Curmudgeon

I have been pleasantly surprised with the numbers this spring. There have been 3 long-beards displaying in the field next door for weeks. I accidentally bumped one off a nest a couple of days ago. I've been out cutting wood the past few days. There is turkey sign all over. I'm relatively high in my town. The birds left the hill early in the winter. I was not seeing them anywhere until farmers started spreading manure in March and bare spots of ground started showing. I don't know how they survived. I suspect that winter survival may vary according to local conditions.

If you massage them and feed them beer, you could have the Kobe version.

Do coyotes really eat "welfare scum" - corporate or otherwise?

When I was young, I always assumed the combination of self righteousness and anger made me bullet-proof. Some of my family tell stories about me. Whether or not I had good judgement in my twenties, as the song says, "I'm still here".

Bald Eagles prefer eating carrion to hunting. I'm not saying it didn't kill a turkey but it would certainly love to feed on one something else had killed. That's why I asked if you saw it kill your bird. I've never heard a report of a Bald Eagle attacking Wild Turkeys. Goldens do but they are so rare as to have any impact become meaningless. I'm not clear on the turkey inside the fence. Was it dead?

You've seen an eagle kill a chicken? Where?

I haven't and didn't bother to read the animal rights stuff. Good luck painting me with that brush. Nothing else you provided is news. Your studies do nothing but confirm what everybody knows: Coyotes kill fawns. So what. Outside the Forest Preserves, this doesn't matter a bit. It is possible to kill enough to increase fawn recruitment. However, you cannot do this in real life. Outside an enclosure, it is impossible. You cannot manage coyotes on a landscape scale. It has been tried for over a century out west. Ask 4 Seasons - the esteemed member of the He-Man Coyote Haters Club - about coyotes. He will tell you of being overrun year after year in spite of relentless killing of coyotes. Your message suggests there is a lack of deer. 55% percent of the deer killed in NYS last fall were not adult males. Why is this? It is by design. The goal is to reduce deer numbers in New York. If you want more deer, convince the DEC and the Deer Management Task Forces across the state. That would have much more impact than killing coyotes. Coyotes are here to stay. They evolved to respond as a population and reproduce quickly when predated by wolves. Nothing you or anyone else does will impact their population across the landscape. For every one you kill there is a young one looking to move in and establish a territory. If you left the dominant adults in place, you would be better off, or at least no worse off. Many things are possible but the cost benefit equation on this one is all screwed up. It would require year-round hunting on a landscape scale, and the removal of something like 40% of the coyotes annually (I don't remember the exact number) to reduce their population. You can find the study if you have time to spend searching. Killing coyotes for anything other than sport or fur is nothing more than an emotional release. Kill the competition - whether it makes any difference or not. You can get the same release working on a heavy bag.

There is no benefit to turkey or deer populations from killing coyotes. I said do your homework. It isn't about coyotes vs. game. You failed. Coyotes increase their reproduction when persecuted. The science has been done over and over. A stable population limits its size. A disturbed population reproduces rapidly.

Any coyote season during a period when pelts are not prime is asinine. The underlying assumption is that shooting coyote reduces the population. Please do your homework. We've covered this ground many times.

Interesting sub-topic on whether or not to carry a firearm whenever in the woods. I never carrying a firearm unless I plan to kill something. I have confronted armed trespassers on several occasions, choosing to go unarmed. I doubt any rational person would commit murder or manslaughter over being confronted about trespassing. The only time I did armed myself with a firearm was when the dog was barking at someone just out of sight of the house during deer season. The hunter had to have been within 150' of the house but hidden in dense hemlocks. I was calling the dog - who would not stop barking and come to me - when I heard his shotgun go off. The dog came running home with an 1/8" deep crease along her nose. He tried to kill my dog. I put on boots, grabbed my shotgun and went out. By the time I got to the area he was gone. I saw someone driving out on the dead end road that bordered my back line but had no way to stop him except to jump in front of his car, and no evidence.

You may want to follow up with ECO Card in a few days. I have had some experience with him. A second call/inquiry might be helpful moving this up on his priority list.They are busy and the squeaky wheel..................

There would be no harm in calling the DEC law enforcement. They may be known to the local ECO. Even if hunting out of season and trespassing cannot be proven, they attempted petty larceny. A visit from him might discourage them from going on the property again.

Some people in Otsego and Delaware Counties lose feeders every year. A friend in Roseboom last week. He always stops too late and has gone through multiple feeders over the years. Friends in Walton only feed during the winter.

Interesting. Some of the volunteer eagle researchers have been stopped multiple times while carrying carcasses in winter. I have never been stopped, even in the winter with a truck load of deer. I went past a trooper in Richfield Springs back in February. I had at least 6 deer in the truck stacked with feet pointing up. I waved. He watched me go by. It was below zero. I don't think he wanted to get out of his warm car.

We skin our deer within a couple of hours of killing them. They do not leave the property whole. To have to put them in a truck and travel a distance would be a nuisance and a burden. We report all the deer we kill - with an occasional oversight. I might stop reporting if I have to truck it somewhere.

Look out CO, WA, DC and everywhere else that wants to legalize pot.

To assume deer hunting is safe solely because it is a money maker is not wise. If it is safe, it has as much to do with the interests of agriculture, gardeners, and insurance companies.

I have the basic model Cub Cadet. I'm quite pleased with it. The main reason I bought it was they gave me a very good trade on an old farm tractor. The sport machine dealers weren't interested in the tractor. My father uses it to get in and out of the woods during deer season. I use it to carry tools and generally carry a load of wood to the house whenever I am up the hill. A local dealer's delivery guy told me he prefers the Cub Cadet over the Kubota. They sell them both.

One neighbor in Burlington called me when a fawn died in her yard. It became eagle bait. Another person called with the same situation from Morris at the beginning of April but I had stopped putting out bait so didn't want it. I have not found any winter killed deer. However, a lot of rabbits got eaten this winter.

I agree. The hunters know that the deer at the processors could be checked - that it is out of their control. Many deer - including those taken here - never travel on a road except in little white wrapped packages.

Larry - Thanks for sending the file. Doc is right about the statistical calculations on reporting. I was told that the ECOs are starting to ticket the unreported deer at the processors. The numbers look good for my town - 5.0 bucks per square mile, 9.2 total deer per square mile. 4F had 7 deer taken per square mile. The hunters who want to increase the number of deer by not filling DMPs are wasting their time. DEC knows that some hunters apply for and receive DMPs with no intention of filling them. That is one reason for the high number of unfilled tags.

Mike - The bear suit was in 1990 - pre-internet. The only reference I can find on-line is here - http://nyhoundsmen.org/. The suit was brought by the SPCA. It is understandable why the swan plan drew the response it did. Mute swans are some of the most visible, beautiful "wildlife" seen by urban people. It was never about science. It is not about hunting per se. It is about something beautiful that they love to watch. It is purely emotional. Kill all the feral pigs you want. They don't care. Bears? Bears are an abstraction to the swan lovers. Bears taken with snares and bait will draw the attention of the anti-hunters as it did in ME.

It has been a while since I read the bear plan. Hounds for bear were stopped after a lawsuit. So, it should require an act of the legislature to change that. Snares, bait, hounds will all cause outrage at some level. You cannot remove politics from these decisions. The amount of money (deer) hunting puts into the economy is only one of many factors. The opposition's money, the public's ethical/moral perceptions, the number of voters pulling levers, all these matter more to a urban politician than deer hunting dollars. And, it isn't about "whose science", it is about whose goals and priorities are served by politicians. Politicians run governments, and therefore wildlife programs.

Doc is right, in referendum states votes not dollars make the rules. Many people who do not like hunting know that deer hunting is a necessity. However, some of the who are most idealistic might prefer there were wolves and mountain lions in our agricultural and suburban areas to keep the population under control. Wouldn't that be welcome.

A friend - a flint knapper - had to go to a deer farm to kill an animal with an atlatl. He says it a lot harder than you might think. The arm movement really draws attention.