mike rossi

The stuff you refer to as "fun facts" are known as "vital rates" (hence the term biology) and as you said are the foundation of today's knowledge, but it is misleading to say that it isnt related to conservation or harvest management (hunting). Biologists still need to know that stuff... As you indicated wildlife studies have evolved from "descriptive research" to "experimental research" - but keep in mind those vital rates are pertinent to wildlife studies.

Competing public land uses are not anything new... The danger here lays in the tendency of sportsmen to fail to make the distinction between the extreme viewpoint of the bowhunters and similiar, yet legitimate issues. Allthough you have not had any problems, I had more than a few... If you hunt primarily firearm deer season you probably encounter less nonconsumtive users than you would in the early autumn. Additionally anti hunters are more inboldened when only a few hunters are afield and retreat when the more numerous firearm deer hunters hit the woods. Furthermore, if you have a hedonistic mentality, you are not offended by the impact of the overuse of wildlife lands by the public majority during the warm months.

I guess if I was going after squirrels, deer, coyotes, or any other habitat generalist I would find a place where there is noboby parked and also off the beaten path enough to minimize someone else coming in behind me. You dont have as many options with other game.

The permits numbers change with the populations or with new population goals... Both buck and doe harvest data is usefull for population estimates. Those population estimates determine the allocations of anterless permits. The allocations are based on what population size the wildlife managers want in each unit...

OK, so the appropriate density at the DMU scale; is a balance between the social factors, such as input from stakeholders; and the biological factors, such as habitat. We have established that... However, the sex structure of the population affects how the population will change (up or down) or whether it will not change much. Anterless permits can be a tool used to achieve and maintain that desired density. The number of anterless permits allocated is adjusted to increase, decrease, or maintain the population on a DMU scale. You are adamant that the DEC does not follow this concept in its deer management program, and for all I know you might be 100% correct. In areas were the deer are cresting the SCC or the BCC that program would accomplish population reduction goals, but as far as I know, not because of the AR. If you have no preference harvesting a spike over a doe there is little to lose under this management regime, unless the only shot you get is at a spike... Off course that regime is not appropriate if the deer population in a unit is small or declining and needs conservation...

The Humane Society of the United States is now on the receiving end of a lawsuit and is being sued for federal racketeering violations, obstruction of justice, and mail and wire fraud. Read more details here: http://humanewatch.org/index.php/pages/detail/rico_lawsuit/ Help spread the news... Racketeering Lawsuit Names the Humane Society of the United States and Two of its Attorneys humanewatch.org Keeping a watchful eye on the Humane Society of the United States

Yes, it's a BIG one. A young 13-year-old Kansas deer hunter bagged a 20-point white-tailed buck during the state's youth-only hunting season. Does your state host youth-only hunts? If so, for what species? Thanks to Outdoor Life for sharing this info. http://www.outdoorlife.com/blogs/big-buck-zone/2012/10/kid-shoots-20-point-buck-during-kansas-youth-hunt

Joe; Your making a broad statement there based on your personal experiences. Look at my post above. Some of this occured on private posted land and some of it occurred way back in secluded areas. I am not defending the position of the archers, but I am saying there is some piss poor ethics, some piss poor law enforcement and some piss poor mentoring.

Two saturdays ago while dove hunting in PA - on the opener of archery deer, we encountered two separate bowhunters who didnt appear happy about our presense. Both were walking around trying to arrow a deer BTW... Same location on opening day of duck (this past saturday); which coincided with the PA Youth Pheasant Hunt - we ran into a vegan type (she asked us if it was hunting season BTW) with her unleased labrador retriever right in the mist of were the PA game commission released birds... There is an express prohibition in PA against training hunting dogs during the youth pheasant season, so if we were out there doing much the same as she we would be in violation. We have had mountain bikers peddling after turkeys during spring turkey season; airplanes 30 feet off the ground above us during september goose season; pheasant hunters and deer hunters stalk our decoys while waterfowl hunting; somebody shoot at a can 50 feet from us; and 2 guys walk right by us, nail a target on a tree for the purpose of taking 2 shots with an AR-15 while we were bird watching 40 yards away and lift 0ver 100 waterfowl in the spring. We also have had fishermen anchor thier boat 60 yards outside our decoy spread... Had people enter private land , inspect our truck and distrubt us and our dogs while we were dog training... And more - I got more stories.... So what? Try any of that in a state like South Dakota and see what happens. But this was PA and NY, mostly 6P in NY....

Say so long to the California of Department Fish and Game and hello to the state Department of Fish and Wildlife. Gov. Jerry Brown signed legislation this week that changes the name and clarifies the mission of the state government’s stewards of wildlife and habitat. The agency has carried out the often conflicting roles of promoting fishing and hunting while also working to protect wildlife and habitat. Effective Jan. 1, department employees must consider all the plants and animals that are that part the ecosystem as they manage California’s wildlife and wild lands. The law makes mandatory the use of “ecosystem-based management informed by credible science in all resource management decisions.” It calls for the formation of a science institute to guide the agency’s policies and practices. And it forms an environmental crimes task force. The new law will help the department “do a better job as public trustees for the state’s fish and wildlife,” said a statement from the office of Assemblyman Jared Huffman, D-San Rafael, who sponsored of the legislation. Huffman did not respond to requests for an interview. Fish and Game spokesman Mike Taugher described the new law as a huge change for the department. “We will certainly have to do a lot to prepare for this,” Taugher said. “But we haven’t started the process of implementation.” Fish and Game’s role dates to an 1852 decision to establish California’s first hunting seasons for elk, deer and certain game birds. The department now issues hunting licenses, enforces bag limits, stocks fish in lakes and streams, fights poaching, manages state preserves and oversees habitat preservation initiatives, among other duties. Some environmentalist say the change will help modernized the department and spur reforms. Tom Paulek worked as a wildlife biologist for the department for 28 years, including 17 years as manger of the San Jacinto Wildlife Area, before retiring in 2006. “Codifying an ecosystem-management approach will bring the department into the 21st century,” said Paulek, an Idyllwild resident who is now active with an environmental and bird-watching group called Friends of Northern San Jacinto Valley. The new law establishes a legal foundation that requires the department to better protect all of the state’s native plants and animals and their habitat, as well as game species, he said. It will move the department away from practices that he says appear to favor the interests of hunters and anglers at the expense of non-game species, Paulek said. For example, Fish and Game officials last year allowed a privately owned duck club to destroy habitat of an endangered plant called the San Jacinto Valley crownscale. Heavy equipment graded the plant habitat while rebuilding the club’s levees, ponds, blinds and a road on 92 acres next to the San Jacinto Wildlife Area. Department staff could — and should — have protected the plant’s habitat, because the state had purchased a conservation easement on the land specifically to preserve the crownscale and other plants, Paulek said. The department also lets hunters use lead shot in state-managed wildlife areas, even though lead is harmful to ecosystems, he said. Since 1991, federal rules have banned lead shot when hunting migratory waterfowl because the pellets pollute soil and waterways and have been found to poison wildlife, including swans. But the state department allows lead shot for other game species, such as doves and rabbits, that fall under state jurisdiction. Many hunters prefer lead shot over steel because it is heavier and thus more deadly. The new ecosystem approach could bring the department’s policy into question, Paulek said. Mark Searl, owner of BJ Sporting Goods in Hemet, said he enjoys quail, pheasant and deer hunting. He said he sees no problem with the name change and the shift toward a more science-based management of entire ecosystems. “Hunters are also environmentalists,” Searl said. “It’s just you out there in the open space. You are close to God and you appreciate what he made.” But he opposes more regulations. States’ cutbacks have left too few wardens to enforce laws against poaching and selling animals parts for commercial gain, he said. Gall bladders from California bears are still being sold in Asia, where some people believe they are a powerful aphrodisiac. “They can’t enforce the laws they got now,” Searl said. Ileene Anderson, a biologist for the Tucson-based Center for Biological Diversity, said the new ecosystem approach may lead to changes in some of the department’s past fish-stocking practices. The center has criticized the agency over its century-old practice of releasing non-native hatchery fish in streams, lakes and rivers. The group contends that non-native rainbow trout have contributed to declines of native fish and other species, particularly amphibians such as the Cascades frog and long-toed salamander, which need fishless, high-mountain lakes to survive. Anderson said she is encouraged by the new law’s emphasis on protecting ecosystems. “It recognizes that California is internationally known hotbed of biodiversity,” she said.

If not, then how do you think things are decided? What if a unit is underpopulated? Wouldnt a high doe to buck ratio increase the population? Could that not be acheived by reducing doe harvest?

Doc, I want you to refer to my hypothetical example below, assume this is post hunting season data, and tell me which management unit probably had more doe tags issued? MU1 has a total of 70 deer with this sex structure : 60 does : 10 buck MU2 also has a total of 70 deer with this sex structure : 35 does : 35 bucks

In your second paragraph you are saying that a 1:1 sex ratio produces a better survival rate up to hunting season for fawns because they are less susceptable to predators. Is this a prediction or is it a published study? The only way that can be considered "scientifically proven" is if a radio telemetry study was completed and if it was the results would be published in a wildlife science journal. Do you know where this study has been published or who did the study?

Although the topic is titled: "Deer Population" - the opening post was about how population age structure relates to ARs to get the optimum results. The thread got off topic when at some point in the thread someone incorrectly said sex structure (referred to as gender ratio) does not influencing pop. size (Doc is correct that it wont influence the biological carrying capacity - but it will influence reproduction and whether the herd grows, declines, or stays about the same). I attempted to explain that and then someone else tried to dispute my example with what is known as fecundity rates... The topic starter - Orion wants to discuss the above bold type...

Doc - see what part of your own writing I blew up? How do you think wildlife managers manipulate gender ratios by sex change operations? Are you serious or are you busting baseballs?

If the DEC has population indices for the 30 years in question it would include corresponding data about the sex ratios. If someone wanted to prove a point they could ask the DEC for that info...

I never heard about the 6:1 model - but it is irrelevent because the same question using your 6:1 scenerio doesnt change the answer... Here I will rewrite it using the 6:1 model.... MU1 has a total of 70 deer with this sex structure : 60 does : 10 buck MU2 also has a total of 70 deer with this sex structure : 35 does : 35 bucks Which unit will produce more fawns?

What scenerio births more fawns? Management Unit 1: 100 does and 5 bucks MU2: 50 does and 50 bucks

This is your own words: "so even though I can only cover 2 travel routes it is better than nothing". It might be more than better than nothing and better than Plan A because logistics plays a big role - select waiting spots not only because deer are using them, but also because you can access them quick & quietly...

Gender ratios do determine popluation size.

These links will give you a little insight on how the DEC evaluates public opinion to form policy... http://www2.dnr.cornell.edu/hdru/projects.html#Wildlife http://www.responsivemanagement.com/

Are we talking about migratory birds or deer? It certainly is not legal for MB. Here is 9 pages of very detailed and clear laws. I dont mind providing citations to back up what I say, but I think this issue has come up before and the culture of NY hunters si one were they: 1) Get their info from the same sources, eg. magazines and the NYSCC 2) Are not generally interested enough to inform themselves in anything not pertaining to deer, coyotes, and turkeys. Fine - but do you all write in to the magazines and Rod and Gun Officers and ask them for citations? NO you dont. And hunter ed needs to be more thorough as well, you got novices going through the course that are totally confused. http://www.fws.gov/le/waterfowl-hunting-and-baiting.html

Bow, rifle, muzzleloader, shotgun, or handgun - it still increase the hunters odds of success. And, what is a "troll" post?

For any migratory gamebird, with the (possible ?) exception of crows; you must be following a agriculture method used commonly in the region - determined by the local ag extension office. Talk about top sowing oats or wheat and things really get interesting... Harvesting a field under normal farming leaves a percentage of waste grain in randon locations. Brush hogging an entire field or worse - gradually in select areas which facilitate ambush - is not the same. Legally & ethically ambushing birds on the proverbial "X" in a normally harvested field is a world apart. Ditto for food plots designed to set up a "lay up" shot at big game - not sporting. Baiting or systematicly brush hogging a field allows a poacher to somewhat control the food - like filling up a bird feeder. It is like a late 1800s era market hunting practice, not a modern day sport hunting practice...

Although it is legal, the way food plots are planted by hunters come real close to baiting. In contrast a food plot planted for conservation is positioned close to escape and thermal cover so wildlife is NOT susceptible to hunters or other predators and does not have to travel far in the cold. Thats much different then luring game out onto shooting lanes trimmed through the understory or out into clearings. This is another one of those "not a legal issue but an ethical issue" deals. As this practice continues to grow it shouldnt surprise anyone when new regulations are proposed.