platform is misguided, so much so those bemoaning the gun free point are just as misguided as those yammering for more gun control in response to this.

 

I have no idea what exactly you are trying to say here.  Decision making?  Who's decision making?  Someone made a decision impacting these people, by taking away their right to make a decision for themselves.  That is the core problem with all gun control laws. 

 

You cannot control the decisions made by others, but you can be prepared for them.  It's each individual's decision to be prepared, or unprepared, for what might happen.

 

Considering the frequency of crazy, random, violent attacks against all types of people these days, I think it prudent to be prepared in case you find yourself in that situation.  I will not accept someone imposing their will on me, especially when it puts my life in danger.

[The_Field_Ager]

Charleston shooting prompts gun-rights supporters to call for more concealed-carry at churches

 

 

He was a young gunman bent on shooting as many worshippers as possible, but Matthew J. Murray never got as far as Dylann Roof, the suspect in Wednesday’s South Carolina church massacre.

Murray had already shot and killed two people in the parking lot when he burst into the New Life Church in Colorado Springs. Before he could pull the trigger again, however, the 24-year-old shooter was gunned down by Jeanne Assam, a volunteer security guard with a concealed-carry permit.

That was eight years ago, but even though Ms. Assam was credited for saving as many as 100 lives that day, a dozen states continue to restrict the carrying of concealed firearms in churches — including South Carolina.

The Emanuel AME Church shooting that left nine dead Wednesday prompted not just a surge in calls from the left for tighter gun-control laws, but also pleas from the right for churches to protect themselves by allowing their parishioners to pack heat

 

 

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jun/18/charleston-church-shooting-prompts-gun-rights-supp/

 

 

This conversation has been happening at my Church. We have concealed permit holders, and one or two will likely be packing hence forth.

 

Ain't the progressive 'post Christian' world we live in great?

Edited June 20, 2015 by Papist

[Mr VJP]

Churches have been targets before.  But not all have been victims.

 

http://www.goupstate.com/article/20120325/ARTICLES/120329781/1112?tc=ar

[NFA-ADK]

I understand your point Phade but when we get pushed we push back.  And those pushing us are trying to take away more of our gun rights so we push back hard to keep what we already have.

 

Personally I would rather have the few carry and conceal permit holder I know to have that weapon on them regardless of location.  This includes churches, schools and any other location some guy on prescription drugs or on a mission for terrorist action against Americans can happen.  As far as I am concerned there should be no gun free zones because it advertises helplessness.  These killers seem to exploit this.  Scary!

 

These where good people, no these where GREAT people and the world is at a lose without them.  The goodness in them is evident in the people that carry on there word and there forgiving spirit.  Personally I do not think I could be as forgiving.  God bless the family, friends and first responders to this horrible scene. 

[WNYBuckHunter]

Some of the cops react too quickly and may have shot someone if they saw them with a gun . It has been done before.

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Thats a stretch i would think, and not something that has happened very often. I highly doubt the cops would have arrived while the shooting was going down, or when people had guns drawn.

[ants]

Then again , if some of the black congregation had guns and shot Roof before he could kill 9 people and the cops showed up , there probably would be a lot of them shot by the cops . Just saying .........

 

 

That is one of the stupidest broad brushed statements I have ever heard…..So law abiding blacks shouldn't be armed because police ( and I assume you mean white police)  automatically shoot the first black they see with a gun, no matter what the situation???    WOW!! Ya might want to rethink that one Reverend Al. ….Bull $hit thinking like that is exactly why this country is in such racial divide. Keep it up..

[fasteddie]

That is one of the stupidest broad brushed statements I have ever heard…..So law abiding blacks shouldn't be armed because police ( and I assume you mean white police)  automatically shoot the first black they see with a gun, no matter what the situation???    WOW!! Ya might want to rethink that one Reverend Al. ….Bull $hit thinking like that is exactly why this country is in such racial divide. Keep it up..

 

I didn't say they shouldn't be armed , Re-read my statement (assuming you can) . I got your "Reverand Al" right here Antsy !

Do you recall two police responding to a scene where someone was seen with a gun and in seconds gun downed a teenage kid that had a pellet gun .........duh !

The poor cops are on the defensive now and don't trust people when they respond to a call . They never know when someone is going to pull a gun on them .

[Mr VJP]

Cops arriving on a scene get nervous when they see anyone with a gun, white, black or what have you.  But if the person with the gun drops it, puts their hands up and shows no aggression or threatening movement, they are unlikely to shoot.

 

If you shoot someone and call the cops, tell them you have a gun and just shot someone and give them a description of yourself and what you're wearing.  It's also wise to put the gun down when the cops arrive, unless the perp is still alive and you are holding him at gunpoint, which is something else you need to tell the cops over the phone.

 

The more info they have prior to arriving, the better for everyone involved, including the cops.

[fasteddie]

I agree Mr VJP .........

[ants]

I didn't say they shouldn't be armed , Re-read my statement (assuming you can) . I got your "Reverand Al" right here Antsy !

Do you recall two police responding to a scene where someone was seen with a gun and in seconds gun downed a teenage kid that had a pellet gun .........duh !

The poor cops are on the defensive now and don't trust people when they respond to a call . They never know when someone is going to pull a gun on them .

You specifically said if someone of the "BLACK" congregation was armed then they might be shot by  police when they arrived …Go back and read your original post, assuming you can. Why did you say "Black"

And Yeah.. you do have my "Reverend Al" right here edsie  

[fasteddie]

I said black mainly because it is a Black oriented church with a majority of a black congregation ............

 

As I stated , I am not against concealed carry in a Church ..............

[ants]

I said black mainly because it is a Black oriented church with a majority of a black congregation ............

 

As I stated , I am not against concealed carry in a Church ..............

Then your original statement, in which you specifically say "blacks"  makes no sense… If it was the exact situation but involving a white church, would you have said "white congregation "?????….What ever..

[wooly]

Cops arriving on a scene get nervous when they see anyone with a gun, white, black or what have you.  But if the person with the gun drops it, puts their hands up and shows no aggression or threatening movement, they are unlikely to shoot.

 

Yep..., just ask Walter Scott how that worked out for him when he was pulled over for a broken tail light and shot dead 8x's IN THE BACK!

Cops get nervous arriving on a scene even if they DON'T see a gun, and they don't always use their best judgement before "pulling the trigger" to diffuse a situation because they are also susceptible to human error judgement calls just like the rest of us.

[Mr VJP]

Maybe if Scott had put his hands up and not grabbed to cops taser trying to use it on him, he wouldn't have gotten shot.  The cop broke the law after that happened, but Scott initiated the whole thing.

 

[wooly]

So if Scott had gotten the cops "taser" and used it on him, the filthy pig.. and Scott would both still be alive and Scott could have served his sentence....... if convicted of a crime of course.

The cop would have never missed an hour of pay, and lived happily ever after.

Look at both of them now.

[Mr VJP]

Did Scott do any of what I advised in my earlier post wooly?  If he had, he'd be alive and the POLICE OFFICER would not be in jail.  I say we wait until the trail is over to pass judgement.

[wooly]

Lol- the COP was the killer..... he was the one who should have put his hands in the air and layed down his weapon!

[ants]

Yep..., just ask Walter Scott how that worked out for him when he was pulled over for a broken tail light and shot dead 8x's IN THE BACK!

Cops get nervous arriving on a scene even if they DON'T see a gun, and they don't always use their best judgement before "pulling the trigger" to diffuse a situation because they are also susceptible to human error judgement calls just like the rest of us.

Rare..Rare..Rare exception. In the vast majority of police interactions,cops act appropriately. The cop in the Scott case was a trigger happy dirt bag and was dealt with swiftly. He was fired, arrested and will be prosecuted. He will never see the light of day. Why do you think the good "Reverend" Al got in his little clown car and drove away from that situation so fast?? Nothing to stir up and make money off of.

 

 

Do Black cops ever have to shoot and  kill white suspects???… From the news coverage I would say …no..NEVER...

[Mr VJP]

Wooly, do you LOL at all the POLICE OFFICERS that are getting killed these days since Obama has given the green light to deviants to disregard their orders?  

 

If you treat a POLICE OFFICER with the respect they deserve and put them at ease, you have nothing to fear.

 

If you're a lawless idiot that thinks he can resist a POLICE OFFICER and get away with it, this is the story.....

 

Edited June 21, 2015 by Mr VJP

[ants]

A cop was shot and killed in New Orleans yesterday by a scum bag carrier  criminal. Don't know what race the cop or the scum bag were. You can read all about it on several posts on this sight…..oooops…nothing to see here folks.. But hey... today a cop yelled at me while he was directing traffic, at an accident,  and I didn't move through the intersection fast enough… What a JERK!!! Bet he's a racist too!!!!! Even though he looked kind of Asian…..but he was probably more white than anything else….I think…..Yeah definitely a "white asian"

[wooly]

Wooly, do you LOL at all the POLICE OFFICERS that are getting killed these days since Obama has given the green light to deviants to disregard their orders?  

 

If you treat a POLICE OFFICER with the respect they deserve and put them at ease, you have nothing to fear.

 

If you're a lawless idiot that thinks he can resist a POLICE OFFICER and get away with it, this is the story.....

 

stupid.jpg

 

Honestly, I don't "LOL" any more about a bad cop getting killed  or locked up any more than I do an honest citizen getting gunned down on the streets by a thug or a dirty cop.

I could give a rats azz what happens to either of them perusing the lifestyle they chose.

It really doesn't affect my life, but I do pay attention to what's going on and bank that information away in the back of my mind should a personal situation ever arise an encounter with either party.

[DirtTime]

My thoughts go out to the victims.

 

With that said...........................Seeing this thread went sideways like they all tend to do........

 

There's no name to put with the shooter. So, we do not know if the firearm was legal or not. Very hard to walk down the street in a 'hoodie' carrying a long gun. So we have to think it was most likely a handgun or small assault weapon. Most of these atrocities are committed with illegal guns.

 

Now lets look at a few 'facts' here:

 

Police were still looking for the gunman late Wednesday, and helicopters are hovering above. Police spokesman Charles Francis described the suspect as a 21-year-old white male in a gray sweatshirt/hoodie and jeans with Timberland boots. He has a slender build. 

 

 

To be this specific, is a bit far fetched. When have you ever read or heard on the news about a specific age? It's usually between 'yadda and yaddddaaaa'. Not right on the button unless they know exactly who the perp was! Shouldn't this read "Witnesses stated/commented"? If you got a good enough look at his boots to know the brand, then you sure as hell should know if he/she was wearing an actual sweatshirt or a hoodie! That might not make sense to you but, think about it for a minute. If you know he had a 'slender build'. then you saw what shirt he/she had on!

 

Now, here comes the HUGE one!

This is not meant as racism, but what white male/female is going to walk into a black community church and open fire? Just because that church had a gun ban doesn't mean jack! That 'lone' "white" person just strolled in, and went postal?

 

Something doesn't seem right here.

Edited June 21, 2015 by ....rob

[Paula]

What and What?

[DirtTime]

What, what and what , what?

 

[The_Field_Ager]

Another mass shooting in Detroit.  No whitey involved this time, so we won't be hearing too much about it. At least not with the same degree of outrage. Doesn't fit the racially divisive narrative.

 

 

http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2015/06/9_shot_on_detroit_basketball_c.html

Edited June 23, 2015 by Papist