did I sin?

[Five Seasons]

1 hour ago, Storm914 said:

I'm not sure how much you would make collecting guns over time  but unlike stocks  at least guns will not ever be worth 0  which can happen with stocks .

Technically that's incorrect. There's a time and day where the government can attempt to confiscate or prevent the sale or inheritance. The safe act and ARs is a good peak into this potential. Obviously this doesn't include the black market.

[Pygmy]

4 minutes ago, Belo said:

Technically that's incorrect. There's a time and day where the government can attempt to confiscate or prevent the sale or inheritance. The safe act and ARs is a good peak into this potential. Obviously this doesn't include the black market.

Black market....??...Isn't that where you buy those automatic pistols that you hold sideways  ??…..

[Five Seasons]

Just now, Pygmy said:

Black market....??...Isn't that where you buy those automatic pistols that you hold sideways  ??…..

that's the only way to kill innocent bystandards.

just saying that technically there is still a value.

[Hunter007]

21 minutes ago, Belo said:

Technically that's incorrect. There's a time and day where the government can attempt to confiscate or prevent the sale or inheritance. The safe act and ARs is a good peak into this potential. Obviously this doesn't include the black market.

They  would  do buy backs if I'm not mistaken , also you could take it apart sell the parts or sell the steel for scrap it's still worth something. 

Stocks can go to worthless overnight. 

Edited January 31, 2019 by Storm914

[WNYBuckHunter]

I’ve sold guns in the past. Some I regret, others I dont. I dont sell them anymore though. My collection has been growing, some serve similar purposes, and there’s a couple of never fired safe queens in there. I like variety, it’s the spice of life! 

[steve863]

I knew a guy once who was constantly buying and selling guns.  He would make a $25 to $50 profit on a sale and he was happy as a clam, yet never took into account all the time and energy he wasted trying to make that sale.  I don't care if one owns expensive guns or cheap guns, my observation is that NO one will ever make much money by selling them.  It's only chump change in the scheme of things thus any gun I own will never get sold.  If my kids don't want them and decide to throw them into the river once I am gone, so be it.  Not like I will be too worried about it then.  LOL

 

 

[Nomad]

Few years ago I sold a bunch of long guns I just never used, ML, Turkey gun and my Dads and Grandfathers guns .

Ive had my Dads and Grandfathers guns for years and years, never used them and just didn’t want to burden our girls with selling them down the road . After selling everything my parents owned, I just don’t want to pt our kids through that, so I’ve been cleaning house .

[airedale]

Some serious money can be made with firearms and like anything else where there is serious money involved serious knowledge is required. High quality, the manufacturer, model desirability and numbers made (rarity) is the starting point with many other smaller factors that keep adding on to what the values end up being.

There is always a market for those that want to own the good stuff and will pay to get it.

Al

Edited January 31, 2019 by airedale

[steve863]

3 minutes ago, airedale said:

Some serious money can be made with firearms and like anything else where there is serious money involved serious knowledge is required. High quality, the manufacturer, model desirability and numbers made (rarity) is the starting point with many other smaller factors that keep adding on to what the values end up being.

Al

Serious money?  I don't think even professional dealers ever get dirt rich selling guns.  Maybe some illegal dealers might, but the legitimate ones may make a decent living and that's about it.  Maybe one can stumble across a rare gun and buy it cheap and then sell it for a lot more or inherit a bunch of guns that they paid $0 and sell those off, but how often does that happen?   People in this age of the internet typically know what they've got and what they can sell it for.  Generally people try to sell junk for top dollar and then want to buy a gem of a gun from you for next to nothing.  

[Rattler]

I was once purchasing a nice Bernadelli SXS from a gun shop that was closing, when the gunsmith there asked me if I liked SXS shotguns.  I said I do very much so.  He asked if I wanted to buy his 20 gauge Browning BSS.  I said I would be happy to if it was in good shape.  Asking how much he wanted for it, he said $1200.  When he pulled it from it's case, it proved to be a Grade II BSS 20 gauge with silver receiver, engraving and AAA walnut.  This was a gunsmith in his mid 60's mind you.

I gave him the $1200 and took it home.  He never fired it and neither did I.  I had many expensive SXS shotguns then.  Merkels, Ariettas, Ugartecheas, etc.  Many were hand engraved and truly works of art.  This Grade II BSS was mass produced and machine engraved, but of good quality and quite collectible.

Less than two years after I bought it, I put in on gunbroker.com asking $2400.  I figured if anyone would give me that much for it, they could have it, as it aroused no love in my heart.  Long story short, a professor at Dartmouth bid $4200 and won the gun.  The next highest bidder e-mailed me immediately after the auction to say he would buy it for $4200 if the winner backed out.

Another time, a police officer friend was getting married and offered me a very good condition Winchester 1873 for $2500.  I sold it 6 months later for $3800.  The internet puts them in front of thousands more potential buyers who are willing to pay what they are really worth, as opposed to your local newspaper or Craigs List ad. 

Keep in mind, the local FFL is not going to give them what they are asking, even if it's a bargain price.  I've stopped folks from selling to an FFL when I was in their shop and heard the low ball price they said they would pay for a fine gun.  I discretely tell them to meet me outside or call me and I'll buy it from them.

If you know your firearms, you will find valuable firearms offered for sale cheap without too much effort.  Many people do NOT know what they are worth and will part with them for what they think is a good price.  If you are known to be a buyer of fine firearms, people will come to you with their firearms and offer them to you first.  If you think they are asking too much, you decline.  If you think they are asking too little, you can pay more, but should always keep the value of your time in mind when doing so.

It's all perfectly legal, but does require an FFL transfer now for every sale.  That cost has to be calculated into the price you pay.  Even considering that, it can be a very profitable hobby.

I have found dealing with inexpensive firearms can bring an average 20% return, but that may only be $40.  But 20% on a $5000 firearm will bring $1000 and not take any more of my time to sell, so that's what I'm interested in.

 

[Marion]

I was once purchasing a nice Bernadelli SXS from a gun shop that was closing, when the gunsmith there asked me if I liked SXS shotguns.  I said I do very much so.  He asked if I wanted to buy his 20 gauge Browning BSS.  I said I would be happy to if it was in good shape.  Asking how much he wanted for it, he said $1200.  When he pulled it from it's case, it proved to be a Grade II BSS 20 gauge with silver receiver, engraving and AAA walnut.  This was a gunsmith in his mid 60's mind you.
I gave him the $1200 and took it home.  He never fired it and neither did I.  I had many expensive SXS shotguns then.  Merkels, Ariettas, Ugartecheas, etc.  Many were hand engraved and truly works of art.  This Grade II BSS was mass produced and machine engraved, but of good quality and quite collectible.
Less than two years after I bought it, I put in on gunbroker.com asking $2400.  I figured if anyone would give me that much for it, they could have it, as it aroused no love in my heart.  Long story short, a professor at Dartmouth bid $4200 and won the gun.  The next highest bidder e-mailed me immediately after the auction to say he would buy it for $4200 if the winner backed out.
Another time, a police officer friend was getting married and offered me a very good condition Winchester 1873 for $2500.  I sold it 6 months later for $3800.  The internet puts them in front of thousands more potential buyers who are willing to pay what they are really worth, as opposed to your local newspaper or Craigs List ad. 
Keep in mind, the local FFL is not going to give them what they are asking, even if it's a bargain price.  I've stopped folks from selling to an FFL when I was in their shop and heard the low ball price they said they would pay for a fine gun.  I discretely tell them to meet me outside or call me and I'll buy it from them.
If you know your firearms, you will find valuable firearms offered for sale cheap without too much effort.  Many people do NOT know what they are worth and will part with them for what they think is a good price.  If you are known to be a buyer of fine firearms, people will come to you with their firearms and offer them to you first.  If you think they are asking too much, you decline.  If you think they are asking too little, you can pay more, but should always keep the value of your time in mind when doing so.
It's all perfectly legal, but does require an FFL transfer now for every sale.  That cost has to be calculated into the price you pay.  Even considering that, it can be a very profitable hobby.
I have found dealing with inexpensive firearms can bring an average 20% return, but that may only be $40.  But 20% on a $5000 firearm will bring $1000 and not take any more of my time to sell, so that's what I'm interested in.
 

Buying and selling firearms even as a hobby will require an FFL

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[Rattler]

12 minutes ago, The Jerkman said:

Buying and selling firearms even as a hobby will require an FFL

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That's not legally correct.  Being in the "business" of buying and selling firearms does, but doing so as a hobby, with your own personal firearms collection, and using FFL's to do the transfers, is not something that requires an FFL.

[Marion]

That's not legally correct.  Being in the "business" of buying and selling firearms does, but doing so as a hobby, with your own personal firearms collection, and using FFL's to do the transfers, is not something that requires an FFL.

If it is a frequent thing that one is doing that would be considered by the Apple Turkey Feathers to be "in the business" of buying and selling

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[steve863]

14 minutes ago, The Jerkman said:

Buying and selling firearms even as a hobby will require an FFL

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Interesting point which I was not aware of.  Looks like the ATF has some rules on this that many may not be following.  If someone is buying and selling guns and making that considerable profit some here claim you can make, then you don't necessarily have to be in "business" as a gun dealer to require an FFL.

 

https://www.atf.gov/file/100871/download

[Marion]

Interesting point which I was not aware of.  Looks like the ATF has some rules on this that many may not be following.  If someone is buying and selling guns and making that considerable profit some here claim you can make, then you don't necessarily have to be in "business" as a gun dealer to require an FFL.
 
https://www.atf.gov/file/100871/download

That is one of the ways Adam Webber former owner of HKparts.net got his nice fat prison sentence. You can research it yourself

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[steve863]

The Jerkman wins the prize for most valuable tidbit of the week!!

 

[Rattler]

1 minute ago, The Jerkman said:

If it is a frequent thing that one is doing that would be considered by the Apple Turkey Feathers to be "in the business" of buying and selling

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Which was a problem under the Obama era administration, where the law was used as a weapon against citizens.  Any actual business, even car parts, selling firearms, cannot contest the "being in the business" part of the law, because they use business cash to buy and sell.  But a hobbyist who is a private citizen can.  Since the change under Trump, they have failed to make any legal case when challenged, that would define "frequent".  Plus, as a non-elected regulatory agency, they have no legal authority to make any law defining it.  Therefore they can only use intimidation as a weapon, and if they do so, they can be held liable for damages and legal fees when they are taken to court again and lose once again.

[Marion]

Which was a problem under the Obama era administration, where the law was used as a weapon against citizens.  Any actual business, even car parts, selling firearms, cannot contest the "being in the business" part of the law, because they use business cash to buy and sell.  But a hobbyist who is a private citizen can.  Since the change under Trump, they have failed to make any legal case when challenged, that would define "frequent".  Plus, as a non-elected regulatory agency, they have no legal authority to make any law defining it.  Therefore they can only use intimidation as a weapon, and if they do so, they can be held liable for damages and legal fees when they are taken to court again and lose once again.

Hey you do you. I'm just stating what the law is. Now that doesn't mean if you have a few guns you are looking to sell that you can't. But to buy with the intent of turning them around to sell would/could be considered in the business

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[Five Seasons]

18 minutes ago, The Jerkman said:

If it is a frequent thing that one is doing that would be considered by the Apple Turkey Feathers to be "in the business" of buying and selling

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it's also the whole "gun show" loophole. You meet this guy in the parking lot and sell him your gun for more than the FFL and he's a convicted felon and uses it that night to rob a gas station and kills the clerk in the process. 

[Marion]

it's also the whole "gun show" loophole. You meet this guy in the parking lot and sell him your gun for more than the FFL and he's a convicted felon and uses it that night to rob a gas station and kills the clerk in the process. 

Now you're being ridiculous.

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[Rattler]

4 hours ago, Belo said:

it's also the whole "gun show" loophole. You meet this guy in the parking lot and sell him your gun for more than the FFL and he's a convicted felon and uses it that night to rob a gas station and kills the clerk in the process. 

There is no "gun show loophole".  All sales of firearms are required to go through an FFL in NY these days.  What you have described is not a "loophole", it's a felony.

Same goes for you buying from someone in the parking lot without going through an FFL.

 

[Five Seasons]

12 hours ago, Rattler said:

  All sales of firearms are required to go through an FFL in NY these days. 

 

yes. these days. In NY.

[Five Seasons]

16 hours ago, The Jerkman said:

Now you're being ridiculous.

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how so? Because I'm a gun owner with an unpopular opinion regarding a gun law? Because all legal gun owners scream that it's not them who are contributing to this countries gun problem yet will do nothing to try and stop criminals from possessing them?

Edited February 1, 2019 by Belo

[Marion]

how so? Because I'm a gun owner with an unpopular opinion regarding a gun law? Because all legal gun owners scream that it's not them who are contributing to this countries gun problem yet will do nothing to try and stop criminals from possessing them?

You're trying to say that gangbangers and other scumbags are going to a gunshow and using a so called loophole. Let me tell you. I'm fairly certain that there are next to zero guns sold at any gunshows with the serials filed off. Check the FBI stats. Less than 2 percent of any illegal guns come from a so called gunshow loophole. All you're doing is proving further your FUDDINESS.

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[Reb]

On 1/30/2019 at 10:38 AM, grampy said:

I have more than I use. I'll let my grandson sort em out one day.

That's how I am,I have way more than I need and have several that I have not shot in years but my son is young and is just getting into shooting now.  I figure he or my daughter can have them down the road and maybe pass them on to their kids some day,even though I may not shoot them I keep them all in excellent condition.