JFB
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Posts posted by JFB
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If you cant predict where the bullet will hi the deer, then you dont have the skill to take a running shot. Wanna put your money where your mouth is?
Sure! I love a good bet. I've got $200 cash on the table that you can't blow up a 12" balloon and let it go in a swirling stiff wind (or something that simulates a running deer at about 50 yards) and hit it with a slug 8 out of 10 times and you get two slugs per balloon (anything more than that you're just throwing lead and I'll never condone five shot volleys just to hope for a hit somewhere on the deer to "anchor" it). If you can do that, I'd deem you an exceptional (and skillful) running shooter and happily pay the $200 while congratulating you. If not, you pay me $200. If someone can't hit it AT LEAST 8 out of 10 times on a certain shot, they should not be taking that shot because it's low percentage for their ability. So that would certainly allow you to demonstrate your skill and ability to predict hitting your target. Let me know.
And for record, what I was saying is I'd be able to out shoot most while trying to kill running deer if I ever chose to. So if you want that bet instead, we'll walk around the sports section of Wmart and pick out some camo clad hunters and then go unload on some deer to see who hit's more... thats the only way to know if someone can pull off that shot under pressure in the deer woods. We'll have to make sure it's during season to make it "legal" which so many use as the benchmark of whats proper. The other bet simply tests your shooting skill so my money is right there for you.
You live in Lima, I'm not far.
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I just watched the video a second time... even worse than I thought because this guy was shooting at second and third deer before the first one even stopped running away from him. In my opinion, thats a solid definition of a slob regardless of your opinion on running pot shots.
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So you admit you dont have the skill to do it, then try to preach on how you learn to do it? Talking like that on subjects you dont know about just makes you look like a fool.
For being a moderator, you read poorly. I never said I don't have the skill to shoot at or kill running deer. I said I would not be able to predict where my bullet ACTUALLY landed on the deer with any sort of consistency. I'm sure most guys who love shooting running deer will go on and on about how they can hit a bouncing pie plate and avoid hitting a deer in the a$$. I'm also sure all the guys who I see unload on running deer can also skillfully hit right where they aim... they just must choose to miss by a 1-2 feet to make it more sporting for the deer.
I'd bet money I'd be able to kill more running deer than most... I choose not too for the same reason I don't take low percentage bow shots.
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I'm curious as to how many of those that defend this guy for his shot choices because he has the necessary skill level to make these shots are also the same people who criticize people for taking head shots?
I guess it's like basketball. If the guy makes the shot, it's a great highlight reel shot. If he misses, it's like WTF was he thinking?
The dude took 5 shots to dispatch 4 deer. None of the deer I see suffered for more than a few seconds. The 2 that was off screen could not have been running because they were just off of the cameras angle. If they were on a full run, they would have been shot way off from the camera's view. So odds are only the second deer was the only one that was moving. Maybe most of us can't make these kinds of shots but just because we can't doesn't mean he shouldn't because clearly he can.
PS: For the record, Michael Jordan never took a bad shot.
I would indeed criticize a head shot. I'm also not good enough to shoot running deer with any expectation of being able to predict where my bullet will ACTUALLY land.
Let's say this guy is a fantastic shot and just one of those guys who can ethically harvest running deer... my question is how many did he wound to get that good? And don't tell me shooting ducks or rabbit with bird shot enables you to suddenly hit a running deer with a slug and be able to predict where you end up hitting it on a consistent basis. It's like saying you can blow up a balloon in a stiff wind and be able to pop it with a slug from a distance with any consistency? Not.
And the other problem is this... just because Michael Jordan was fantastic... it didn't mean everyone on the team should take the type of shots that he did. But when young hunters see scenes like this, they see it as normal and then they try it... Not many Jordans out there. Lots of wounded deer out there... wonder why.
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The guys who approve just because "it's legal" kind of crack me up. Especially when we all know our fine governing bodies always make such great decisions on what should be legal...
That scene is exactly why I find so many dead deer at the end of each season. Sure, everyone will miss now and again but when you are taking shots like that your chances of just wounding the deer go through the roof. And if you get lucky and kill those deer, you're likely to ruin a certain percentage of meat simply because you choose to aim at a 3 foot random area rather than 12 inches of vitals. My opinion.
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There should be some knowledgable folks who can let you know how it's been lately. I haven't been there in over 5 years but when I was there we caught pike and even some nice bass. Beautiful lake and area... just don't know if it's stayed any good of late.
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I'm not worried just don't want to people looking at me like I'm a bad guy poaching if I was a poacher would i really admit to something Iike and actually choose to share it the world
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I'm not saying you are a poacher and I know nothing of the areas mentioned, but it's happened before where guys get on line and incriminate themselves legitimately. What I do know is that shooting a nice buck and then admitting to a head shot immediately on a second deer like that lends itself to questions for some... especially in conjunction with all the "typos".
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The up sides of a one buck rule seem to far out weigh any down sides. To me, there is nothing wrong with being more sure it's the buck you want to harvest before you take your shot. I've said it before, a little restraint could be used in this state.
If you want to shoot a spike, go for it, but after that you'd be hunting with doe tags . If you hunt a low deer population area, you're probably not likely to be seeing a ton of buck anyway and if it's as depressed as some area's are... it wouldn't seem very logical to kill a second scarce buck if you happen to be so lucky.
And if you hunt in a high population, you could chose your buck and then after that you'd be contributing to the health of the herd by shooting the many doe's that need to be taken. So to me, whether you hunt a high deer population or low deer population a one buck rule sure seems to make sense.
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Thanks for the feedback. For those that voted, what were the top two things listed that you didn't like?
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What's up with the plugged gun? Not that it matters because next year Coomo is going to have us down to single shots and doubles andyway.
It was just something Ohio does and thought it was interesting. I think it's because they believe you don't need to empty five shots in a matter of 3 seconds to get a deer.
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Sorry that smiley face guy was supposed to be an
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Ok I'm bored today...
Purely preposterous but suppose I was just granted the power to set new NY deer season dates and change a few regulations (all noted below). To be able to quickly see if most people like my changes or not, please respond with either a simple YES or NO. Clearly there may be some you like and some you don't but suppose you have to say YES or NO to below compared to what it is currently. (Perhaps on a different thread someone can debate or elaborate on their reason for their vote). So here it goes:
1) Oct 1st bow opener.
2) One buck per season, no matter the weapon.
3) Youth two day gun season starting the Sat/Sun prior to Oct 15th (one buck or one doe)
4) 1st gun season for 10 days starting the Saturday before Thanksgiving
5) A week and half off of gun season
6) One week second gun season
7) One week of ML season immediately following second gun season
Three shot capacity (plug) in gun for riffle or shot gun (similar to Ohio's slug gun) YES or NO?
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I think it's a good idea but maybe the reason it's not in NY has to do with majority of the hunters being weekends warriors...I just feel there are more everyday of the season hunters in other states than here.
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I tend to agree with that. I have nothing to support that type of theory but for whatever reason other states seem to successfully tolerate shorter seasons and other things that nurture the deer resource. In NY, we seem to focus on limiting the resource.
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Rather than one long and continuous deer season, in my opinion it would be cool to give the deer a break much like Illinois does with their second season.
Is there a down side to stoping hunting for a week or two and then starting up again? Might be something the majority of hunters could agree on? Just curious because something we never hear about in NY.
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Be terrible if these things multiplied to great numbers here in NY... they are big eaters.. a big population of them would cause a real problem competing for food with deer and the other animals. With habitat dwindling in parts of NY the whitetails would definitely be affected by that competition.
I agree. If there becomes a large population in NY it could largely hurt the deer population because of the competition for food... combine that with the various species of coyotes that were likely planted and the DEC will be another step closer to depleting (ah, I mean "managing") the deer herd that much further. And like others have said, with such limited DEC resources, are they really gonna go out of their way to eradicate these creatures?
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Can anyone post a link to some of the sock liners you use?
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The 200" deer I was told was taken a good distance heading east of Rochester. I don't want to spread rumors on the actual town and I'm sure this guy has enough pressure on the area already. Congrats to him!
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I'm another that advocates doing what is right for you, at the given time and circumstances of your hunt and hunting area.
However, I do wish more guys would teach and challenge themselves at different levels and to me that does NOT mean shooting every deer you see once you have some seasons under your belt. Just my opinion.
So for me, I pass A LOT of deer. Sometimes I don't fill my archery buck tag but then again I have several P&Y bucks including a few in the 140's and as high as 160" all by bow. By no means bragging, and I make plenty of mistakes, but my point to the original poster is that you won't shoot many mature bucks if you don't learn to pass some young ones. I also shoot my share of doe when the situation warrants. But I certainly don't advocate following the browns it's down crew. Be a trend setter and be the guy to show them what is possible with a little dedication and restraint. Good luck!
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There are many moving parts thats for sure and again hats off to them for making it work. Think about everything they have to juggle and manage... land purchase/lease, farming knowledge/equipment, TV contracts/negotiations, finance/budgets/capital preservation/taxes, hunting knowledge, public appearances and surely many things I've not listed.
Someone mentioned some friends with large bank rolls... that makes sense to me as something that may help them and I hadn't thought of. Seems they are mighty tight with lots of celebrities and if I had Rascal Flats money or Blakes I'd give them a pidly million to have my hunting farm all set up for me when I want it. In return, they film on it. Not a bad deal on both sides and I'd be willing to bet the celeb's accountant is able to use it as a business investment for tax purposes. All very possible and legal.
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Obviously this is a TV show, hunting large un pressured "farms". I'm not asking how they shoot and see such beautiful animals but I'm asking how in the world do they attain these farms and run this operation? Sure, money is the answer but it still would seem very difficult.
For the record, I enjoy watching the show even as unrealistic as it is to us common folk. But I watched a recent episode where they were again "hunting a brand new farm Lee just bought"... Here are my questions/statements:
1) So does he just approach nearby Iowa farms and offer 10x market value because his sponsors will give him the coin? Iowa is not easy to buy good land but yet he just continues to get new farms within driving distance of his original farm?
2) He's basically a full time deer farmer with what appears to be hundreds of thousands of dollars of farm equipment, let alone the land itself. Do you mean to tell me sponsors shell out THAT much money for this show? Equipment from sponsors like an ATV, bows or treestands are one thing but land and huge tractors and buses seem like a new level of support. I remember reading about how he sold everything he had just to move to Iowa and start out with one piece of property. Man, he's expanded. Do you think these lands are actually deeded to him or do the sponsors just buy them?
3) I've heard there is a lot of government money available for "farming" and I wonder what the tax implications/ advantages are? Who writes off what? Sure is big business especially when these types of hunting shows are a dime a dozen and come and go.
Hat's off to you Lee & Tiffany for making it happen!
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Just to add another point, regarding buck/doe ratios, my hunting party and I have seen a pretty good ratio in the section of 3A we hunt. It follows what you would expect. Not too many hunters, pretty good ratio. That said, it is true that overall deer sightings are low. Or very low.
Regarding the initial topic at hand here (Passing on bucks that are under the AR 3 pt rule), it seems to happen to my group every year at least once or twice. We have seen some pretty nice bucks that we had to pass on because we couldnt confirm the 3rd point. We also have an issue in our area with a decent number of the bucks not having brow tines, which doesnt help. When you are on foot, trying to work out a shot on a buck that is on the move, and per chance stopping in cover, and then moving again with its head down, etc., it can be real tough to get eyes on that third point. And if the rack is a darker brown, its even tougher. Last year I had to pass up shots on a 6 pointer twice, while trying to see his antlers. And he kept moving away from me. I had to stalk into position for a shot 3 times before I could pull the trigger on him. I still think AR was a big mistake for 3A considering the dearth of hunters and the fact that shooting any buck in that area is an accomplishment. But it is the rule and so we have to deal.
Ya gotta applaud someone doing the right thing here. How many guys in a non AR area just unload their gun haphazardly at the first sight of a deer rather than waiting for a good shot and safe identification?
One size may indeed not fit all regions of NY, but it sure wouldn't be hard to figure out which counties or large area's have poor habitat or very low numbers where AR would less favorable. In my opinion, a large majority of the state could afford to show a little restraint and put some age on the deer.
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132 7/8th, pure guess on one pic.
Great deer. Has anyone qualified put a tape on him?
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For those complaining about having to pass young bucks that could be meat in their freezer... How many does have you had to pass up? If there were no antler restrictions and everyone had doe permits it sounds like you wouldn't be seeing either in 3A... because hunters would be killing everything and anything to fill the freezer... that's why we have deer management.. to save us from ourselves. There are plenty of WMU's with State land and doe permits if you need meat. I never understood why a hunter that has a need to feed his family with venison wouldn't travel wherever to make sure he had an opportunity to fill his freezer. I even know guys that scream about being meat hunters to help feed the family, but won't buy available doe tags in their area... just doesn't make sense.
Took the words out of my mouth.
I applaud the guys passing up big bucks because they already filled their tag... thats kinda how it goes... you decide to pull the trigger on one buck because it's supposed to be what you want.
I just can't relate go guys who complain about having to pass up bucks and they so badly need meat. Is their buck to doe ratio 5 buck to 1 doe or something? For those of you who live in a region that doesn't offer doe tags... I fully understand shooting whatever buck is legal.
"to save us from ourselves"... is a great quote because let's be honest, unfortunately it seems like the majority of gun hunters are just out to push running brown objects to their idiot hunting buddies who volly shots. I doubt that people who spend time on forums or who actually study their game are the ones doing this but it's what I consistently see afield. I've said it before, I like the idea of AR if for nothing else to get people to identify what they shoot at.
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Can't say I've ever really loved the performance of my shot guns. I have an Ithaca and a 870 but both were just ok. But this past season I bought a Savage 220 20 gauge and so far I really like it. It seems to be a tack driver with Remington Accu tips 3" and two shots have equaled 2 dead deer. It's light, recoil is less than other 20 gauges I've shot and it just feels good with a sweet trigger.
4 deer in 9 seconds
in Deer Hunting
Posted
If this shooter could not focus on the fact that his first fawn was still running away from him while he shot at the second and third deer, why would we think he can focus on his background?
Can't imagine how people get shot in the woods... but hey, it's legal....