Grouse

Obama using a fake assassination attempt to stir up trouble wouldn't surprise me a bit. The rest of the details in the article are pure speculation as to what would happen afterwards, but his doing it has probably been discussed by his handlers.

My Kimber 84M Montana in 7mm-08 is now 6 years old and has become my favorite deer rifle. I've owned many different deer rifles over the years, but none have given me the absolute confidence and enjoyment that this one has. I've taken 8 deer with it and every one of them has dropped right where it was standing with one shot using 140 gr Winchester Supreme Ballistic Tip cartridges. When loaded in the 7mm-08, the Supreme Ballistic Tips are designed for controlled expansion in deer. They are not the light jacket varmint bullets that come in the varmint rounds. Everyone has fully penetrated the deer and I have yet to recover one to examine after the kill. They also give me great accuracy in my Kimber. IMHO, the 7mm-08 is the best Whitetail round ever devised. The recoil is also a lot less than most other popular deer rounds, which probably adds to it reputation for great accuracy.

I have a Mini 30 in stainless steel with a wood stock and a Leupold 1.5x5 on it. I have taken two deer with it. Both were at 50 yards and I was using Remington 125gr soft points. Both deer were standing still, not spooked and they both dropped within 10 yards. Both were broadside double lung shots and both bullets went clear through the deer. The 7.62x39 is very close to the .30-30 in power, but the pointed soft points seem to penetrate better. I wouldn't hesitate to shoot a deer at 200 yards with it, as ballistic tables show it has more than enough energy at 200 to kill cleanly. The only drawback I see to the Mini 30 is it's weight. It is heavier than the typical lever action .30-30 Winchester and not as smooth to the shoulder for a quick shot in the thick stuff. It is a lot easier to mount a scope on though.

Fast & Furious is all the evidence anyone needs to see what Obama is trying to do "under the radar". When he has nothing to fear after he gets re-elected by people who think he's their friend, God help America!

What Obama wil do in a 2nd term is easily predicted by looking at his past voting record as a US Senator (a job he was never qualified for either) His record indicates he is very anti gun. If you think he has changed, or that name calling makes you right, you don't believe in reality.

As far as the forfieture law goes, the problem is they can take the guns PRIOR to conviction, and you will never see them again, even if you are found not guilty. That is a BIG problem. It happens already with money and land and property seizures from people who were set up, had drugs planted in their homes, or had a single joint left in their car by the bimbo they picked up in a bar. Want to see the story? Google Nicholas Bissel, a NJ county prosecutor who eventually fled aprehension and then committed suicide for his abuse of the forfieture laws. Far too much power for the government and too much incentive for abuse and corruption.

That's like saying that growling pit bull in front of me hasn't bit me yet, so I don't think it will. I'll just wait and see. If he gets re-elected you will get plenty of replys. Jim Florio confiscated thousands of guns in NJ when he passed the assault weapons ban there, and he never gave any indication he would do it. The Obama administration has gone on record, and has proven many times, they want to pass a lot of gun laws. Why do you think that is?

That's the thanks we get.

They plan to make ammo a controlled substance.

I hunted deer and bear with a muzzleloader 14 miles back into the Adirondacks about a decade ago. We rode horses from the drop point to the camp area. We were able to ride within 40 yards of deer without spooking them. Only after we got close enough for them to see a man on the horse did the deer run. The guide said deer don't fear the sound of a horse coming because it sounds like any other for legged ungulate, which do not eat deer. Hunting deer & Elk from horseback is quite common out west.

Their words say one thing, but their actions reveal the truth. Elimination of age of consent laws are part of the worldwide gay agenda.

Another article of interest. http://www.jesus-is-...bla_exposed.htm "If the ACLU wins in the thrust of their arguments, it means the state has no right to say that it is illegal for an adult to have sex with a 13-year-old child." Kline also fears that an ACLU victory will make it difficult for the state to enforce laws against polygamy, incest, bestiality, and other sexual perversions. The effort to abolish "age of consent" laws has been a long-time goal of homosexual activists. The 1972 Gay Rights Platform, for example, called for the abolition of all laws prohibiting sex with children. The platform demands: "Repeal of all laws governing the age of sexual consent." http://www.glbtq.com/social-sciences/nambla.html Activists in the early 1980s mustered a battery of recent research to demonstrate that young people were capable of informed consent to sex, even of soliciting sex themselves. They claimed a long history and pan-cultural relevance for intergenerational sex, and argued that the benefits of such relations far outweighed their potential abuses. Initially, NAMBLA won considerable support for its efforts from the gay left. Differential age of consent laws for homosexuals and heterosexuals were then (and continue to be) used to target gay sex in jurisdictions around the world, including ones in the United States. Equalization of age of consent laws has been a major part of the struggle for gay rights in the United Kingdom and elsewhere. Some libertarians rallied to this cause, as did such leading feminist writers as Pat Califia, Kate Millett, and Gayle Rubin.

OK Virgil, per your request, I will enlighten your ignorance. In 1994 NAMBLA, along with many members of the Gay Liberation Front participated in the "The Spirit of Stonewall" march which commenorated the 1969 Stonewall Riots.[25] In 1994, Pat Califia[26] argued that politics played an important role in the gay community's rejection of NAMBLA An article showing how NAMBLA was well supported, but shunned for political reasons. The agenda is still there and being promoted by LGBT groups. http://www.allameric...ize-pedophilia/ Note the author's pointing out of similarities in political strategy for this agenda as well. The current movement to legalize and normalize pedophilia may seem unrealistic to some. I have yet to have someone agree with me when I claim that it will be legal in the next 25-30 years. But there are many, as I have detailed here, who see pedophiles as an oppressed minority. They see the road to freedom as being the same road homosexuals marched down. The first step would be the removal of pedophilia as a mental illness, a move the APA has already considered. Then, using the research of Kinsey and others mentioned above, the move would be made to abolish the age of consent. With the seeming support of science, this could be possible and it would effectively legalize pedophilia. With the legal burden lifted, the effort would then shift to normalization and acceptance. This is done by pedophiles casting themselves as a minority, a victim of a culture that rejects them. March after march makes the sight of a fifty year old man giving a six year old boy a deep tongue kiss nothing more than a sign of America’s tolerance, regardless of who gets hurt. Harry Hay - Founder of the Gay Rights Movement- An article describing his support for NAMBLA, in spite of pressure to be quiet about it. http://www.bostonpho...ts/02511115.htm He was, at times, a serious political embarrassment, as when he consistently advocated the inclusion of the North American Man/Boy Love Association (NAMBLA) in gay-pride parades. In 1994, he refused to march with the official parade commemorating the Stonewall riots in New York because it refused NAMBLA a place in the event. Instead, he joined a competing march, dubbed The Spirit of Stonewall, which included NAMBLA as well as many of the original Gay Liberation Front members. Even many of Hay’s more dedicated supporters could not side with him on this. But from Hay’s point of view, silencing any part of the movement because it was disliked or hated by mainstream culture was both a moral failing and a seriously mistaken political strategy. In Harry’s eyes, such a stance failed to grapple seriously with the reality that there would always be some aspect of the gay movement to which mainstream culture would object. By pretending the movement could be made presentable by eliminating a specific "objectionable" group — drag queens and leather people were the objects of similar purges in the 1970s and 1980s — gay leaders not only pandered to the idea of respectability but betrayed their own community. Note the line about "PRETENDING". The NAMBLA agenda is only rejected where it is in political view. LGBT groups play politics with the NAMBLA agenda in order to advance their ideology. NAMBLA is supported, not rejected by the homosexual community, in the private settings that are not in the media limelight. When Hay died, neither of the long and laudatory obits in the New York Times and the Los Angeles Times mentioned his unyielding support for NAMBLA or even his deeply radical credentials and vision. That's pure suppression of the facts. The MSM continues to do the same thing today in it's support of the LGBT agenda. Another source. http://www.voiceofre...ctivist-closet/ I could go on and on, but I doubt you would be impressed, no matter what evidence you were presented with.

Virgil, you totally ignored the reference to NAMBLA in your reply. Why is that? That organization does exist, they do promote sex with minors and they are supported by the majority of the homosexual community. Antler has made a very good analogy to the original post bashing the Catholic Church. Ignorant, homophobic and absurd? Perhaps you better research what NAMBLA is and what they preach. It is a crime to have sex with a minor, of either sex. And that also goes for heterosexual males who have sex with females that are MINORS!

Not all Leftists are annoying. Some are dead.

And you sir, are an agent of Satan. But I suspect your duties are mostly ceremonial.

Inalienable rights are granted by governments??? Where did you study government? Rights can not be bestowed upon man by government, they can only be destroyed by government. Government can make something legal, but that doesn't make it a right. Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness are rights. They were not granted to you by the government. No wonder you vote for Democrats.

Best "Pot Calling The Kettle Black" post I have ever seen! LOL!!!

High Taxes, gun control, less freedom, less national soverignty and a bigger government with much more control. Those are the specifics I'm talking about. If Obama gets re-elected, these are very real threats to this country.

Regardless, Obama had his chance. He failed. Logic says he has to go. If Romney fails after 1 term, he goes too. Why should Americans start giving 2nd terms to failed presidencies?

If Obama gets re-elected, it may well turn out to be the election that ends America as we know it. His plan for "Change" will run at full throttle if he doesn't have to worry about re-election anymore. Leftist talking heads are telling you the Koch Brothers have control of the TEA Party? How do you control something that has no leadership? I notice you don't mention the Democrats cozy relationship with George Soros here. Now there is a real American Patriot! LOL.

I don't believe any TEA party supporter wants Obama to win a 2nd term, knowing it could be the end of this country before the term ends. Remember the TEA party only exists as an idea, not a true political party with specific leadership. I believe if Romney wins and doesn't do what the TEA party expects in 4 years, they can challange his re-nomination with their own candidate at that time. The GOP also doesn't have to nominate a sitting president for a 2nd term, especially if his opponent is sure to win against him.

Shooting bystanders is never excusable, period. Might as well let the perp do it. Your sidearm is for self defense, that goes for cops as well as CCW holders. Years ago you had a wheelgun and 6 shots. You trained to make them count. Now they have a semi with at least 12 to 16 rounds. Aimed fire has lost out. Kelly knows it. Bloomberg knows it too. Their lack of attention to this problem will now become another headache they will have to deal with. Criticize me all you want, but the problem ain't being addressed. Remember Amadu Dialo? Cost the city millions. Nothing changed. Don't ask me to reply to this issue anymore. Most things I cannot discuss. The rest don't deserve a reply. I'm done here.

Shooter targets one individual shoots him in the head then shoots 4 more times in the victim's dead body. Then walks away. The cops on scene approach perp and he draws a gun from HAND BAG (?) and they blast away killing him and wounding 9 others (bystanders). The perp only shot 5 rounds all point blank and all into his target..if you listen to the media they make it sound like the perp sprayed the crowd with auto fire... I'm all for law enforcement, but this type of thing makes all law enforcement look bad. You gotta point out problems in order to fix them. You ignore them at your own peril. I know hundreds of cops, many very good, many very bad. Another problem in law enforcement is good cops will not report bad ones. I'm an old guy. I saw the Serpico era first hand. That's all I'm gonna say about my first hand knowledge. Training is simply shooting at paper and scoring well enough to pass. That doesn't prepare cops for something like this. I feel very sorry for the victims, but not for any cop that shot one of them. This is going to get very ugly and very expensive for NYC.

New York Police Commissioner Ray Kelly said Johnson was fired from his job at Hazan Imports, a women's handbag company with offices near the Empire State Building, about a year ago, and that he shot and killed the firm's office manager, Steve Ercolino. The two men were involved in a dispute involving allegations of harassment, Kelly said. Johnson was dressed in a suit and tie and carrying a briefcase when he opened fire with a .45 caliber handgun just after 9 a.m. on a crowded street in midtown Manhattan. After Ercolino was dead, Johnson aimed his weapon at police and was killed in a hail of gunfire by officers, the NYPD said. The New York Fire Department said 8 people were transported to area hospitals for injuries related to the shootings. Many of those injured appear to have been hit by bullets or shrapnel from shots FIRED BY POLICE, Kelly said. All of the injured are expected to survive. (This ain't the first time NYC cops have killed bystanders or unarmed people. I do not say this to bash all cops, I say it to point out the fact there are a lot who don't do their job well. I know what I speak of. I work in the NY State Criminal Justice Dept)