mt624

He said (copy and pasted from page 2, Bold and underline added for effect by me): That is why I posted the pic. I'm torn when it comes to the 6pt because he's a awesome buck but part of me says "man if he made it through this year..." So I was looking to get opinions from other hunters who might be able to give me some insight to bring to the table when my hunting buddies and I decide what to do. This is a super nice 6 pt but has he reached his maximum growth potential? The idea is to work to have trophy deer (150 Class) on the property. In order to achieve this goal you have to try and take out the bucks which have poor genetic traits for growing big antlers so the big boys can have all the ladies. Also you have to let the 2-3 year olds walk, If a 2-3 year old deer is already 100-120 inches his potential to be a "trophy buck" is very good. If you or anyone else was looking to manage your property in a similar fashion to how we are would this 6pt be a buck you would put on the hit list this year or give him another year to grow? If a buck is under 120 inches and we decide his potential to be a trophy buck isn't there then we as a club will still put him on the hit list even if he is under 120 inches. So age was brought up by the original poster. Thanks. Man you guys are an sensitive bunch!

Phade I'm not looking to pick fights online and guess I should have quoted you so you couldn't keep changing your post. Have fun with that! I know the area he's talking about hunting and the potential is there to bring the age structure up. Something your scenario simply doesn't account for. If the goal of the group is to shoot mature bucks and bring the age structure up like the neighbors who control over a thousand mostly adjacent acres are trying to do, then they may be less likely to shoot bucks that meet the goals early on yes. But if the management plan works they will have better odds with time. And if they actively monitor the age of the deer being taken and don't see results in a few years and aren't having fun they are not required to manage their ground this way. As some have stated on here, their personal goals are simply to shoot a buck every season. That's great, for that guy. There's nothing wrong or not fun if these guys have a different goal. Would you agree?

Yup, you just upped your post count by 1.

Man guys sure know how to get off topic and railroad a simple question. That's why I rarely post on here. Lots of good posts too, just a lot of side tracks in between! My personal feeling is that I would be much happier shooting a 4 year old 6 point or a 5 year old 6 point than a 3 year old 6 point. But if a 3 year old 6 point meets your groups goals and makes someone happy then go for it. Also, knowing a little about your parcel and how a lot of the neighboring ground is managed, I think that is a very realistic age goal for your group. I'm not saying everyone in your immediate group will shoot a 4 year old every season, but I think one guy every year or two is very realistic. Then you guys need to determine on an individual level if that makes you happy. If not, new rules or new group. But if he needs the label "management buck" to justify shooting, then something is wrong.

Sounds like you've educated a few bucks over the years!

Sorry to hear you didn't find it, but at least it sounds like just a graze. One thing I've found that helps is illuminated nocks, they really let you get a better image of where the arrow hits the deer or what the flight path of the arrow is.

Were none of the reasons discussed previously in this topic not good enough? 5.9cummins, I read about the doe with your daughter and felt terrible for your situation and the last thing i want to do is rub salt in your fresh wound, but honestly when I read the 40 yard shot part I thought that was the first problem. Sorry.

IMO hunting shows are getting close to NASCAR. Does television coverage of people sitting in traffic during morning rush hour sell cars? No, but guys racing around a circle at 200mph does. Hunting shows are just a big commercial for the most part now and like the NASCAR mantra that guys racing in circles at 200 mph will sell cars on Monday to everyday drivers (which is proven), hunting shows try to pack in extreme action, shots, etc. It's entertaining but certainly not a real view of hunting in general. Look at "reality" TV and what it's become, I can't get over the number of hunting shows now that are using this model and making hunting competitions of some sort. It's laughable, I don't think anyone got into bowhunting because they thought they could outscore their buddy (in some drummed up category) so they better run out and buy a license. For the record I like NASCAR but I don't make my automotive purchasing decision based on anything related to it. Hunting shows are entertaining and hopefully people realize there are hundreds (if not thousands) of hunts filmed for every one (usually successful) shot that gets aired. And yes, they have tracking dog handlers on speed dial. I can't believe some of the unethical shots they take and air sometimes, but it does probably show that modern equipment does give a slightly larger margin for error in many cases... Good or bad. Doc you've made many great points (along with others) about long distance shots but think about how and where (a computer forum) you're preaching and then maybe you'll understand why you don't get an overwhelmingly similar response to yours. That's not intended as a slam against anyone, but my guess is that forums appeal to a younger (less experienced) audience for one, secondly a more tech type crowd (more adaptable to new technology), and so on. Always exceptions but... Generally if someone agrees with you and everything you say on a forum they aren't going to take the time to post much. But if they disagree, sit back and get ready! There's no hard number to put on an ethical bow shot just like you don't go to the gun shop and buy a 120 yard shotgun instead of a 100 yard shotgun, although the slugs used could easily give you that type of margin in your effective range. There's certainly hard data to show effective ranges for gun/bullet combinations, bow/arrow combinations etc. but with guns the marksmanship of the shooter plays a much larger role in the effective range of a gun shot whereas with a bow, due to the conditions already discussed throughout this topic, marksmanship is less of a factor in the hunting woods when determining an ethical shot range. Plain and simple, but I do agree with 25-30 yards being toward the upper range for an ethical shot at an eastern whitetail due to arrow velocity and the amount of time that passes from release to impact. Funny thing is most people who have never shot a long bow or recurve probably think the cams are all about speed. I thought we started hunting with compounds to allow a longer hold on a deer to take a draw when the deer is looking away or behind cover, then have the ability to hold for a period of time to walk into range, take aim and stop the deer, etc. To me the whole thrill of bowhunting isn't how far away I can shoot an animal, but how close I can be to the animal when I kill it. One other constructive criticism aimed mainly at Doc and WNYBuckHunter with all due respect: Seeing that you guys are listed as monitors, I can only speak from my own very limited experience on here, but when I see you guys go off on each other and start calling each other names or make accusations of smoking things it's a real turn off to me who doesn't know if this is an attempt at humor or a real rift. Here's a good post that I read and decided to register and reply to because it is a great discussion and there were some responses (not yours in particular) that just about made my blood boil. I have only looked on this forum every now and then and am admittedly not a big forum guy. But there's some great information here and the forums are very useful for exchanging ideas and having discussion. But when you as moderators start singling each other out and debating on such levels it really is a turn off to me. And it just makes it harder to weed through the content listed under the topic. My apologies if I'm misreading this, but if nothing else please try to keep on topic...