steve863

Sorry for not being politically correct. I guess he was just misguided liberal. I worked at ground zero and I can't forget who were responsible and why we just don't call them out. But we don't want to hurt anyone feelings. Get real!!!! Only one group was responsible and you can't twist the facts, civil discussion or not.Dave I am curious as to your solution? How should we call them out? What else do we do? We already went to war in Iraq and Afghanistan because of 9/11. Was everyone in the Islamic faith responsible for 9/11? Not putting words in anyone's mouth like I have been accused, just hope for some honest explanations here.

I didn't put any words in your mouth. You said young people are impressionable. So what else is new? We all know that they are. The best anyone can do is to teach kids strong values at home and hopefully they won't be swayed by others. We can't lock them up in closets so they only know what WE want them to know. In life you live and you learn along the way. Blaming others for everything is supposed to be a liberal tactic, yet you conservatives seem to be masters at it also.

Maybe you guys should then propose a law where one needs to be at least 40 years old to attend college. Hopefully by that time they will no longer be impressionable and you closed minded ones can rule!

Knowledge and education has always been dominated by the more open minded. This is nothing new.

No you accepted the BS long before you knew the reality... the reality is the original concept is still a good concept.. the new QDM plan has nothing to do with and is not deer management it is hunter management. Thanks for reaffirming that it indeed has nothing to do with deer management, and if it's hunter management to you, you then need to turn in the "freedom" card you like to wave, since you are taking away the rights of others who are not as stuck up on big antlered deer like you are. Deer population control is why we are issued hunting licenses in the first place, and population control has NOTHING to do with antler size in any shape or form.

Well, I don't think I was ever asked what party I was a member of for any job I ever took. I doubt college professors are asked directly either. What difference would that make for most subjects taught? Maybe if more staunch conservatives could actually get advanced degrees and the other qualifications to teach at the university level, they would get hired also! LOL

I am glad you are finally starting to realize this. Hopefully more hunters will come to this realization also. All one has to do is look at it all from all the different perspectives. Maybe one day you will realize that just about everything involved around QDM was made up to benefit the hunter way more than it will benefit the deer. QDM theories were the brainchild of biologists that were paid by hunters to come up with some new ideas, so with all honesty who would one think that would be benefitting most from it?? Shouldn't take anyone too long to figure it out, really. You're the exact type person that I'm talking about... close minded and basing your opinion on what you think you know about how and why the QDM concept came about... what has become of it and what it started out as are two separate things... and I'm nearly positive you didn't even know what it was 17 years ago. Hahaha! So after 17 years you are finally realizing that most people are using QDM for their own hunting benefits and then you are calling me closed minded? I separated the BS from the reality long ago. Too bad you still haven't figured it all out.

Are you kidding me Steve?.. how do you think every nation in the world was created? Someone came in and killed everyone and took over their piece of land... the diffence here is that we didn't kill every last native american, we conquered the land like every other society since the beginning of time... yet we allowed the indians to remain here as a soveriegn entity. Thats how it was done in those times.. it was survival of the fittest....somehow we are any different than the british, the Romans, mongolia? People need to get off this poor native american crap... if we did it like every other society before us.. there would be NO native americans. Sure, there was barbarism since the beginning of time. The BIG difference is that other nations don't go around touting FREEDOM like we do. We go telling everyone about how free we are and think everyone else should be the same, but never acknowledge what we done to others to get these great freedoms. I don't hear the other countries proclaiming themselves to be as great as this country likes to tell everyone. A little modesty can go a long way. Hypocrisy is easily identifiable.

Yeah, you probably won't see it in print, since the magazines and TV shows will never show the jealousy and greed that can be involved in this game. I guess it would be bad for business? LOL Everything is sugar coated in the hunting world, like it is just about everywhere else these days.

"As far as your theory about the NRA seeking profits, the NRA is a non-profit group. People who work for non-profits forgo higher salaries for the less tangible benefits offered by public advocacy" As someone who once worked for a non-profit organization I second the motion to call the above paragraph BS! Many of the hardcore NRA members have a hard time understanding that the reason only 5% of gun owners are members is because the other 95% don't exactly buy into all their crap like the brainwashed 5% do. Of course the 5% will come back with all sorts of accusations like the others are too cheap and they are left carrying all the weight and all the typical baloney. The proof is in the numbers boys. If more people bought into what the NRA touts, they would have way more members. The membership fees would not be an issue, when most people pay more per month for cable TV. The reality is that most gun owners don't see a problem with some restrictions on certain firearms in today's world, thus are not in agreement with what the NRA want every gun owner to believe. Quite simple to understand if you only look at it objectively.

Even Barry Goldwater who you quote here toned down the nonsense that he spewed in his later years. Hopefully you will one day also.

Just the type of answer I would expect from you patriots. I am as guilty as anyone else living in this country for the plight of these people. I however don't tout all of America's great virtues without acknowledging this very sad fact in our nations past. Holding ones freedoms to such a degree is nothing short of hypocrisy if we don't give a rats ass about the freedoms we took away from others to get it.

I am glad you are finally starting to realize this. Hopefully more hunters will come to this realization also. All one has to do is look at it all from all the different perspectives. Maybe one day you will realize that just about everything involved around QDM was made up to benefit the hunter way more than it will benefit the deer. QDM theories were the brainchild of biologists that were paid by hunters to come up with some new ideas, so with all honesty who would one think that would be benefitting most from it?? Shouldn't take anyone too long to figure it out, really.

Why should this attitude surprise anyone in todays hunting world? People put out cameras, food plots, feeders, the works. They do this stuff to try to keep the animals on their land and after a while they start thinking the deer are their own.

I just love all these patriots who talk against Islam, illegals, globalism, and keep touting America's virtues while they don't take even a minute to think and acknowledge the freedoms that were taken away from the natives who were here before us. Our freedom came at a huge price to those people. Of course these great American patriots can't begin to man up to any of this!

Yes, I did say that I would leave it be with the kid and that's exactly what I did with him. The rest of you aren't so lucky, however.

I'm taking my disagreement with you personally? I questioned someone about calling Nugent "great" and then you had a problem with me asking the question. We obviously know what camp you are in. If someone has the right to call Nugent "great", others have the right to call him an idiot. Since you can't seem to figure it out for yourself, the reason Nugent irks some of us is because he is exactly what we don't need hunters portrayed as. Why don't you show up to work like he does at his concerts swinging an AR-15 around and babbling incoherently and tell us what those around you, especially people unfamiliar with firearms will think of you. Good luck!

Or ......... do a 20 man march . That is quite funny actually! With a little trick photography they can make it look like there was a mass of humanity there in support.

Very interesting read. The sentence below stood out most of all for me. 5. Behave in a way that will bring no dishonor to either the hunter, the hunted, or the environment. If we look and act like we are one step below barbarians, society will most likely consider us such. Very simple really and it shouldn't be very difficult to understand this. Some will no doubt be against us no matter what, but for the many more who really don't have a good opinion, to them we should always strive to present ourselves in the best light possible.

Tough $#!+!. If you don't like what I write, then don't read it. Yes, I dislike Nugent and am always curious of the reasons why others think he is the greatest thing since sliced bread. By the way, if you think I hate Nugent, you don't want to know what I think of you! LOL

Oh, and if you guys think too much was made of Nugent here and not enough on the contents of the essay, here goes. I would grade this paper a C. Would have been a B, but of course the full grade deduction applies because of the unnecessary Nugent accolades. The other major flaw it has is when he says. Blood sweat and sometimes tears go into the hunt. Emotional and physical abuse goes into every part of the hunt. I don't think too many people will buy this line. Either you want to hunt or you don't. If there are any hardships in hunting, one sucks it up or else they can buy porkloin at BJ's for $1.99 per pound instead. No big deal really. Hunters are not supermen, and it isn't rocket science to kill a deer. I also don't think it was a good idea to mix the gun issue with hunting. They are two different issues with two very different approaches in my opinion. [/size]

What does Al Capone or Bernie Madoff have to do with anything here? He did a paper on hunting and shooting and decided to post it here. A few of us take issue with Nugent even being considered a good representative of hunters/shooters, never mind being called "great". If he quoted most anyone else I am sure you would not have seen the uproar you saw here. You say you are grateful that Nugent puts himself in front of the loons, but tell me why we need a loon of our own to combat the other loons?? I myself would like us to take a higher road and not use tactics fit for the gutter. I am obviously asking too much of my fellow hunters and shooters it seems, and that does not make me feel confident about our future one bloody bit. If you boys have your hunting and gun rights taken away in the future, don't tell us that some of us didn't warn you. Act the way Nugent acts at your school, job, whatever, and just see where it will get you.

He can keep his lifestyle and I will keep mine. I have no problems being no one of any significance while he obviously can't seem to get enough of himself. The sad part is that in the eyes of many he is making himself out to represent me, which in NO way, shape or form does he.

Yeah right. Maybe YOU are the one that gets jealous since you can't hunt in an expensive enclosure, but don't think some of us others here are. Our dislike of hunting behind fences has NOTHING to do with jealousy. I have more respect for someone shooting the smallest deer walking than anyone shooting anything behind a fence.

+1 I knew I could count on you to point this out, Doe. I really don't watch many hunting shows, but I did see a few of Nugents and I don't think I've ever seen him hunt whitetails other than behind a fence. Man, the deer he hunts even have ear tags on them! So the moral here is that you should get good grades in school, starting with this essay, go to college, make something of yourself and you could become rich enough and kill the same type of trophies he does!