The truth about coyotes

[Curmudgeon]

I too found G-man's post somewhat bizarre. I was surprised. He seems so well informed on some subjects.

Wolves are relatively easy to extirpate. They are genuinely at the top of the food chain. Coyotes are only the top of the food chain here because there are no wolves. Coyotes evolved in the context of wolves preying on them, and persecuting them because they were competition on some level. The evolutionary response was to increase reproduction under pressure. I am aware of 2 strategies: increased litter size; and, when dominate pairs - those that limit reproduction by young animals - are disrupted by one or both being killed, their relatively large territories are fractured and taken over by young animals. This results in a net increase in reproductive pairs.

We (not me but some of you) have taken on the role of wolves in trying to eliminate coyotes. The coyotes in turn are reproducing like mad.

[Jeremy K]

22 minutes ago, Curmudgeon said:

I too found G-man's post somewhat bizarre. I was surprised. He seems so well informed on some subjects.

Wolves are relatively easy to extirpate. They are genuinely at the top of the food chain. Coyotes are only the top of the food chain here because there are no wolves. Coyotes evolved in the context of wolves preying on them, and persecuting them because they were competition on some level. The evolutionary response was to increase reproduction under pressure. I am aware of 2 strategies: increased litter size; and, when dominate pairs - those that limit reproduction by young animals - are disrupted by one or both being killed, their relatively large territories are fractured and taken over by young animals. This results in a net increase in reproductive pairs.

We (not me but some of you) have taken on the role of wolves in trying to eliminate coyotes. The coyotes in turn are reproducing like mad.

Dan Flores talks specifically on how the 2 differ and gives some insight on the comment about wolves being easier to eliminate. Wolves are so pack driven that it is directly the reason they were so easy to eliminate . When yotes are pressured ,they have no problem heading to splitsville. Wolves are easy to target ,once one member is killed or trapped ,they use the scent of that wolf to lure the rest of the pack in.

[G-Man]

3 hours ago, Doewhacker said:

I found this claim odd so I looked into it and it turns out Coyotes weren’t seen in the North east until the early 1900’s and more widely from about 1930 on. So basically I’m saying you are wrong. 

 

Wolves were eliminated early on but not Coyotes because they simply weren’t here. 

 

http://www.dec.ny.gov/animals/9359.html

 

http://www.esf.edu/pubprog/brochure/coyote/coyote.htm

The dec is incorrect http://www.pgc.pa.gov/Education/WildlifeNotesIndex/Pages/ECoyote.aspx I have worked on several palentological site in N.Y. and the coyote was here and disappeared several times as the game commission says.. The return in The 30s whether from remnant populations in remote areas or new influx from the West or North mixing with wolf is what dec is referring to.. Fact is they were here gone and back..

The California condor also use to call nys home by the way..

Edited November 9, 2017 by G-Man

[Curmudgeon]

Can you refer us to something published? Preferably, peer reviewed.

Edited November 9, 2017 by Curmudgeon
Autocorrect

[Doewhacker]

1 hour ago, G-Man said:

The dec is incorrect http://www.pgc.pa.gov/Education/WildlifeNotesIndex/Pages/ECoyote.aspx I have worked on several palentological site in N.Y. and the coyote was here and disappeared several times as the game commission says.. The return in The 30s whether from remnant populations in remote areas or new influx from the West or North mixing with wolf is what dec is referring to.. Fact is they were here gone and back..

The California condor also use to call nys home by the way..

I can't see where you are coming up with that. From the link you provided..

 

"History

Fossil records indicate coyotes have existed in what is today eastern North America since the Pleistocene period, a million years ago. Occurrence has been intermittent over that time, and only in the past 75 years has the animal appeared to become common. The coyote's status in Pennsylvania during the 1700s and 1800s is clouded with that of the wolf. Old bounty records indicate both coyotes and wolves from other sections of the country were fraudulently turned in as wolves here during the late 1800s.

Little is known of the wolf in Pennsylvania, or if indeed the same animal now called the "eastern coyote" in fact might have been similar to the wolf of the past. Pictures dating to the 1930s have appeared over the years in the Pennsylvania Game Commission's magazine Game News. These animals look like the same coyotes being killed today. The first coyote identified as an animal similar to what we today call the "eastern coyote" was killed in Tioga County in 1940.

In the late 1960s, it appears an influx of coyotes entered northern Pennsylvania from the Catskill Mountains in New York, and from there they spread south and west across the state. In the 1970s, the highest population in Pennsylvania was in the Pocono Mountains. The coyote continued to expand its range during the late 1970s and occupied the entire state by 1990, with the highest populations across the northern half of the state."

 

If anything it furthers what the DEC and others state, wolves first, then Coyote's after Wolves are gone. Wolves do not typically cohabitate with Coyote's.  

More links to deny,

https://www.massaudubon.org/learn/nature-wildlife/mammals/coyotes/historical-background

https://historicalechoes.weebly.com/eastern-coyote.html

http://www.pressherald.com/2016/01/24/hunting-eastern-coyotes-are-here-and-theyre-a-challenging-quarry/

http://www.maine.gov/ifw/docs/species_planning/mammals/easterncoyote/speciesassessment.pdf

[nyantler]

13 hours ago, G-Man said:

Poison.. Deforestaion and. Trapping.. Work wonders. 

Of all the animals that were native to N.Y. and allowed back and then protected coyotes crazy.. Why not reintroduce elk....

Dwindling habitat would cause a problem because the elk would be competing for the same food as the whitetails

[G-Man]

http://www.wow.com/wiki/Coyote.

Sources are at end of article. Some of the oldest Fossil have been found in pa caves and West Virginia. The historic evidence is that many coyote were considered small wolves by colonists. Though wolves did control the population best ..fact is they were killed and turned in as wolves for bounty.. They were not scientifically recognised as a separate species untill late 1800s by that time they were eliminated or pushed back into wildernes Ares same as deer and turkeys.. They were here .. We have new hybrids here as well that started apearing in the 40s. .19 different subspecies are now recognised..