Doc

That 180 pounder would have been illegal to shoot in one of those 3-point minimum AR units. He would have been free to breed and pass his genetics along until he died of old age.

Not sure I understand "the base wide can not exceed the length of the point". I'm assuming that you really meant base width, but does that mean the lowest point on the main beam diameter or the diameter of the burr?

I am kind of determined not to get caught up in the mud-wrestling match called AR discussions again, but I do have a serious question about the mechanics of antler restrictions, and I hope I can get a serious answer without starting some big controversy .... lol. Can anyone tell me if there is any kind of legal description of what constitutes a legal countable point? Is there any definition or length or some other description that goes beyond simply a wide pointy spot on the main beam? I'm no where near an AR unit so I haven't had occasion to look it up, but I was just a bit curious about that detail.

Yes, they continue lactating long after the fawns are weaned. And I would guess that the time span for this stretches out over a a couple of months just as the birthing does. But I suspect even the late born fawns are now capable of survival without the milk. I've watched them mowing down some of our shrubs for quite a while now. So they definitely know where to find food now with or without Ma.

This lawmaking through taxes knows no bounds. It worked well on cigarettes, it will be used to modify behavior relative to food, and there is no doubt in my mind that it is only a matter of time before it occurs to them to start applying it all to guns and ammunition. Why go through all the gun hassle with the NRA and other lobbying groups to fight with when simple tax code can be employed. It's the new government method of getting around those pesky rights that everyone is always talking about. Don't like it ..... tax it!

I just got done watching a doe and fawn in the yard. Fawn was trying to get a meal from the doe, and the doe wasn't having any of it. It looks like the fawns are fending for themselves for food now.

Without getting deeper into the mudpit that AR discussions have become, I will only comment that those who think that simple answers and a philosophy that one-size-fits-all is a good approach to NYS deer management, probably have not invested a whole lot of time in understanding that this state is not one of homogeneous habitat, deer populations, herd conditions and hunting opportunities. Quick fixes and management philosophies that are not tailored to the unique features of localities are usually not really all that great an idea. AR does not belong all across the state. I'll leave it to others to discuss whether it is needed at all. But I do recognize that there are places in this state where AR regulations are akin to telling hunters of those areas that their license fee contributions are welcome, but basically you are not likely to find anything that is legal to shoot..... thanks for your money though.

That is a heck of a good article on a subject that is glossed over by most authors of deer hunting books and magazine articles. Isn't it funny how important the subject of scent and wind is to a hunter and how little most of us actually know about it? Thanks for the link.

Lol .... tarred and feathered. I have had that happen to me before. That is some pretty sticky stuff that comes out of those pod hulls.

What we have seen under the existing buck harvest regulations (3" minimum) is a herd that through the 80's and 90's spiraled out of control to the point where the antlerless permit system could barely keep up. We have seen harvested deer layered with fat to the point of almost being obese. We have seen some very nice deer for those that cared to work hard enough for them. The health of the herd has been exceptional to the point of having them become a nuisance that often tests the ability of hunters and the permit system to control. What we don't have is a trophy behind every tree, but I have yet to hear any credible biologist claiming that the deer herd is "unhealthy" because of buck age structure or any other reason that can be concocted. The fact is that if the herd gets any more "healthy", we are likely going to have a habitat crisis. So I like the talk about AR being required to keep the herd healthy through balanced buck age but it all sounds too much like someone trying to fix a problem that they can't demonstrate exists. I find the trophy antler wants and needs of hunters to be a much more believable and credible motive behind the AR craze. I may not personally subscribe to that thought, but at least it is something that I can believe.

Thanks for the info. These are things I always wondered about. One of the things that bothered me about this thread was that apparently the OP was asking about some generic "waiver of liability form". And it sounds like the info contained on that sort of document pretty much has to be custom designed to cover the hazards that are peculiar to each individual landowners property. For example I would have to have included that old well, and those falling down constructed stands and probably a whole lot of other things that I have not even thought about in years. My property is posted, and liabilities are one of the reasons for that even though everyone you talk to these days try to convince you that NYS liability laws have changed to the extent where landowners are perfectly protected from lawsuit. I never really believed that.

So if I am reading all this correctly, I have some old deserted, rotten 2x4 treestands that I wouldn't get in if you paid me. It sounds like per you paragraph #1 above, leaving those up might constitute a legal liability if someone were to climb up there and try to use them and they let loose from the tree. And while you didn't specifically say so, it sounds like that lawsuit could come from a trespasser with or without permission. Is that correct? And then it makes one wonder if such liability might extend to perfectly sound purchased stands mounted in a tree and someone sneaks into it and falls out of it. Would the owner of the stand be liable for damages on that too because he did not fail-safe the stand from falls? Is there any kind of signed document that a hunter could hand you that would eliminate liability from the above examples?

Actually it was not a typo. It was repeated more than once in different posts with exactly the same spelling.

I'm not ganging up on anyone. I simply corrected an improper spelling and pronounciation of a word from our resident CWD expert.

I have found that the only chance I have at the bigger bucks is by hunting these gosh-awful thickets that are so nasty and ugly that you have to cut your way into them. Several times from inside these thickets I have watched these guys pacing around waiting for dark before they come out in the open. We often think that older deer go nocturnal, but very often they really are quite active in those areas where people don't go. I suppose in a practical sense that is nocturnal, but if you can get yourself inside without causing a ruckus and without ripping yourself to death on the wild rose, you might be surprised how much action there is in there within daylight hours.

Ain't that the truth. Anytime I cut access trails in that thick crap, it eventually becomes a deer trail. In fact that has happened so often that I usually extend those trails past the stand so I can get a shot at any critters that decide to use it. I guess they are a lot like people ..... why push your way through wild rose and vines when you have this nice trail .... lol.

Do you ever read what you type? I'm sorry, but you seem to have a problem sticking to any particular subject. It's all turning into some rather incoherrent babble. I know that's not a nice thing to say, but you really are flying out of control. Try to get yourself back together ...... focus ..... this is the "carcass" topic.

Probably not.

I don't have a dog, and I don't have a fight.....lol.

You sure are painting with a pretty broad brush there. You're making a lot of assumptions about people who read these forum messages.

How much do the pellets cost? Do you guys put scopes on these guns? I'm actually kind of interested. At $150, why not?

There ..... do you feel better now .... ha-ha. Have your little tantrum and get it out of your system. What the hell has happened to you? You are starting to really slip over the edge, big-time. You're all over this site, flipping out and going berserk. Take it easy there guy. It's only an internet forum.

No seriously, I just thought you might want to know what they are really called. I'm sure someone who has read and studied the subject of CWD and has become so expert that you would make a big thing about other people's ignorance on the subject might have come across the word more than just a couple of times. It's not a case of simple mispelling, it is a mis-pronounciation of the word as well. I'm just trying to help you become the expert that you already think you are.

I doubt they have the energy to go where I hunt .... lol. But I have seen U-tube videos by these wackos where they were using remote controlled airplanes during a dove hunt. I couldn't for the life of me figure out exactly what they were supposed to be accomplishing unless maybe they were using them to photograph the hunt participants. This same bunch were running around trying to photograph the faces of the hunters, and just plain being obnoxious jerks. All through the video they were bragging about how they were disrupting this hunt through harrassment, but I didn't see anything going on that was actually doing anything to the hunt itself. Frankly, I would have forgotten about the doves and tried for the airplanes. Now that would have been fun.

Wow! That is some pretty drastic action. 2 deer a day ...... They must have a prtty nasty problem there.