Lifetime License

[Doc]

There have been adequate hints over the years that most of our decisions have very little to do with what resources wind up in the DEC control. The governor controls directly or indirectly the purse-strings of the DEC and can play any game he wants to in terms of robbing from any fund he wants. If he is forced to give a little here, he has the ability to withhold a little there. So there is a system that you can never win whether you are dealing with annual licenses or lifetime licenses. If the rest of the state wants to steal the funds, you can rest assured that they have their ways of doing it and most likely will. It will not be the first time and will not be the last time.

[fasteddie]

uhhhhhh , I hope they didn't Divert the $50 that I paid for my LifeTime License !

[A Sportsman]

Thank you Doc for phrasing what I was about to say. I couldn't have said it better. At least not without misccharaterizing in the process.

Just to add, from what I saww, the state budget is around 133 billion. So yeah in a way 10s of millions is somewhat trivial. Its really about priorities, not simply giving goverenment more money to mismanage.

[A Sportsman]

The states priorities that is. Not our personal ptiorities.

[Doc]

uhhhhhh , I hope they didn't Divert the $50 that I paid for my LifeTime License !

Yeah between your $50 and my $50, that's a whole $100 that they could have squandered .... lol.

[mike rossi]

There have been adequate hints over the years that most of our decisions have very little to do with what resources wind up in the DEC control. The governor controls directly or indirectly the purse-strings of the DEC and can play any game he wants to in terms of robbing from any fund he wants. If he is forced to give a little here, he has the ability to withhold a little there. So there is a system that you can never win whether you are dealing with annual licenses or lifetime licenses. If the rest of the state wants to steal the funds, you can rest assured that they have their ways of doing it and most likely will. It will not be the first time and will not be the last time.

Then why do we even have CFAB? Should we recruit hunters to sustain the STIP instead of the CF?

 

The annual license revenue is protected by NY state as well as federal law from diversion or sweeping. The Fish and Game Account , which has nothing to do with fish & game might violate or loophole those laws. Diversion of sporting license revenue disqualifies a state from receiving federal conservation funds. The USFWS administers the federal conservation funds. For several consecutive years, the NY state has failed US Fish and Wildlife Service audits and it was alleged to be due to budget language. I am not sure if this is not something to do with the Fish and Game Account.

 

Even if it has nothing to do with federal funding it is still wrong and issue-rich to divert  license revenue from conservation. This was not a system that was set up to subsidize state government and sportsmen claim to be conservationists and to "pay for conservation".

[Elmo]

#1.  It's really messed up that the government is taking lifetime license money and using it for something other than it was intended to.

 

#2.  While you want people to contribute to conservation, you can't demand it.

 

#3.  Those who do contribute, do so in their own way.  Some simply can't afford it.  I contribute by donating $50 here, $25 there, but I can't afford to do so all the time and so getting a lifetime license makes more sense to me.  Maybe if I had tons of money, I can afford to buy an annual license each year but then if I had tons of money, wouldn't it be better to buy a life time license and then give a $5000 donation to park conservation instead?  People contribute what they can and what makes them comfortable.  Just because one person can give more doesn't make them a better person.

 

#4.  With that said, I have not problem with those who don't contribute at all but I do shake my head when I listen to people who preach about conservation but don't contribute at all.  It's like they cry foul but sit back and wait for someone else to fix the problem.  There are some hunters who preach about the dying sport and tradition and how we should promote hunting but do nothing to promote it because doing so would cut into their hunting time and potentially introduce competition to their pristine hunting spots.  Sure, they bring their kids.  That's how they keep the tradition alive.  But really, they're your kids.  As a parent, they're suppose to spend time with their kids.  Hunting or not.

[mike rossi]

Elmo,

 

In much of Europe the average person cant afford to hunt. What differs here is we follow what is known as the North American Conservation Model. It has worked for 75 years.

 

Despite the role of sportsmen in leading conservation and a 75 year head start, the non shooting public majority is now engaged in conservation and will out spend sportsmen in much less time than the next 75 years. While this is not a bad thing and actually is a necessity as sporting license revenue continues its downward spiral, it has political implications which will challenge our legal right to hunt and the character of wildlife policy...

Edited August 13, 2013 by mike rossi

[Elmo]

Does anyone know if the proposed reduction in hunting license fees that is suppose to go into effect next year is going to affect life times?

[mike rossi]

Does anyone know if the proposed reduction in hunting license fees that is suppose to go into effect next year is going to affect life times?

It will take effect February 2014. I don't know how it will effect lifetimes, I do know that Cuomo's statement back when he proposed this was that one justification for it was to "simplify" buying a hunting license. (I didn't know buying a hunting license was complicated)... But it seems like this new law  would complicate, not simplify  lifetimes and generate a sleuth of accounting issues.... Guess will see what the governor, a few lawmakers, and cfab put together this time...

 

But, Elmo, you are not following the script... You were suppose to say "What is the North American Wildlife Conservation Model?"  That's ok, I will post it later, don't know if it should be put in Politics & Law or in general chit chat... Think I will post it in GCC and the moderators can adjust it if they want...