9 year old girl accidentally kills gun instructor

[Borngeechee]

I hate the fact that he died because of this but this was totally irresponsible on his part. You don't put a full auto sub machine gun in the hands of a little girl, especially one that's not a shooter. He lost his life and this poor girl is probably traumatized for life.

http://www.buzzfeed.com/claudiakoerner/firing-range-instructor-dies-after-child-accidentally-shoots?s=mobile

[Vince1]

was thinking the same thing. my wife got a hold of this and now the gun debate is back on

 

to each his own but I wouldn't have started my kid out on something like that

[First-light]

This happened some years ago with a 9 year old boy. He shot himself from the recoil and died. I guess they are just way too young to be handling something like that. It is not from lack of instruction the trainer was right with her when she shot. Sad story…..

[Setters4life]

Happened here: http://bulletsandburgers.com/

 

 

[AaronBlaine]

I have shot at that range numerous times when I lived in Arizona.  I used to carry a kimber custom 2 on my hip everywhere I went in az.  Very relaxed gun laws which was SOOOO nice coming from NY.  Last I was there they did away with the concealed permit which meant you could only carry if the gun was showing.  Now you don't need a permit to conceal a firearm unless they changed the law.  I remember bouncing at a night club and you had to be weary of girls with big breasts bc it was very popular to hide Rhine stone covered nickel plated 22\s in between there breasts!  Anyhow I was at that range one day when I heard a noticeable ticking sound coming from the shooter to my right.  When I looked over there was a 21 year old kid with a 16 year old shooting a silenced mark 7 lol he let me shoot it and it was extremely cool but had me thinking if it was a bit much for someone that young to be messing around with a silencer!  Automatic weapons were verrrry common and I believe you could own one fairly easily it just had to be kept at the armory and had to be checked out when taken to the range on a day or weekend type pass.  I am extremely pro gun HOWEVER putting a fully automatic uzi in a 9 year olds hand is just stupid!  I am all for teaching gun safety to children but putting an uzi in a 9 year olds hands is like tossing your 16 year old a pair of Ferrari keys and saying take it for a spin son!  The instructor was following protocol however lacking common sense!!!! ITS A FULLY AUTOMATIC SUB MACHINE GUN!  Not your fathers old 22lr that he passed down for shooting squirrels!  When Uziel Gal made this weapon it was to protect his homeland of Israel from invading forces and it did just that!  I am sure he wasn't planning on having a 9 year old fire a micro version of his design!  This kind of incompetence by the parents of this young lady as well as the range officers is slowly destroying the 2nd amendment.  I urge parents to please be responsible when handling this kind of weaponry and if your looking for hits on youtube find another way then putting a sub machine gun in your childs hands.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

I have shot at that range numerous times when I lived in Arizona.  I used to carry a kimber custom 2 on my hip everywhere I went in az.  Very relaxed gun laws which was SOOOO nice coming from NY.  Last I was there they did away with the concealed permit which meant you could only carry if the gun was showing.  Now you don't need a permit to conceal a firearm unless they changed the law.  I remember bouncing at a night club and you had to be weary of girls with big breasts bc it was very popular to hide Rhine stone covered nickel plated 22\s in between there breasts!  Anyhow I was at that range one day when I heard a noticeable ticking sound coming from the shooter to my right.  When I looked over there was a 21 year old kid with a 16 year old shooting a silenced mark 7 lol he let me shoot it and it was extremely cool but had me thinking if it was a bit much for someone that young to be messing around with a silencer!  Automatic weapons were verrrry common and I believe you could own one fairly easily it just had to be kept at the armory and had to be checked out when taken to the range on a day or weekend type pass.  I am extremely pro gun HOWEVER putting a fully automatic uzi in a 9 year olds hand is just stupid!  I am all for teaching gun safety to children but putting an uzi in a 9 year olds hands is like tossing your 16 year old a pair of Ferrari keys and saying take it for a spin son!  The instructor was following protocol however lacking common sense!!!! ITS A FULLY AUTOMATIC SUB MACHINE GUN!  Not your fathers old 22lr that he passed down for shooting squirrels!  When Uziel Gal made this weapon it was to protect his homeland of Israel from invading forces and it did just that!  I am sure he wasn't planning on having a 9 year old fire a micro version of his design!  This kind of incompetence by the parents of this young lady as well as the range officers is slowly destroying the 2nd amendment.  I urge parents to please be responsible when handling this kind of weaponry and if your looking for hits on youtube find another way then putting a sub machine gun in your childs hands.

Great post. I am also all for guns but these types?? For?? To do what?

[Deerthug]

Well put Aaron!

[NeverSeenNorHeard]

I've seen videos where adult's can't manage the repeated recoil of an automatic firearm. I can't see the logic behind thinking a 9 year old could effectively manage it, especially after shooting only one round out of the gun prior to going full auto 

[jrm]

Great post. I am also all for guns but these types?? For?? To do what?

 

They said that about handguns in NY and we got the Sullivan Act.

They said the same thing about automatics and we got the NFA.

Now it is what they say about semi-autos and we have the safe act.

 

You don't think your hunting rifle is also on the list?

 

The goal is to eliminate all guns. They simply realize they can't do it all at once so they do it a piece at a time. Problem is that when all the "other" gun owners have been defeated, there won't be enough "hunters" left to make a difference when they come for the "rest" of the guns.

 

Why does anyone need a 6500# SUV that can travel >100mph? Put a 9-year old kid behind the wheel of one of those and let her loose on Arizona's 75mph highways. The result would likely be just as tragic. The only difference is that no one would be asking why someone needs a vehicle like that.

[NeverSeenNorHeard]

 

Edited August 27, 2014 by NeverSeenNorHeard

[ants]

Tragic, sad accident caused by total irresponsibility. The end.

[Mr VJP]

JRM is absolutely correct.  No gun owner should ever question why anyone needs a certain type of firearm, unless they want to give aid and comfort to the anti's who are already asking why anyone needs any type of gun.

 

[NeverSeenNorHeard]

Absolutely correct! We need to do our part to create more gun owners and ones that realize that point. 

[ants]

An irresponsible adult  hands a little girl a loaded 12 gauge double barrel. She fires. She naturally can't handle the recoil from the first barrel which causes the gun to  jerk to the side, which places the muzzle in front of the adult. Then   she accidentally fires the second barrel . Would we be talking about the type of gun or irresponsible adults?

[Vince1]

An irresponsible adult hands a little girl a loaded 12 gauge double barrel. She fires. She naturally can't handle the recoil from the first barrel which causes the gun to jerk to the side, which places the muzzle in front of the adult. Then she accidentally fires the second barrel . Would we be talking about the type of gun or irresponsible adults?

Exactly the point i made to my wife. She then made the comment maybe its better for only cops to have guns. I proceeded to google stories of officers and soldiers killing innocent people including there own kids.

Crazy and stupid people do tragic things. People need to use common sense

[ants]

Exactly the point i made to my wife. She then made the comment maybe its better for only cops to have guns. I proceeded to google stories of officers and soldiers killing innocent people including there own kids.

Crazy and stupid people do tragic things. People need to use common sense

Like I said ,,its a sad tragedy caused by a totally irresponsible adult. I don't mean to bash the guy who died, but thats all this is. I feel so bad for that little girl.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

They said that about handguns in NY and we got the Sullivan Act.

They said the same thing about automatics and we got the NFA.

Now it is what they say about semi-autos and we have the safe act.

 

You don't think your hunting rifle is also on the list?

 

The goal is to eliminate all guns. They simply realize they can't do it all at once so they do it a piece at a time. Problem is that when all the "other" gun owners have been defeated, there won't be enough "hunters" left to make a difference when they come for the "rest" of the guns.

 

Why does anyone need a 6500# SUV that can travel >100mph? Put a 9-year old kid behind the wheel of one of those and let her loose on Arizona's 75mph highways. The result would likely be just as tragic. The only difference is that no one would be asking why someone needs a vehicle like that.

Do you really think for one second that they would/could do away with all guns in Ny?  I dont believe it. I guess they would just use X-Bows and birth control for all the animal population problems. Not going to happen. Its a very few weapons that are not used or made for hunting and serves no use but for blowing holes in targets.  Buddy of mine just got his pistol permit in record time compared to what it used to take. 

Yes stupid people do stupid things but if one thing can be removed that serves no purpose then?????

[Elmo]

This thread could have easily gone in the direction of "when should you introduce guns to your kids or what gun do you start them out with" but naturally, it instead evolved into a pro-gun versus anti-gun rant.

[jrm]

Do you really think for one second that they would/could do away with all guns in Ny?  I dont believe it. I guess they would just use X-Bows and birth control for all the animal population problems. Not going to happen. Its a very few weapons that are not used or made for hunting and serves no use but for blowing holes in targets.  Buddy of mine just got his pistol permit in record time compared to what it used to take. 

Yes stupid people do stupid things but if one thing can be removed that serves no purpose then?????

 

Do you really think they will try to ban large size sodas? I think that is more "out there" than banning guns.

 

There are people who want to ban ALL guns. They keep trying. They win by increments. Their voice is bolstered by the general media and they are winning the public relations battle.

 

For all practical purposes, they banned guns in Australia and England. The anti-gunners point to those places as "civilized" examples. They note that the U.S. is "clinging to a wild west gun culture" which has "no place" in the modern world.

 

I absolutely believe that a ban on all guns is an extremely remote possibility at this time. Twenty years from now? Fifty? Who knows. Whatever it becomes, the foundation for those rules is being laid today.

 

I won't defend fully auto guns. They are heavily regulated and difficult enough to obtain. What I will point out is that the argument you are using against them is exactly the same argument that anti-gun and anti-hunting groups are using against you right now.

 

To a non-hunter or an anti-gun advocate, your hunting rifle "serves no purpose."

 

You don't NEED to hunt. You can get food at the supermarket "like everyone else." It is either a hobby or a business for you. If others choose to shoot full-autos at targets, their hobby or business is just as valid. If someone likes to fire automatic weapons, it is not place to question the validity of their pursuit. I say more power to them if they can afford to blow through ammo like that!

 

Gun owners are being attacked on all sides. I am not suggesting changing you opinion on automatics. That is a discussion for when they are common carry weapons. What I am suggesting is that gun owners need to stick together and present a united front - just like the anti-gunners do. If the break us down to self-defense vs target vs hunter vs collector, etc. than we will ALL lose.

[ants]

Do you really think for one second that they would/could do away with all guns in Ny?  I dont believe it. I guess they would just use X-Bows and birth control for all the animal population problems. Not going to happen. Its a very few weapons that are not used or made for hunting and serves no use but for blowing holes in targets.  Buddy of mine just got his pistol permit in record time compared to what it used to take. 

Yes stupid people do stupid things but if one thing can be removed that serves no purpose then?????

Do you really need a high powered, scoped sniper/military style bolt action rifle that is capable of killing at ranges out to 500+ yards? No one needs to have a rifle that can shoot hundreds of yards, to kill a deer!!! Bows and side lock muzzle loaders are more than capable of killing deer at "reasonable" ranges.

 

Servers no purpose , according to who.

[jrm]

This thread could have easily gone in the direction of "when should you introduce guns to your kids or what gun do you start them out with" but naturally, it instead evolved into a pro-gun versus anti-gun rant.

 

 

How is any of this a rant? 

 

Someone posted their opinion on a certain class of gun. He has every right to that opinion. I, and others, pointed out what we believe to be a flaw in his logic - a flaw that we think could come back to bite him. A simple discussion, handled in a civil matter.

 

I agree it would be a great opportunity to discuss appropriate timing for introducing kids to guns. instead of complaining (.e. rant) about other posts, why don't you elevate the level of conversation by starting it off? Lead by example and all that.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Do you really need a high powered, scoped sniper/military style bolt action rifle that is capable of killing at ranges out to 500+ yards? No one needs to have a rifle that can shoot hundreds of yards, to kill a deer!!! Bows and side lock muzzle loaders are more than capable of killing deer at "reasonable" ranges.

 

Servers no purpose , according to who.

For what a weapon was made for. Some say we dont have to hunt, Yup, Fine so what happens to all the animals that people know need to be controlled?  Ya know like the 40 thousand doe permits some area are getting. You think they will just send in the sticks and strings? . 

[Culvercreek hunt club]

For what a weapon was made for. Some say we dont have to hunt, Yup, Fine so what happens to all the animals that people know need to be controlled?  Ya know like the 40 thousand doe permits some area are getting. You think they will just send in the sticks and strings? . 

No but we have already seen the push to have "professional and trained paid shooters" to do it "safely" .....at tax payer expense I might add

[Borngeechee]

Well I already teach my 8 year old daughter gun safety but she hasn't been allowed to handle on yet. She and I have agreed that when she turns 12 that I'll buy her a pink single shot cricket. She'll then learn proper and safe shooting habits from there.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

As for the what age is appropriate? I am sure we are just days away from hearing about some bill to regulate that too. As in any parenting situation it should be up to the responsible parent to determine and decide when a child is ready for an activity. There are still details coming out on this but I bet the parents had little or no exposure to firearms prior to this. It was probably thought to be a great facebook post. They failed. The instructor failed too because he should have had the ability to determine the child's capabilities and if they weren't up to what was asked by the parents, he should have refused. IMO