nyantler

Depends on who you talk to i think.. I have heard the same kind of things from PA hunters... usually the successful guys love it the unsuccessful ones seem to hate it.

Don't get all cranked up about this buck.. it is not a NYS record.. thats all I can say for now.

Yeah a friend of mine sent it on his phone to me yesterday.. it is a guy that he works with.. suppose to have been taken near Watertown..

So true..and the fact that the proof of the success of the program is evident and there are still hunters not satisfied tells me that those hunters really don't care about the objective of th law. I'm sure it is because they themselves didn't kill something... harvest numbers have about leveled out to where they were before in those areas with the same percentage of hunters being the ones that are successful... so that kind of proves that there is always going to be a greater percentage of hunters that don't get a buck regardless of AR's... so nothing has really changed but the ages of bucks available to the 30 or so percent that harvest a buck each year. The rest are still dissatisfied like they were before.

It seems to be a topic many new fellas have a lot of interest in.

I like the fact that at least you're being honest about why you aren't keen on AR's and havent tried to make a weak argument against them based on misinformation.... that I can except.

"I think" is not an answer to the question it is your opinion of what the answer might be... I answered the original question a long time ago... this is a new question that doesn't have an answer yet because it is not specified in the law. and I'm thinking that if the goal is to keep hunters from shooting yearlings, a spike with two stickers would still constitute a yearling... and anyone taking that buck (although maybe legal) has no regard for the objective of the law... therefore.. with that kind of thinking there is no reason to have an AR trying to achive that objective because it doesn;t stand a chance of succeeding. How's that for staying on the topic?

I didn't ask you how you measured sucess.. I asked you how you felt about the AR thats been forced on NY for 100 years. I wasn't attempting an insult I was wondering why you're only against the new forcing and not the old forcing.

I'm starting to think that mandatory AR's are not a good idea... with that kind of thinking they could not possible be sucessful anyway... I just wondering... if a 1" spike is ok with you then you'd be ok with the DEC just issuing you a couple extra doe tags in place of any buck tag at all?

It didn't count as a doe when it was first imposed... there were no doe permits then... it was designed to protect does from being shot when deer were almost none existent in NY... I'm sure there were plenty of hunters back then that hated the law regardless of it's objective. So, maybe it shouldn't have been imposed on the hunting community?

You're right.. but it still is not forcing anything on a hunter that already practices it. I didn't say it wasn't forcing anything on the guy that didn't practice it. If we made rules based on 100% approval of any group.. we wouldn't have any rules at all.. just anarchy.

sorry jjb4900.. I went back and read your posts again and see that you do shoot yearlings.. I stand corrected... it is being forced on you. How do you feel about the antler restriction that has been in place for the last 100 years across NY?

How is it being forced on you? You said you don't shoot yearlings so it should affect you at all...

The difference would be that he wouldn't be 1.5... he would have another year of age and experience making him a bit harder to see or kill therefore increasing his chances of reaching physical maturity... my point though is that the 3 on a side rule is not designed to produce big bucks... just to protect the majority of the yearlings to give bucks a leg up on reaching an older age. Restrictions need to be much higher to produce trophy deer on a large scale

Sure.. If you are already only hunting mature bucks the law does not affect you, therefore nothing is being forced on you... it is only being forced on those that still hunt yearling bucks. I don't hunt yearlings therefore nothing is being imposed on me... it would take a five on a side law for them to be forcing anything on me... well maybe a 4 on a side law... I would defintiely kill a 6 pointer that scores over 100.

here is the pic Doc... the measurement across the bottom of the point cannot exceed the the length

Yes... sorry... that was suppose to be width ..It is the diameter of the point where it meets the beam measured parallel to the beam... I have a pic I can show you but I'm having trouble loading it up. I am kind of glad you asked this question.. because it raises another question that I had not thought of... I wonder if they are talking about typical points only or if non-typical points count as well... because that would change the whole dynamic of the law. Although it is rare for a young buck to sport non-typical points.. it is possible.. and I'm sure the situation could arise somewhere in NY. Hmmmmm. Not another can of worms!!! Or is that a hornets nest???

If you are looking for loads of big bucks from a 3 on a side antler restriction you'd better not hold your breath... that is not a big enough restriction to produce boat loads of HUGE bucks... all it does is add a few more mature deer to the next couple age classes by protecting yearlings.

It can't be forced on you.. because you don't do it... I have been voluntarily passing on young bucks for almost 20 years... a 3 points on a side AR would never be forcing me to do anything... it would just be protecting most of the yearlings... the mandate is designed because most don't and won't voluntarily practice AR.. so the mandate is the only way to protect yearling bucks.. so if in fact that is what the goal is then that is the only way to accomplish it... NOW.. if the goal of AR's was to keep hunters from bickering with one another that would be a foolish mandate because we all know that wouldn't work...LOL

Welcome DOG!

True.. but that 2.5 year old will be a little harder to kill the next year... thats why it takes a few years for harvest numbers to get back to normal when an AR program is started... not enough older deer and the ones that are older are not as easy to kill as the yearlings were.. eventually the age classes balance out and harvest numbers return to normal except those bucks being harvested are now mature bucks instead of yearlings... unfortunately, those looking for the next world record will be disappointed because the 3 on a side rule is not meant to, and will not, produce super old bucks. It only protects the yearlings... which leaves a little room for bucks to gain some age... it by no means will ever be a way to grow a large crop of huge bucks. The restrictions would have to be far greater as in a QDM program to do that.

Bucks taken in the antler restriction area must have at least one antler with 3 or more points that are at least one inch long measured from the top of the beam to the tip of the point... the base wide can not exceed the length of the point..

Can't disagree with that..LOL

You can believe what you want.. but it is not natural for bucks in the herd to have a less than balanced age structure... that was created by the way NY has managed the herd over the last 100 years... just because the herd survives doesn't mean that it is necessarily healthy... when fawns are being born late in summer that is not healthy... when young bucks are doing all the breeding instead of building body weight that is not healthy.. when the buck to doe ratios reach 20:1 that is not healthy.. there has been a consistant number of whitetails in NY for over 50 years... what you call overpopulation is due to rapid habitat lose and the displacement of complete herds to smaller areas combined with a dramatc drop in hunter numbers.. especially in the 90's... I'll stop there.. because i agree that the larger motive for most AR supporters are large bucks... i disagree that AR's by themselves are a bad idea for NY as a means to protect young bucks and balance out the age structure...i do not support AR's for any other reason.. I think they make sense for their inteded objective...

just like you probably wouldn't shoot a 10 pointer and say "Boy I wish he was smaller"