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Sorry for the negative post. I know not all hunters are like the ones above. Its just frustrating listening to hundreds of shots and then taking a drive around and seeing half a dozen deer tagged and laying at a happy hunters feet. The shot ratios to deer harvest just dont add up and it pisses me off knowing guys just fling lead with a hope and prayer it will find a kill zone, then walk away thinking nothing of it only to repeat the process again next year lol.

I feel the same way. Plus its means the end of bow season as well. I much prefer the solitude of bowhunting versus hearing 5 group shots one after the other for hours on end just knowing that those deer you passed on or were out of range are now getting lead flung at them from some idiots who are clueless. Every year we find unrecovered deer full of holes. Drives me absolutley nuts listening to it all unfold. If not for the point of being at camp to protect the place from vandals and trespassers on opening weekend I wouldnt even go. Funny how all this goes away by sunday too. Dont get me wrong I indeed enjoy gun hunting just not opening day. Past few years someone has been shot on state land around camp too. Yeah its not really a good plan to sit in the bottom of a ravine in a camo ground blind when there is orange plastered all at the top. Just saying. Then by noon the drives start by the same group of people every year. Its like there is only 1 day of deer season and whatever it takes to get a deer. Now come sunday and those jokers are all home sleeping in and guns stuffed in the corner till next year life is good again except the point that every deer is now on high alert and hunting just got a whole hell of a lot harder in what is already hard to begin with. Is what it is and wont ever change. Sad really when there is alot of great hunters who I would be proud to share a camp with for a deer hunt when there is a few that stink the place up for the rest. Oh well. Good luck everyone, be safe, be smart, know what your aiming at, dont take those iffy shots and remember if you cant get the deer down without unloading on it you probably shouldnt be shooting at it.

Well I am able to say I have all 3. I own, I lease and I hunt state land. Here is how I view the whole situation. Owning- It has the benefit and pride that comes with it knowing its yours. If I did not use the land for anything else besides hunting I would never do it again. The constant battle of dealing with trespassers, replacing ripped down posted signs, constant tax increases, the level of anxiety and frustration of hearing a gunshot while trying to get something done around the house and having to drop everything and track the down the trespasser abd catch him is daughnting. If it I did not use the land for firewood and a maple syrup business I would not ever own it. The frustration seems twice as high when you actually own the land. It down right drives me crazy. Leasing- Like Culver we also lease from Cotton Hanlin. Same piece now I think now for 17 years. Yes you battle trespassers but your not alone in solving the issue. You are allowed to pretty much treat it like you would your own land. Aside from not being able to cut live trees and trashing the place. We have a cabin we built on it. Probably wasnt the smartest investment as you really dont own it but incurred the cost to build it. If I was a smarter man I would of parked a nice camper on it but its really worked out rather well the way we chose. Biggest downfall I see of leasing is make Darn sure you are the Main lease holder, there is going to come a time when you are probably going to but heads with another person you went in on the lease with. Choose partners wisely in that regards. Or go it alone on the lease. Cost are basically the lease, plus an additional fee which is rather small for having a cabin and having your own insurance on it. The state land part of this comes in with the lease surrounded by state land. I find I end up spending as much time bow hunting on that as I do the lease. It also opens up alot more areas if your hunting partners hunting with you. I know there are some of you saying Leasing is a waste of money. Well sort of depending how you want to look at it. But lets look at things this way. Buy 100 acres of land, spend 30 years of payments and interest to finally get the note that it says all yours as long as you keep paying those taxes. Not a small investment by any means. AND you are still paying taxes. Yes you can sell it and run around and brag you bought this land for 200K and you sold it 30 years later for 250K and you made money. HMMMMM I dont think so, add up the interest, taxes and improvement cost and then tell me you made money lol. Leasing is like paying taxes without the cost of purchasing the land and if you come onto hard times its an easy out. No bank to foreclose no government ceasing the property for non payment of taxes as well. All things to think about. If I was a hunter looking for just hunting land that I could stick a camper on or small cabin I would not buy, I would lease again in a minute.

I have had bucks come in to it too, but seeing bucks run from it like I have its not a call I will carry or ever use again. Especially when it was a buck of the caliber yesterday. You guys are more than welcome to keep them. My thinking is we probably have some other hunter in the area walking around the woods tipping bleat cans thinking he is a savy deer hunter all the while educating them. Thats all the camp don the road from us does is (sort of) still hunt. More like wildly tromping through the woods with a bow.

Well you guys can keep those cans. In fact if you want one for free you can find one smashed against a tree as far as I could throw it from my stand tonight lol. Last year I had 2 different bucks out of range and hit that can with a couple short burst and watched in disbelief as they took off on a dead run. Tonight I had my best buck ever come in to 40 yards and kept looking behind him. Paused and looked back the whole time I first seen him. He stops with no shot quartering towards me and looks back again. Turns around and walks back the way he came the whole time he is calm, browsing and doing the happy tail dance. I grunt at him, stops gives an old tail wag and starts heading away again. Now he is a good 80 yards away. I tip that stupid can and that buck takes off on a dead run never to be seen again. Now heres the killer part. I get back to camp and my brother who was hunting a differnt area a good 1000 yards or better away had a 6pt he was trying to get turned and head his way. Said he ways a good 100 yds away and he hits that stupid can he has and the deer took off on a dead run the way he came. Never again will either one of us use or buy one of those damn things again. 4 bucks in 2 years reacted in same way.

I have two turkeys in specific that hang out in one of my foodplots on a regular basis that could care less when I check the camera. About 3 times now I have gotten within 10 feet of them in the open field and they just trot around me and go on eating. Walk back out after checking camera and they do the same like there is no fear in the world of what I am. Im willing to bet if I had a weapon on me they would run like heck to the next county. Weirdest thing I ever seen. I have to harass a family member about it and tell him how hard could hunting turkey be I can walk right up to them. lol

LOL not even that old yet and I can relate. I remember one year the last weekend of bow someone showed up at camp with all there gun gear switched out for there bow gear ready to go. Sure seemed like a long drive home and back to camp again that night.

So glad there is such a united concern with the people and this country. Im sure glad you find it humourous enough to find the need to start a thread that effects ALL americans in such a manner. Apparently you have zero concern of how deeply this disturbs alot of us with him being relelected. Its obvious there is nothing to turn back time to fix the mistakes but one thing that does need to be addressed is uniting the people in this country. And this is a sure sad way to start off on a new page with a thread that tweeks the short hairs on so many people. I have zero faith in this president as his track record speaks for himself, but the least we can do is try to be optomistic, hope an pray for the change we were promised in 2008 and stand together as citizens of this country and stop the rediculous seperation, selfish bashing of others opinions, racism, for gods sake we are not a bunch of crazed cavemen. We are AMERICANS how about we all start acting like one and treat each other with respect we all deserve, move forward, work together, and show the world and most of all our children we can all prevail together. Its time to move on, grow up a little and respect each other. I know this election has weighed heavily on everyone myself included. I have many concerns and many fears moving forward for the next 4 years but damn it I refuse to let this eat at my everyday thoughts from here on out. It has greatly effected my attitude, my finances, the fear for my kids future, everything. There are many many people that feel the same way. Lets stick together from here on out shall we and stop the BS?

Does the video really need to be explained to you? Its pretty self explanitory. In a nutshell its telling you to vote with a conservative mind not for a conservative party. Its obvious to all there is no conservative running.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsa4uLmTw0M&feature=youtube_gdata_player

I find it quite rediculous the way things have turned on this site. Bubba started his own thread, you guys attack him and redicule him and you are calling him names? Why would you comment on his thread if you had no other objective than to redicule him? I find it rather disturbing from the point Grow just couldnt keep her HMMMMMMMMM out of this thread right up to Tughill and his Kotex comments. And to think I got a pm from a moderator for saying bullshit. I got to tell you the disrespect that I read post after post is unhealthy and its pretty sad what this site is becoming. Its sad a guy cant say something about trespassers on his land and get this crap in return. What a joke some of you are becoming. Good Luck Bubba hope you have a great season.

So wait if you got one officer telling you this and I got a few telling me different which one trumps the other? LMAO I think Jennifer pointed out the obvious and that it is probably more dependant on the officer and the area they are from and the bull they see from day to day. Probably depends on alot of the time they have been doing law enforcement and the different situations they have seen over there career. I do however find it hugely funny that one one member mentions that he was told by two different officers at two different times and was checked for the same thing with 2 different weapons that it goes ignored but yet when another member post up an I asked and this is his reply the ones that want to hear what they want to hear start clicking the like button. How about if I go ask my cousin the town judge and see what his take is on it too. What some of you seem to fail to recognize is that I hardly doubt and personally know no one who carries the necessary lights to claim coyote hunting in the dark to begin with. I easily recongnize a handful do and a couple have spoke up but lets face the limited number that focus there time to do and carry the resouces to actually be able to see a coyote and take a shot at one in the dark when they are deer hunting aside from sitting in a tree stand, which by the way I have not even mentioned anything about that but some seem to like to add scenarios that Im not even discussing to make it perfectly acceptable for them to disagree. So Here is what I will leave you all with. YOU are absolutely correct, the encon officer that have stopped and checked me for a loaded weapon coming out of the woods in the dark from deer hunting and the ones I have spoke with are absolutly incorrect, have nothing better to do, need to focus on chasing just criminals and not ones that might actually be a criminal that they would not even consider to be one unless they did there job and checked them for potentially wrong doing to begin with such as carrying a loaded weapon around in the woods after dark because everyone of you hunters that do that in no way possible could even think in an officers eyes possibly or actually be hunting illegally now could they? Boy that was alot of ands, and one run on sentence. Carry on doing things however you feel is perfectly acceptable and just like last night when I came out of the woods bowhunting for deer (even though I never shot a deer I guess I wasnt actually hunting lol) after dark due to a very long hike to that particular stand I spooked and jumped a deer as soon as I hit the seasonal road my truck was parked on. And that is no BS story either. So do tell me what do you think if an encon officer was waiting at my truck to check for a license and seen this happen if I was carrying a loaded weapon (on state land non the less too)? I also find it truly sad that a thread with advise about helping you not get a ticket and letting the judge decide, wasting your time and court fees turns into yet again another bashing about how everyone is absolutely correct and must find ways to twist and turn things to make them feel like they know it all and no one else trying to help them actually has a clue. I will from now on refrain myself from getting sucked into a thread when no one actually cares to even consider another hunter trying to point out that a simple thing as unloading a weapon might save them a trip to court. I also appologize WNY for some of my language as you are right I am well above and better than that myself. I aslo appologize for trying to help other hunters, I will refrain from doing that ever again after reading the ignorance posted on this here thread. Have a great hunting season.

I can say the same thing WNY. Im am not wrong. First off saying you are deer hunting after dark only if you shoot a deer is foolish, how any times do you just go sit in a tree stand and arent realy hunting because you didnt shoot a deer lol. Second I think I will stand by my statements as told to me by the men and women who enforce game laws and not a bunch ot people trying to dabble in the GREY areas on a keyboard. I can certainly admit when Im proved wrong and appologize but none of you have made a statement that over rides what DEC otricers have said when I was checked for on this very same topic.

Yes indeed I do, I have a family member who is one, I have a nephew going to college to become one and I know 2 personally, I can walk behind my house and see half a dozen of them on any given day during salmon season. There is a DEC station a few miles down the road from me where they bring in many extra officers to patrol this area and its where they stay. I see them daily, I talk with them often. I have been stopped and checked for license many, many times. Its just natural for the area I live in. I also grew up around them in the fish hatchery while playing, helping, and trapping that area up till I was 18. And chip may be a good point as these guys spend alot of time on there feet chasing yahoos around from all over the country and Im sure it just puts them on edge. I have tried to make my point and a point made that was directly told to me by law enforcement. These guys have seen it all, heard every excuse and are pretty wise to whats bull and what isnt. Im headed to camp I will rant with you guys in a couple weeks geeeeeesh.

Im not missing that point at all. Im trying to explain to you that if you are a deer hunter coming out of the woods in the dark and you have a loaded weapon, a primer in your ML or a release on your wrist, you are taking the chance of getting a ticket for INTENT of hunting deer after dark. The coyote thing is just not feasable unless you are setup to be coyote hunting after dark. Lets face some points, how many people coyote hunt while walking in the woods with a little flashlight in the dark? How many can actually fire a weapon in the dark and expect to hit a target or see what the hell they are shooting at, how many kno what is behind the target if they actually can see it to begin with? Thats the point. And a point made to me by 2 different ENCON Officers on 2 different occasions. You can look back to what I have read and also see I never said its illegal to carry a loaded weapon after dark, but using the excuse that Im coyote hunting in the dark with no projected light source to see the coyote while ummm yeah still hunting coyotes back to your vehicle seem like a pheasable answer for ENCON? And if you were to have a light mounted on your gun to project a light source at a coyote you might want to consider what you tell the officer if you see one. Cause it is illegal to deer hunt with a projected light source on your gun and if you say you where deer hunting and kept the gun loaded to come out of the woods in fear of some coyotes hunting you down in the dark you might get laughed at along with another ticket. And due take notice I never once have said"while sitting in your stand at 7:10 am or at sunset I said DARK.

Holy moley what part is not understood? I said I could give a rats ass about coyote hunting. I am big game hunting period. The topic does not say interpretation of coyote hunting hours under the DEER HUNTING section of this forum or does it? WTH I give up I guess Im just not smart enough to understand that this is a topic of Interpretation of hunting hours in the Deer hunting section. You guys and gals have fun with it.

lol I dont think that would be considered baiting see how its not a food source. Using scents and attractants is legal.

And the same could be said in return. You worked with some in region 9 and you are speaking on behalf of them all? Try not to paint with too big of a brush yourself lmao. Please do tell me what common sense says when someone is carrying a loaded weapon after dark while deer hunting actually means then. Again I could give a rats ass about coyote or any furbear hunting because honestly how many set themselves up to coyote hunt in the dark after hunting big game. I know of none myself. Well except a couple that claim on a website they do lol.

I actually know a guy that got ticketed for doing just that. Ate an apple and tossed it on the ground. DEC was watching him through Binos. I think the part that got him was he shot a doe soon after that.

And for the record to be completely honest I really could care less if your priority is to carry a loaded weapon after dark. Its up to you to address that issue with the judge if you are ticketed. Im just trying to point out the way it looks in an officers eyes and how it will be interpreted to them. I personally do not see why this is even such a big deal anyhow. It only takes a second to unload your gun, not just for the safety factor of stumbling around in the woods after dark with a loaded weapon but it just makes sense to me since Im am no longer deer hunting after sunset to begin with.

I think the point is getting missed here. That being it is illegal to deer hunt after sunset is it not? If you are deer hunting and its after dark with a loaded weapon the intent is there in any officers eyes. Coyote hunting is a whole different discussion. Im not out coyote hunting Im out deer hunting. That is the big difference you guys keep trying to use to validate the reasoning behind keeping your weapons loaded after dark. This line from the dec website below is pretty clear to me. If you are no longer hunting why is your weapon still loaded? I know why but does the DEC see it the same way? I highly doubt it. There are so many poachers and illegal hunters they would be hard pressed to trust any one of us if we walked out with a loaded weapon after dark. Where you not after all big game hunting? Hunting Hours Big game hunting hours are sunrise to sunset. Sunday hunting is allowed in all areas of New York. There are some local exceptions. Check the area that you hunt carefully. For hunting on state parks, confirm regulations with the park before hunting.

Well last I knew deer hunting sure didnt mean you had to kill to be, well deer hunting. I think I will stick wih what 2 different officers told me on 2 different occasions over a bunch of guys trying to interperet laws on there keyboard. Its pretty darn clear if you are deer hunting it is illegal to hunt deer after dark. Plain and simple. A loaded weapon you are deer hunting with no matter how you want to justify your reasoning in any officers eyes you are hunting with the intent to kill. You hope you get one of the more forgiving officers when he stops you at dark with a loaded weapon you just got done deer hunting with and he believes your story whether your speaking the truth or not. Good luck with that.

I have been stopped and questioned twice by DEC both times coming out of the woods at dark. Once with muzzloader once with bow. By different officers. The first thing that was checked with muzzloader was to see if there was a primer in the gun. The other time was they checked to see if I had my release on my wrist when coming out after a bowhunt. Each time I was told it is considered a loaded with the intent to use after dark. Lucky I was smart enough to take the primer out and my release off before exiting my stands. I think once again people are overthinking yet another subject. Its common sense. If you are coyote hunting you are coyote hunting. If you are deer hunting you are deer hunting. I find it a bit hard to believe an officer will believe your intent is to harvest a coyote without proper tools on hand to shoot coyotes at night, like having a pocket full of deer calls and no light source on the gun to shoot after dark. It really doesnt take a rocket scientist to figure out what you are in the woods hunting based on what you are carrying. Is it truly that time consuming and difficult to take your release off, onload the gun, or take a primer out?

I dont see the disrespect, hang it how the heck you want. Never hung them by the head myself, was always tought by hind legs so blood runs to the uneaten head instead of the hind quarters.

Just make sure the time on your watch is 2 minute early LMAO