Buckstopshere

Cool shots! And congrats on the nice buck!

There are a number of reasons why I go after big bucks. But mainly if the truth be known, it is because, to me, there is really nothing quite like seeing a mature, rutting buck in a one-on-one hunting situation. The feeling, the intensity is indescribable.

Beautiful buck! Congrats on a great 9 point! If you were going by just a gross score, I'd say about 135, but surely a minimum P&Y even with the deductions and New York Big Buck Club buck! GREAT bases, and the beam length is decent.

No, not late at all. Perfect and predicted. Just as every year, peaking the week after the Full Moon. Just that our calendar date every year varies.

I have to take issue when you say "does are smarter," I think that bucks, old bucks I have known are just as smart as any doe, and more-so because they get away with running around with big racks. Sorry couldn't resist putting a little stupid humor in conversation.

Like in Pa. those guys need to wait another 10 years. LOL

Way to go! Looks a lot like my first buck. That was a few (ahemmm) years ago. But the feeling transcends the time and when I see the smile on your face in the photo, takes me back. Congrats!! And thanks for sharing the kill.

And it is only right we should bring Pa. into this conversation as their opening day was yesterday. I talked to some guys and asked them how many shots they heard ( North Central near the NY border.) They said...oh we heard a few. And that is the point, there is so few deer in Pa. now, I don't even get a license! AR's! Since ARs, the Pa. deer (buck) take has plummeted. All the deer hunters with tag soup...and not necessary, all for timber and the AR Koolaid drinkers.

If you can say one thing about hunting, it is that it is a learning experience. As one deer hunter, IMO hunting has to have the juice in it that it used to have to compete with the theoretical or virtual realms. And it does... there's nothing like quite like...Scoring! Perhaps some of our brethren have forgotten what their first kills were like.

Good question. I think the main thing we lose is other hunters. Now you can look at it as losing competition..."hey, more for me!" Or look it at like...the tradition of deer hunting is something I want to pass on to the young folk. I understand the former, but I am big time on the side of the latter point. We need to keep young people or new hunter's fingers in a little blood.

That's a good observation. I agree. The strange thing is that I saw and passed more bucks than ever, had more different bucks on my trail cams (on four properties) and saw very few rubs...but more scrapes. Are the bucks turning into lovers and not fighters...

I've fresh rubs as late as late January some years. If does are still coming into estrus, bucks will retain their antlers, dominance pheromones, and attitude. "It ain't over til its over."

Two state game biologists at the deer processor aged him at 8.5. Weighed 203 lb. field dressed there. Probably should send a tooth in to be sure.

Bon Appetit!

The weight will vary some depending on when the fawn hit the ground (early May to July) and the buck fawns are generally larger than their sisters. A long time ago a I bet a hunting buddy that he would not get 25 pounds of boned out meat from the fawn he shot. He proved me wrong. He had 26 pounds of boned out meat in a roasting pan total, but had to scrape every bone including between the ribs. Not much quantity, but the quality is excellent.

I did pass on both of them. The point is shoot the yearling because the 8 pt. will really be a stud the following year. IMO there is little doubt which of the two bucks in the photo would be the superior animal the following year.

I can not tell or remember all the hunting lands that I have lost the rights to hunt on for one reason or another. Ownership change, leasing in lieu of sweat equity (like in your case,) problems caused by other hunters making up stories to the landowners, company policy change, local law (hunting regs) change, and whim of the landowner...(all of a sudden doesn't like bowhunting because of something he read, etc.) and that is just off the top of my head. Like some of the other posters said, "Move on." But that is why I have a number of hunting spots and I visit each and every landowner and help them with stuff throughout the year...from contracting work, cutting wood, etc. Some are small, some are large. But don't burn your bridges! Sure you'd like to tell him how you feel. Suck it up. Be a man. Tell him that next year, if things don't work out with the big money guys...you would like to make sure you still have your foot in the door and this doesn't happen again and that your mutually beneficial relationship needs to be at least a handshake deal. You have enough sweat equity invested to position yourself for the future. Nevagiveup.

I appreciate your comments NFA-ADK. Here is a better photo. I still think the closer buck, the 3-point is a yearling. Being so close to the camera, the younger buck appears larger than it is. Like when we hold fish out close to the camera so they look bigger...lol But it is not 100% outside the realm of possibility that it could be a 2.5... though slim IMO. But the point still remains...which one would you shoot?

One other perspective. Years ago, I took an old neighbor gobbler hunting. He had shot many gobblers...but he was 80 years old and his eyesight and hearing were just about gone, but I did not know they were as bad as they were. He talked a great game. I called in a tom, right to him. He never saw it or heard it. Moral of the story...old people can have such deteriorated senses...anything is possible.

Possible. But I would not hang my hat on it. Just as likely, he may have been a four point... a big fork at 5.5 and in later years finally sprouted brow tines.

Well what is the bell curve? Since we have so few examples of old bucks in the wild...not farmed deer with farmed deer genetics and minerals, my point is that this six point may be the center of the curve. The 150 class 4.5 year old is the outlier on the extreme in a wild setting. And that is what we are talking about.

That's the crux of the issue, isn't it? From my limited experience, I believe that there are a lot more of these sub-par bucks, as yearlings out there. And if they get old...which of course few do. They are like this six point.

How 'bout a sub-100 class 8.5 year old taken two weeks ago? What do you think he scores? Here's two views. (By the way, a great animal!)

Buddy of mine shot a 8.5 year old buck in Connecticut this year during archery. Six point. Huge bases. Weighted 203 pounds, dressed. Most of us would love to shoot an animal like that. But the point is that most will never grow tines and be high scoring critters if the genes ain't there. Just big, ugly bucks.

Here are a few of the ugliest bucks on my trail cams over the last few years. Which one is No. 1 ugliest buck in your opinion? Will they ever be great animals, ones that we dream about?