Larry

i think your numbers for 3j is +11% 3h +30% sorry i'm a numbers guy

: I have the 2010 Deer Hunting Forecast there is a graph showing the harvest and bow hunter sighting rates from 1998-2009. What I found interesting is you would expect in 2005when the AR’s went in affect the deer take would go down. Now after 5 years you would expect to see a rebound in the harvest or at least a substantial increase in the bow hunter sightings rates of deer. What I would have to ask is where are the deer? the graph may be bow harvst it is the buck harvest 2010deer4castr3.pdf

Check this out off the DEC web site2010deer4castr3.pdf 2010deer4castr9.pdf 2010deer4castr8.pdf

I shot a p&y 10pt on 10/28 at 415 in the afternoon on a east side of a hill waited till 5 to track it. it was dark and I smelled it before I saw it.

lots of mass is not allways good for hunting it's good for the the deer but it spead them out more they have more places to feed. if your where the the deer are feeding at the time you will see alot of action

this report has the take per wmu in 2009 09deerrpt.pdf

Animal husbandry is the science in part; of selective breeding of Domestic livestock obtain more desirable traits, like more milk from a cow or bigger breast on a turkey. You also have to remember ½ the genes of any animal come from the female. When you put in a management plan that harvests primarily the biggest and best bucks you are giving what THEHUNTER calls scrub bucks a greater chance to breed not less. This is just fact you remove the best what do you have left. You may see that spike or 4pt. as a 6 or 8 the next year you may not. What you will probably see is a diminish gene pool down the line somewhere. This may be the just of the latest report out of PA.

Last night around 7pm I saw a big 12pt it will score between 150 & 160 now the hard part to get permission to get on the land to hunt it. This deer is in a non AR zone

I've stated before that i'm for QDM i just don't think it should be force on pepole who don't want it in the form of AR's I think there is room for all in deer hunting its worked for me in the tune of 8 P&Y's. this was the Survey done in zones 3&4 with only 356 responses

thats right but sales are not by WMU's only by county and state wide and when the servay was done they use d the counties in which they were located in

i shoot less than 3in groupes at 100yds with them

seen one tonight try but it got kicked in the head

Just to let you know that 77%you keep talking about is only 77% of 2.5% of the number of hunters who bought licenses in the area. Sullivan-6786, Ulster-7368 it’s just something else you should mention when you tell people about how 77% are in favor of AR’s. I change the percentages for this topic to match your percentage.

just would like to know why on one topic its 65% in favor and on this topic its 77%

Just to let you know that 65% you keep talking about is only 65% of 2.5% of the number of hunters who bought licenses in the area. Sullivan-6786, Ulster-7368 it’s just something else you should mention when you tell people about how 65% are in favor of AR’s.

??? So what you are saying it’s ok to shoot 1.5 year olds as long as they are not what you call scrubs. So you shoot the 1.5 year olds with the best potential and let the” scrubs” walk. With limited chances for a DMP I’m sure most guys will let that 6pt or basket 8 walk. Sounds like a good management plan to me.

that's based on a survey with a less than 20% return rate that’s outstanding proof for AR support.

> No one wants to take your AR zone away. Wow do you think there are people out there that feel the same as you when AR’s were put in place or think there WMU may go to AR’s. Guys like you with the screw you attitude I got mine and I don’t care about yours would be doing us all a favor by going to PETA.

if i read the law right you can't hunt with a x-bow untill 2011 so i don't think thire is a lot of guys lineing up yet

Hey Fasteddie thats baitting

If you want to see bigger bucks all you need to do is keep the deer population at about 80% of capacity and keep the buck to doe ratio at about 3 or 4 doe’s to every buck and you don’t have to let every small buck walk just most of them. Also some habitat improvement helps. It is that simple. And you don’t need AR’s. One more thing remember Bio. 101 a over abundance of males is detrimental to specie survival .

Could QDM be a prime factor in the lower number of deer sightings? We all heard it at the end of deer season on wed sites or in publications from other hunters; I hunted all season and only saw 6 deer all season. Then we start looking for someone or something to blame. We blame the DEC because we think the herd size estimates are wrong, we blame coyotes, to many nuisance permits being given out and even cars. All these are factors and there are more one of the biggest factors is hardly mentioned and that’s “US” myself included. When we all first started to hear about QDM and its management style; we were told if we wanted to see bigger bucks we needed to let small bucks walk, manage does (kill more does) this is not the same as antlerless. We were told the buck to doe ratio was way off and needed to be 1 to 1 this ratio is not correct. The harvesting of doe’s makes scents; to control a population you need to add or subtract females. We were also told that if we killed Does we would see more bucks. I do not think that is necessarily true and I can prove it. When I say doe’s I mean females 1.5 years old and older not antlerless. Because at any time before the deer season ½ to 2/3’s of the antlerless population on a piece of land are fawns. If on your land you have 15 doe’s and 5 bucks (1.5 years and older) and you kill 10 doe’s and no bucks you still only have 5 bucks. What you have done is reduced the number of doe’s by 2/3’s. What you will see are more buck sightings per doe sighting and you will see fewer fawns the next year. Another example is in Allegany County a farmer started a QDM program on his 1700 acres. He went out at night spot lighting to see what kind of deer he had and he saw lots of antlerless deer. For 3 years they took over 40 doe’s a year using DMP’s and DMAP’s. He would let you hunt there but you had to kill doe’s no bucks. They would kill a few big bucks. Then in years 4-6 they started to kill fewer and fewer doe’s by year 6 they killed less than 10 doe’s and no bucks, saw plenty of bucks before the season but killed none. Funny thing started to happen, his neighbors started to kill big bucks. They were not killing off their doe’s so the bucks were moving to where the does are. What I believe he did was not only destroy his doe population he also destroyed the age structure of his doe herd. This is what I believe we are doing under the miss guided concept of killing doe’s gives you more bucks and the myth of the 1 to 1 buck to doe ratio. If anyone can show me how killing doe’s can give you more bucks that’s a trick I would like to see. With a birth rate at 50/50 bucks to doe’s I am not advocating not shooting doe’s

fairgame witch one the 2009 harvest report or the AR report I've read both

Thehunter you hunt in a AR zone and you have taken the option of killing any buck away so your numbers are skewed. If you still could shoot any buck even with 72% saying they are in favor of AR’s you would have a harvest rate of about 70% 1.5yearolds.

nice if he were in the AR zone you could still shoot him more then 3pts a side