Sporterize or not

[sbuff]

Been thinking of getting a stock upgrade for either my mauser or Enfield.  Neither has matching numbers or anything  ,both just plain old war rifle pieces. Both are accurate 

I go back and forth but Hogue sure has some nice mauser stocks

[Pygmy]

With a Mauser, if the  bolt and reciever numbers match, the value increases....Not as much as totally matching numbers, but still valuable...I have a  1938 Oberndorf  K98K  and all numbers match except the stock ( issue, not aftermarket) rear sight and forward barrel band..I consider it valuable enough NOT to sporterize.. Consider the fact that they are not making any more of them...I can remember the day when you could buy a shooter M-1 Garand for $300 or less... What is the least you could buy a functional one for today  ??

What is your Enfield ?...

[sbuff]

I paid 99 for each back in 1989. Mauser is a yugo k98 the  enfield is a 4. 

Prices on all guns are out of control in today's market .

I go back and forth . I always wanted to harvest a deer with either. Both are like carrying 2x4s in the woods now .

[Pygmy]

The Yugo is of course, not as valuable as the  German K98K....Still a solid rifle..I have one that is all matching and I don't believe it was ever issued...Basically just some slight handling marks...

I don't want to influence you...Just the action on the Mauser might be worth a few hundred dollars, bu....t it is probably a better candidate for sporterizing than the # 4 Enfield... Good luck, My Friend.....

 

[sbuff]

Well from what I know its a German mauser with predutz 44 stamped k98, taken and re worked by Yugoslavia?  I could be wrong . I can check markings in morning. 

Choices choices 

[cas]

Zero reason to do it anymore, especially today when we live in a world of basically dirt cheap, accurate, reliable rifles from several manufacturers. They aren't making any more surplus Enfield's or Mauser's and they will never be worth less than they are right now...  unless you spend a couple hundred bucks to make them worth a couple hundred bucks less. 

(that don't make sense, ya know spending $250 to make a $500 worth $225. What you're losing is about what a Ruger America, or Savage Axis, Howa Hogue, T/C  Compass, Icon or Venture costs)

 

Edited December 28, 2020 by cas

[wildcat junkie]

14 hours ago, sbuff said:

Been thinking of getting a stock upgrade for either my mauser or Enfield.  Neither has matching numbers or anything  ,both just plain old war rifle pieces. Both are accurate 

I go back and forth but Hogue sure has some nice mauser stocks

IMO, the Enfield is not a good candidate but the M98 Mauser certainly is. Here are 2 of mine.

You can safely load the 8X57 up to '06 pressure levels as the Europeans do and it will generate more ME than 30-06 factory loads. 200 gr bullets are the best compromise of MV and retained energy/flat trajectory down range.

 

The load below, sighted in 2 3/4" high at 100 yards is zeroed about 240 yards and 3" low around 275 yards, depending on how high the scope is mounted above the bore axis. That is from a military barrel BTW

 

Very effective on large Northern Whitetails.

Edited December 28, 2020 by wildcat junkie

[Daveboone]

Hey Buff...How was the hunting season?

My main hunting rifle is a 1933 vintage Oberndorf Mauser wearing its original 8x57 bbl. It was my dads lightly sporterized rifle, and I over a period of years completed it. Truly it was a labor of love and not economics....as already well known, you can easily buy a very accurate modern rifle for a fraction of what (I did) it takes to make a battle worthy 98 a practical performing rifle.  that said, there is nothing like a quality 98 build. Last I read there were something like over 10o million 98s built in different configurations. They are not rare and doubtful they ever will be, and other than being a very aged closet queen in my opinion there is nothing wrong with taking your rifle and doing what you would like. I actually have two. One is brought pretty much up to a modern rifles standards, the other I purposely built with 1050s era upgrades to be just what our dads would have built and hunted with. You are local...If you would like I am happy to introduce you to them..

[Daveboone]

Here are a couple critters from the last few years taken with the Mauser. My 2018 buck and 2015 moose from Newfoundland...both one shot, moose at 185 yards. Same bullet, Sierra 175 gr.spitzer. A whole buncha NY deer along with that one.

[jperch]

I used to work in the sporting goods department in Woolworth's in Greece, NY back in the early to mid seventies.  We got crates full of Mausers that we sold for CHEAP.  I bought one, don't know what happened to it.  I remember they were packed full of thick grease and wrapped in heavy brown wax paper.  I think I paid about thirty bucks.  We actually sold a lot of good quality firearms along with some very low end firearms.   If you bought a good gun we usually threw in a box of ammunition.  I remember some pretty crazy interactions with customers.

[sbuff]

Good to hear from ya, I did score a nice large 4pt. I will email 

I just confirmed the top of the barrel is stamped K98 German 8mm then another scribe underneath. 

What kind of stock is that DB ,if I were going to do it I wanted light as possible.  I see stocks from 150 and up, what other cost am I looking in with just a barrel drop in. I like open sights do wouldn't need a mount right away but may at some point . 

It is a tack driver with hornady and Remington 8mm loads .

 

[Pygmy]

I have had the the pleasure to FONDLE  Wildcat's Mauser sporters, and they are indeed wonderful works of art that I drooled over...Genuine rifle porn....

I also hunted moose in NF with a Canadian gent who had a VERY nicely done sporter  done on a  #4 Enfield.. He got the biggest bull of the trip with it...

However, I will present my opinion, and keep in mind it is only my opinion  and therefore isn't worth more than two bucks....

If I had an UNALTERED  historical military rifle, I would not sporterize it, because  as was said before, they are not making any more and they will only increase in value..... If the rifle has been previously altered,  have at it...

At no time in the past have there ever been so many bug hole accurate, affordably priced rifle models available....

This is coming from a person who loves oil finished walnut and deep luster blued steel......

 

 

 

[Daveboone]

52 minutes ago, sbuff said:

Good to hear from ya, I did score a nice large 4pt. I will email 

I just confirmed the top of the barrel is stamped K98 German 8mm then another scribe underneath. 

What kind of stock is that DB ,if I were going to do it I wanted light as possible.  I see stocks from 150 and up, what other cost am I looking in with just a barrel drop in. I like open sights do wouldn't need a mount right away but may at some point . 

It is a tack driver with hornady and Remington 8mm loads .

 

Yo. I think it is a Hogue. I found it used on line and only paid eighty some odd bucks for it. My rifle in its original configuration as Dad did it, with a Herters birdseye maple monte carlo style stock, weighed over twelve pounds!!! Several times I redid it, eventually getting the weight down to the 9 lb range with scope and mount. I was able to shave some metal here and there, and found an aftermarket alloy trigger/magazine with a push button release. Putting it all together with the Hogue stock, Leupold scope mounts and scope I am about 7 1/2 lbs. I dont mind carrying it at all! Admittedly, both my Mausers were somewhat altered (but all had matching numbers throughout) when I got them, but I am keeping them true to what the previous owners intended. Sure you can find more modern/lighter/whatever rifles out there for a song nowadays, but none can arguably do the job better, or with more...panache.

[wildcat junkie]

1 hour ago, Daveboone said:

Here are a couple critters from the last few years taken with the Mauser. My 2018 buck and 2015 moose from Newfoundland...both one shot, moose at 185 yards. Same bullet, Sierra 175 gr.spitzer. A whole buncha NY deer along with that one.

I'm glad to see you went the extra mile to install a 3-position Model 70 type safety. IMO that elevates a Mauser from "sporterized" to "custom" when the rest of the rifle has been well done.

[sbuff]

Does anything stop me from just removing barrel and action and just placing in a new stock or am I missing something 

[Pygmy]

20 minutes ago, sbuff said:

Does anything stop me from just removing barrel and action and just placing in a new stock or am I missing something 

Not that I am aware of.....

[wildcat junkie]

57 minutes ago, Pygmy said:

I have had the the pleasure to FONDLE  Wildcat's Mauser sporters, and they are indeed wonderful works of art that I drooled over...Genuine rifle porn....

 

However, I will present my opinion, and keep in mind it is only my opinion  and therefore isn't worth more than two bucks....

If I had an UNALTERED  historical military rifle, I would not sporterize it, because  as was said before, they are not making any more and they will only increase in value..... If the rifle has been previously altered,  have at it...

At no time in the past have there ever been so many bug hole accurate, affordably priced rifle models available....

This is coming from a person who loves oil finished walnut and deep luster blued steel......

 

 

 

Interesting that you should mention that. My Oberndorf  Custom 8X57IS was built from a commercial version of the M48 YUGO LR intermediate M98 action, but I still consider it a "sporterized" Mauser due to  the fact that it has a Military barrel.

 

The other rifle however was built from an unaltered "duffel cut" J. P Sauer and Sone M98K circa 1943. The story behind it is a bit lengthy, but worth telling non the less.

When I was about 15 years old and living in the South Suburbs of Chicago in the mid '60s, we had a neighbor gentleman (Pat) that had immigrated from Ireland some time after WWII. He and his wife Alice had no children. They were quiet folks that kept mostly to themselves, but since they lived directly across the street from us, my parents struck up a casual friendship with them.

Shortly after Pat had died, Alice brought over a nearly pristine M98K rifle and gave it to me saying that Pat had wanted me to have it. Living in the suburbs as I did, the rifle got fondled and cleaned, but was never fired while we lived there. A few years later we moved to Pennsylvania so it didn't take me long to get some anemic US spec 8X57 ammo and try it out. 

To my chagrin, the short section of fore-end between the barrel band and bayonet lug came off from the recoil of the first shot! What a piece of junk I thought. It was a late war version with a stamped steel trigger guard albeit it did have a milled floorplate. The otherwise unaltered military stock was removed and later lost. I bought one of the cheap Fajen drop-in stocks that were alliable at most every feed and country store in that locale in the late '60s. I think I bought it at a hardware store, probably in Irwin.

Even though I lost track of the military stock, the all numbers matching action remained unmolested until after I moved to NY state. In the year 2000 I decided to "sporterize the action. The barrel was turned down, rear bridge contoured, bolt handle cut of and replaced, drilled and tapped for scope bases, 3-postion safety fitted and all set into the stock it wears now.

 It was only some years after all that carnage that I realized why the fore-end piece was a separate chuck of wood from the rest of the stock. It turns out that Pat had most likely picked up that Mauser on some European battlefield and reverted to making a DUFFEL CUT in order to ship it home. Imagine the remorse I felt when that revelation reared its ugly head!  

https://www.forgottenweapons.com/what-is-a-duffel-cut/

Edited December 29, 2020 by wildcat junkie

[wildcat junkie]

30 minutes ago, sbuff said:

Does anything stop me from just removing barrel and action and just placing in a new stock or am I missing something 

The military sights are horrible. You can install a Receiver sight, but if you want optics you will need to have the rear bridge of the receiver ground down and then drill and tap for scope bases.  The bolt handle will also need to be altered to clear the eyepiece and a low swing safety must be installed.

[Pygmy]

5 minutes ago, wildcat junkie said:

The military sights are horrible. You can install a Receiver sight, but if you want optics you will need to have the rear bridge of the receiver ground down and then drill and tap for scope bases.  The bolt handle will also need to be altered to clear the eyepiece and a low swing safety must be installed.

When  the OP  asked about just seating  the barreled action in a sporter stock with no further alterations, I assumed he was prepared to function with the  crappy sights, issue safety and horrible trigger... He says the rifle is very accurate as is, so probably he would be happy as a clam to have the same rifle with a lighter and less bulky stock....More power to him...

[wildcat junkie]

1 minute ago, Pygmy said:

When  the OP  asked about just seating  the barreled action in a sporter stock with no further alterations, I assumed he was prepared to function with the  crappy sights, issue safety and horrible trigger... He says the rifle is very accurate as is, so probably he would be happy as a clam to have the same rifle with a lighter and less bulky stock....More power to him...

I hope he has better eyes than I do.

[sbuff]

14 minutes ago, wildcat junkie said:

The military sights are horrible. You can install a Receiver sight, but if you want optics you will need to have the rear bridge of the receiver ground down and then drill and tap for scope bases.  The bolt handle will also need to be altered to clear the eyepiece and a low swing safety must be installed.

Yes I was aware more work was needed if I wanted a scope . Im pretty good with its stock sites 

[sbuff]

2 minutes ago, Pygmy said:

When  the OP  asked about just seating  the barreled action in a sporter stock with no further alterations, I assumed he was prepared to function with the  crappy sights, issue safety and horrible trigger... He says the rifle is very accurate as is, so probably he would be happy as a clam to have the same rifle with a lighter and less bulky stock....More power to him...

That was my goal should I go that route 

[Pygmy]

Just now, sbuff said:

That was my goal should I go that route 

Good luck, My Friend....I was not criticizing, but only discussing...  Enjoy your rifle, whatever route you take...

[Pygmy]

5 minutes ago, wildcat junkie said:

I hope he has better eyes than I do.

Dan, probably about everybody in the world has better eyes than you and I do...Hehehehe...

I can still remember when I had VERY good eyes, but that was back when Moby Dick was a minnow..

Edited December 29, 2020 by Pygmy

[wildcat junkie]

Just now, sbuff said:

Yes I was aware more work was needed if I wanted a scope . Im pretty good with its stock sites 

Try to find some Sellier & Bellot 8X57. Cabela's was selling it a few years ago. It has a 196gr bullet @ 2600 fps compared to 170gr @ 2250 of the US spec.