All I can say is.... Interesting....

[mike rossi]

http://www.pressherald.com/2015/03/11/lawmakers-back-bill-to-limit-out-of-staters-role-in-maine-petition-drives/

[mike rossi]

Here is the company - one of their testimonials of their successes in the slide show was in the Michigan ban of dove hunting. Other successes are gun control...

 

http://www.pciconsultantsinc.net/

 

[Sogaard]

So, because they lost a fair election, they are doing what they can to make it harder to get things put on the ballot?

 

Regardless of the cause, I do not agree with that premise. 

[mike rossi]

So, because they lost a fair election, they are doing what they can to make it harder to get things put on the ballot?

 

Regardless of the cause, I do not agree with that premise. 

 

I am not sure what you mean by that. 

 

 Maine and 19 other states allow voter referendum. That is, if sufficient petition signatures are gathered, a particular proposal can be included on the ballot in the state general election. This is why these actions are called "ballot initiatives" "referendums", "voter referendums." "ballot referendums,", etc..  

 

A local organization in Maine which opposed several methods of taking bear, with the support of the HSUS, succeeded in adding a ballot referendum in a recent election. The initiative, though reported by national pro-hunting organizations as defeated by a wide margin, was in fact, defeated by a narrow margin. 

 

The HSUS supported the effort in a number of ways, including contracting with PCI Consultants. This contractor, based in California, according to the article, had a team go to Maine to promote the referendum and gather petition signatures. According to some people, that may be illegal under Maine law, but it turned out it was not illegal. 

 

A Maine pro-bear hunting organization pressed state lawmakers to introduce a bill which would prohibit or make certain stipulations, such as out of state persons doing grass roots campaigning were a badge and disclose their employment history. However, similar proposals have been shot down in other states, including by a court ruling that such a law is unconstitutional.  The first link I provided is to an article discussing this legislation in Maine and elsewhere.

 

The second link I provided is to the website of the contractor hired by the HSUS. As do many business, they list on their website work they have done as testimonials of their effectiveness. This company has testimonials in the form of a slide show. The second or third slide they are bragging about their successful push to ban dove hunting in Michigan by referendum when contracted by the HSUS to do so.

 

I find this all interesting and perhaps a double-edged sword. We have been involved in using petitions, although we don't have the ability for ballot initiatives in NY, we are using them a different way. We also reached out to seven of the other eight states that do not allow dove hunting ( there is virtually no mourning doves in Alaska, so we left them out); and the 11 states that do not allow Sunday hunting. We entered a partnership with a number of sportsmen in NJ.

 

Although it turned out after verification, that our critics in NJ were actually anti-hunters pretending to be hunters (complete with photos of them with guns and harvested game) who have even attended state and county meetings of hunting organizations and/or have been or are elected officers of such clubs, have attacked our efforts to help NJ sportsmen, legalize Sunday hunting in NJ (they oppose Sunday hunting), because we are not NJ residents. The same persons who claim to be hunters, in addition to being opposed to Sunday hunting, are also opposed to mute swan management in NJ, spinning wing decoys for duck hunting, and pheasant stocking, even going so far as to constantly mock and criticize NJ hunters who pursue pheasant, including youth hunting opportunities for pheasant hunting.

Edited March 14, 2015 by mike rossi

[Mr VJP]

Maine has recognized the problem with ballot initiatives and referendums.  Even though they won the election, the anti hunting groups that they fought were national organizations with lots of cash and volunteers.  These groups are determined to control hunting in America on a national scale.

 

State initiatives were thought to be a good idea because they would best indicate the feelings of state voters on a given issue presented to them on the ballot.  Unfortunately, many uninformed voters can be swayed politically by massive propaganda campaigns by special interest groups that do not have a vote in that state.

 

What works for wildlife in California may be totally destructive in Maine.  Allowing a national organization to influence the wildlife laws in a particular state may lead to disaster.

 

Maine is just trying to insure it's voters are aware of who is paying for influence in their state on ballot initiatives so it's informed voters can spot the national agenda being pushed and question if it is a good thing for their state.

 

National organizations are also very involved in ballot initiatives that target the 2nd Amendment.  Considering laws can be won through what basically amounts to a popularity contest regarding constitutional rights and liberty, it becomes a danger to our entire system as a representative republic.  

 

Initiatives are true Democracy power.  Unfortunately, true democracy is not in the best interest of preserving the liberty of any minority opinion.  Gun owners and hunters could very easily lose all of their rights eventually if popular opinion turns against them.

 

One only need to look at initiatives on same sex marriage to see how some state voters put a stop to that.  Initiatives were passed against same sex marriage in many states.  Many were then overturned in court as unconstitutional.  It remains to be seen if the final outcome will favor the voters in the end.

 

When it comes to hunting, and even gun rights to a large extent, we cannot expect courts to be so quick to say the law passed violates our constitutional rights.

 

[EspressoBuzz]

Thanks Mike for the lucid explanation. I was having a hard time figuring out what the issue was and even if there was an issue.