Why post political stuff?

[phantom]

37 minutes ago, Belo said:

Pretty demeaning of you to assume that a personal opinion or belief is more often rooted in feelings and not in science, experience or research. While I don't disagree that this does happen, I get the impression that you believe those who feel differently than you on a subject are just ignorant, lazy and wrong.

Fact of the matter is most of the divisive issues we have in this country ranging from border control, corporate taxes, health care, minimum wage, abortion, social welfare, gun rights, so on and so on are very, very complicated issues. There really isn't a whole lot of clear cut right or wrong. The issue that are clear have been acted on already.

Generally speaking both parties want what's best for this country, we just disagree on how to get there. There was a time that this was understood in Washington and I'm afraid that seems to no longer be the case, as was seen by the witch hunts the last few years and delaying the stimulus till after the election. Also it appears that lately it's more common that a politician is concerned with their own self interests vs that of the country and its people... often forgetting that they are servants for us, not the other way around.

I hope you are right at times it seems like are political class is just looking to sell out this country to the highest bidder . 

   

[virgil]

Politicians today care about power, nothing else.  They make strategic decisions about what positions are most likely to get them elected or keep them in office.  Ethics, morality, concern for constituents be damned.  Look at all the recent examples of elected officials declaring a candidate to be completely unfit, corrupt, dangerous, etc; only to completely change course once it becomes politically prudent for them.

[Northcountryman]

1 hour ago, Belo said:

It still amazes me how many of you don't support pro-environmental legislation just because it's pushed by a group that you disagree with on many other topics.

I wish more of us (not just this group, but this country) wasn't so afraid to cross "party lines". You can be republican and still believe in global warming and want us to take actions to curb it. You can be a democrat and support the 2A. You can still be republican and believe that covid is real and that masks were needed. You can still be a democrat and support the science that at this point in time masks are no longer needed and kids need to go back to school. You can support trump and wish he'd never have joined twitter. You can support biden and acknowledge he doesn't appear to be driving the ship.

think for your damn self

Who doesnt support reasonable pro-enviornmental legislation? I think nearly everyone on both sides of the political spectrum does; where they differ is in what constitutes "reasonable" and "prudent". 

Edited May 25, 2021 by Northcountryman

[Northcountryman]

1 hour ago, virgil said:

Extremists always believe that their opinion is based on fact and all others are not.  It allows them to feel superior and to disregard any opposing points of view.

Yes, and it applies to both sides, of course.

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, Belo said:

Pretty demeaning of you to assume that a personal opinion or belief is more often rooted in feelings and not in science, experience or research. While I don't disagree that this does happen, I get the impression that you believe those who feel differently than you on a subject are just ignorant, lazy and wrong.

On the contrary, you are assuming I believe that.  I never discount anyone's opposing opinion unless they cannot back it up in a debate and refute challenges.  If they can't, they are parroting other's beliefs without thinking for themselves.  It's also common for those people to develop disdain for anyone they cannot successfully debate.

[Northcountryman]

1 hour ago, Belo said:

Pretty demeaning of you to assume that a personal opinion or belief is more often rooted in feelings and not in science, experience or research. While I don't disagree that this does happen, I get the impression that you believe those who feel differently than you on a subject are just ignorant, lazy and wrong.

I'm confused- what part of his post (I'm assuming your referring to Grouses when I say this, btw) was demeaning? Not that he cant be-as many are on here- from time-to-time, but where in this particular instance, I'm wondering?  He's just ,very generally, stating that many adopt a point of view based on a preconceived narrative theyve adopted and , rather than search for the truth, instead look for evidence to validate their belief system (At least, thats the way i interpret his comments lol). 

[Grouse]

The fact that Biden is President is evidence that the majority of voters, if the election wasn't stolen, do not think for themselves or do any research.  Had they done so, they would know all that he's doing now was predicted if he won.  Therefore, they either voted for this suffering, or were not well informed about their position.

Edited May 25, 2021 by Grouse

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, virgil said:

Extremists always believe that their opinion is based on fact and all others are not.  It allows them to feel superior and to disregard any opposing points of view.

Exactly how Democrats and leftists act when they stifle free speech and refuse to debate an issue.

[virgil]

17 minutes ago, Grouse said:

Exactly how Democrats and leftists act when they stifle free speech and refuse to debate an issue.

It's absolutely hilarious that you don't see the irony in some of the things that you post.

[Grouse]

And yet you fail to show it to me.  Is it an opinion, or can you refute it with intelligence?  The Henny Youngman one liners are falling flat on this audience.

[ApexerER]

I can see @Belo point about crossing party lines.  I can say that Bill Clinton did some good things. He also did a lot of bad. I can't think of a single good thing Obama did....IMO.  I also can't really understand how any hard working middle class American could vote for Biden if they understood what they were voting for.  I mean in a little over 100 days, we gave away our energy independence with the stroke of a pen, opened our border and created a humanitarian disaster, Israel is on fire, we had a major US pipeline hacked, Russia is massing troops on the border with Ukraine, Ukraine is threatening to take Crimea back by force. China is threatening Taiwan while also threatening our Navy Ships. N Korea is testing missiles again and restarting their nuclear program. The price of everyday goods is skyrocketing along with gasoline. Our president that promised transparency has someone telling him he can't answer reporters questions. Border Patrol has a gag order about speaking to the press about how bad the border is and all of this was knowingly in the forcast with a Biden presidency. 

This doesn't even bring up the fact that our cities are burning, our police are demoralized and cancel culture got a green light too keep on moving forward. 

It just boggles my mind that this is what people wanted......

Now all that being said......I can admit that Trump was a dum@ss who couldn't keep his dang mouth shut. But to say he didn't do some fantastic things for this country is absurd......

[wolc123]

35 minutes ago, ApexerER said:

I can see @Belo point about crossing party lines.  I can say that Bill Clinton did some good things. He also did a lot of bad. I can't think of a single good thing Obama did....IMO.  I also can't really understand how any hard working middle class American could vote for Biden if they understood what they were voting for.  I mean in a little over 100 days, we gave away our energy independence with the stroke of a pen, opened our border and created a humanitarian disaster, Israel is on fire, we had a major US pipeline hacked, Russia is massing troops on the border with Ukraine, Ukraine is threatening to take Crimea back by force. China is threatening Taiwan while also threatening our Navy Ships. N Korea is testing missiles again and restarting their nuclear program. The price of everyday goods is skyrocketing along with gasoline. Our president that promised transparency has someone telling him he can't answer reporters questions. Border Patrol has a gag order about speaking to the press about how bad the border is and all of this was knowingly in the forcast with a Biden presidency. 

This doesn't even bring up the fact that our cities are burning, our police are demoralized and cancel culture got a green light too keep on moving forward. 

It just boggles my mind that this is what people wanted......

Now all that being said......I can admit that Trump was a dum@ss who couldn't keep his dang mouth shut. But to say he didn't do some fantastic things for this country is absurd......

And yet there is at least one here (vh) who seems content with the way things are now.

[ApexerER]

14 minutes ago, wolc123 said:

And yet there is at least one here (vh) who seems content with the way things are now.

There is more than 1 and it blows my mind...!!!

[Versatile_Hunter]

1 hour ago, wolc123 said:

And yet there is at least one here (vh) who seems content with the way things are now.

It's an upgrade from how things were.

[Five Seasons]

4 hours ago, Northcountryman said:

Who doesnt support reasonable pro-enviornmental legislation? I think nearly everyone on both sides of the political spectrum does; where they differ is in what constitutes "reasonable" and "prudent". 

exactly... although the idea that many republicans want to roll back a lot of the CWA and CAA (put in place by a republican btw) or to sell federal lands to the states and allow them to sell it off to private parties, or denying that global warming is real (trump) starts to blur those lines.

We can all agree that going carbon neutral is good for the planet and disagree on how we get there... that's fine. But when someone tells me everything is fine with the globe and the tons of plastic in our oceans, melting glaciers, dams that have impacted salmon spawning, pebble mine which could wipe salmon out completely etc etc... those are non starters. 

[Five Seasons]

4 hours ago, Northcountryman said:

I'm confused- what part of his post (I'm assuming your referring to Grouses when I say this, btw) was demeaning? Not that he cant be-as many are on here- from time-to-time, but where in this particular instance, I'm wondering?  He's just ,very generally, stating that many adopt a point of view based on a preconceived narrative theyve adopted and , rather than search for the truth, instead look for evidence to validate their belief system (At least, thats the way i interpret his comments lol). 

His very long posting history makes it pretty clear. It didn't need to be in this particular post. I think even Grouse would admit to being pretty far right.

[Five Seasons]

3 hours ago, ApexerER said:

I can see @Belo point about crossing party lines.  I can say that Bill Clinton did some good things. He also did a lot of bad. I can't think of a single good thing Obama did....IMO.  I also can't really understand how any hard working middle class American could vote for Biden if they understood what they were voting for.  I mean in a little over 100 days, we gave away our energy independence with the stroke of a pen, opened our border and created a humanitarian disaster, Israel is on fire, we had a major US pipeline hacked, Russia is massing troops on the border with Ukraine, Ukraine is threatening to take Crimea back by force. China is threatening Taiwan while also threatening our Navy Ships. N Korea is testing missiles again and restarting their nuclear program. The price of everyday goods is skyrocketing along with gasoline. Our president that promised transparency has someone telling him he can't answer reporters questions. Border Patrol has a gag order about speaking to the press about how bad the border is and all of this was knowingly in the forcast with a Biden presidency. 

This doesn't even bring up the fact that our cities are burning, our police are demoralized and cancel culture got a green light too keep on moving forward. 

It just boggles my mind that this is what people wanted......

Now all that being said......I can admit that Trump was a dum@ss who couldn't keep his dang mouth shut. But to say he didn't do some fantastic things for this country is absurd......

America likes its reality tv. They love the Obama family and image. He was well spoken and gosh darn it just the right shade of black haha. The suburban white guilt loved casting that vote. What a class act they were (honestly no objection here). But what did he really do? Not much. Although I do think obama care ended up not being the end of the world...

Then we have trump. Rude, crude, crass, ignorant, a liar and grab em by the pussy. But he got shit done didn't he? It's amazing too that many trump supporters, not all, but most all agree on one thing. If he could have kept his damn mouth shut. Yet, the one thing he couldn't do was just that. So here comes old sleepy joe. Yeah he's not really all there, yeah he sniffs hair, but he doesn't tweet mean things and promised (not delivering) to unite the country. 

It appears that american's would rather keep politics boring and status quo then to rock the boat and that's how they voted. The election wasn't stolen, but how much did MSM influence it is a welcome debate.

[Northcountryman]

1 hour ago, Belo said:

exactly... although the idea that many republicans want to roll back a lot of the CWA and CAA (put in place by a republican btw) or to sell federal lands to the states and allow them to sell it off to private parties, or denying that global warming is real (trump) starts to blur those lines.

We can all agree that going carbon neutral is good for the planet and disagree on how we get there... that's fine. But when someone tells me everything is fine with the globe and the tons of plastic in our oceans, melting glaciers, dams that have impacted salmon spawning, pebble mine which could wipe salmon out completely etc etc... those are non starters. 

Going carbon neutral will not solve the problem I’m afraid , because no matter what energy source is relied upon , their will be inexorable environmental issues associated with it. Solar and wind are inexhaustible but grossly in adequate; moreover , they’re are aesthetic issues with wind that I’m sure you’re aware of. Going carbon neutral is a noble objective , but must be reached gradually and without deleteriously impacting the economy . 
And trust me , even republicans want clean air and clean water ; I believe they just object to environmental regs being used as a cudgel ( at times ) to impede  Devpt and improvement in cases where it’s warranted , and perhaps , vital. 

[phantom]

1 hour ago, Belo said:

America likes its reality tv. They love the Obama family and image. He was well spoken and gosh darn it just the right shade of black haha. The suburban white guilt loved casting that vote. What a class act they were (honestly no objection here). But what did he really do? Not much. Although I do think obama care ended up not being the end of the world...

Then we have trump. Rude, crude, crass, ignorant, a liar and grab em by the pussy. But he got shit done didn't he? It's amazing too that many trump supporters, not all, but most all agree on one thing. If he could have kept his damn mouth shut. Yet, the one thing he couldn't do was just that. So here comes old sleepy joe. Yeah he's not really all there, yeah he sniffs hair, but he doesn't tweet mean things and promised (not delivering) to unite the country. 

It appears that american's would rather keep politics boring and status quo then to rock the boat and that's how they voted. The election wasn't stolen, but how much did MSM influence it is a welcome debate.

Many Americans now only get there news  from the internet, one study I saw said a company like google can easily change about 10 million votes by what news they put in from of unsuspecting  internet users . I know on my phone and computer 9 out of 10 times bad news about trump shows  up first before  any thing bad about biden if it ever shows up at all. They need to break up these big tech monopolies if they are going to play games  like that .

 

[Northcountryman]

1 hour ago, Belo said:

His very long posting history makes it pretty clear. It didn't need to be in this particular post. I think even Grouse would admit to being pretty far right.

Perhaps , but Being pretty far right And specifically calling him out for a demeaning post that you now admit was not demeaning are separate issues aren’t they? 

[Northcountryman]

1 hour ago, Belo said:

. The election wasn't stolen, but how much did MSM influence it is a welcome debat

Some would disagree with that assertion . 

[Versatile_Hunter]

27 minutes ago, Northcountryman said:

Some would disagree with that assertion . 

F&%k them. Not all opinions are informed or worthy of consideration. Should we too give credence to folks who believe in Sasquatch or who think the moon landing was staged? Uninformed opinions shouldn't be elevated. That is one mistake the media made.

[Northcountryman]

24 minutes ago, Versatile_Hunter said:

F&%k them. Not all opinions are informed or worthy of consideration. Should we too give credence to folks who believe in Sasquatch or who think the moon landing was staged? Uninformed opinions shouldn't be elevated. That is one mistake the media made.

Well , Thisis one that is IMHO . If it turns out to be proved - beyond a reasonable doubt - that I’m wrong, I will freely admit it publicly , but until then , I believe that there was significant election fraud . Enough to cause the election to swing entirely the other way? Perhaps not , but that remains to be seen as you don’t know that it’s false anymore than we do that it is true- is that a fair statement ? And for the record : I do not believe In Bigfoot or that the moon landing was staged lol. 

[Versatile_Hunter]

3 minutes ago, Northcountryman said:

Well , Thisis one that is IMHO . If it turns out to be proved - beyond a reasonable doubt - that I’m wrong, I will freely admit it publicly 

Ref to Sasquatch?

[Northcountryman]

2 minutes ago, Versatile_Hunter said:

Ref to Sasquatch?

Election fraud/ stolen