Why not Blaze Orange?

[orion]

After reading 9 pages of blaze orange I noticed many people didn't say why they didn't wear blaze orange. Some actually take it off or change hats when they get to there spot.

I was wondering why you don't or even go to the lengths of changing? 

For the most part I find the blaze orange to be as good as if not better camo than the majority of the stuff you find in stores. As soon as the weather gets cold my blaze comes out doesn't matter what season it is.

I am not a big fan of making it a requirement unless of course they can get ever Tom, Dick and Harriet out for a walk to also wear it. Then it might just be comical enough to do.

[Doc]

I'm not sure I buy into the argument that if blaze orange is made mandatory, everything that not orange is going to get blown to bits. At least I have never seen anyone actually look into that in any scientific way. I've heard the argument used before, even by our former Governor ...... Pataki, but I just don't buy it. There are a lot of other states that don't buy into it either (most of them).

By the way, there is one more benefit to blaze orange that nobody mentioned on the other thread. That is that when I spot even a flicker of orange off through the woods, that is an instant signal NOT to shoot in that direction. I don't even have to see enough of the individual to make out a human form. Just a glimpse or a brief flash of that color signals that I cannot shoot in that direction. In fact it more often becomes a signal that I had better be moving on and put some distance between us. No such instant warning signal exists with someone in camo.

The opposite of this has also occurred. Hunters coming in late have spotted me glowing away in my stand and turned and moved directly away.

Doc

[woodsdweller]

think about it how many times have you spotted that flicker of orange to only find out it is flagging/marking tape of some kind. but it got your attention you went of full alert that there may be a fello hunter in front of you. i always wore red and black plaid growing up until my wife and i went to utah on a hunt and when you can spot someone on the next mt. w/blaze i was sold and wear it ever since. you dont have to look like a pumpkin, just a hat and a vest.

[SteveMcD]

Yup.. I concur with what Woodsdweller said.

Another point... it is movement that will get you busted by a whitetail.. not the color of your clothing.

[bushnell]

I always wear orange when I hunt with the exception of early archery season. I would like to see NY go to some type of requirement. It doesn't have to be like PA. PA requires 250 sq. inches of orange on your head, back and chest combined during certain seasons. I would like to see NY go to atleast an orange hat which is visible 360 degrees.

[sweet old bill]

I think I have shot just as many deer with orange on as with camo. I hunt a lot of public land and you have to be a fool to hunt it without orange on. I also seem to see that in most of the cases were hunters shoot member of there own party it is due to they all are wearing camo in gun season. MY hunting buddy say he see more guys hunting his posted land with camo on. He see them part and then walk thru his posters. He now just takes the plate number and then goes right after them and tell them no to hunt his land they do not have permission. If found again he will call the cops...

[Mr VJP]

I feel Blaze Orange laws are like seat belt laws and motorcycle helmet laws.  Where does the state get off telling anyone they must do something for their own safety or get a fine?

It should be an advisory and not a law.  If Blaze Orange is a good thing and someone chooses not to wear it, they take the chance of getting hurt, but they don't hurt anyone else.  Some people feel it does affect their success rate, especially on older mature bucks.  If it isn't seen by deer, why don't bowhunters wear it?  It is noticed by deer when they are on alert and moving carefully, especially by older deer that have experienced a few hunting seasons.

When I hunt my own land I wear an Orange hat going in to my stand, or when I decide to move.  I do not wear it when I'm on stand at all.  If I see another hunter approach, I'll get out the hat and show it to them.  That's my choice and my decision.  I understand the risk and I am OK with it.

I always wear Orange on Public Land though, just as I always wear my seat belt in the car and helmet when on the race bike.  The risk is too great not to and would be foolish in my opinion.  Once again, freedom of choice for everyone.  IMHO The government should have no say in what you choose to do regarding your own safety.

[Doc]

If Blaze Orange is a good thing and someone chooses not to wear it, they take the chance of getting hurt, but they don't hurt anyone else. 

See, I really don't believe that is a true statement. Nobody lives in a vacuum. First of all, most hunters have families that depend on them for food and shelter. So right away, such an irresponsible approach to hunting safety has a likelyhood of putting a family in destitute situation, sometimes temporarily, sometimes the effect becomes permanent. If the situation is severe enough, the burden of the family can be turned over to the taxpayer. Besides the family, there are friends that are impacted. Also, the shooter is impacted. Yes most of the time their carelessness contributed to the accident, but as far as I'm concerned some guy sneaking around in the bushes in camo during a gun season certainly bears part of the responsibility for the shooting. You've heard of suicide by cop? Well running around the woods in camo as I have personally witnessed several times is tantamount to "suicide by hunter". And of course there is the situation where death does not occur but rather results in catastrophic wounding or a prolonged death in which the family exhausts all of their insurance money and whatever resources they may have and are left destitute, in which case again it is the taxpayer once again to the rescue.

So anyone who thinks that there is only one victim in hunting accidents is not seeing the entire picture of the residue of such accidents. No, blaze orange is not a cure-all, but the statistics linked on the other B/O thread show without a doubt that B/O does save lives during firearms deer seasons in states that have the common sense to make it mandatory. There is no such data or even logic that says that the same effect of B/O would be expected in any other hunting season.

Doc

[fasteddie]

I wear Blaze Orange but don't feel that is should be mandatory ...........

[Doc]

I wear Blaze Orange but don't feel that is should be mandatory ...........

And the obvious question would be ...... why not?

[Lawdwaz]

250 sq in in the form a vest is a no brainer during gun seasons.  I'd rather not have it be a hat, just a vest of some sort.

Easy, pencil in the new law.

[Mr VJP]

Doc wrote:

See, I really don't believe that is a true statement. Nobody lives in a  vacuum. First of all, most hunters have families that depend on them  for food and shelter. So right away, such an irresponsible approach to  hunting safety has a likelihood of putting a family in destitute  situation, sometimes temporarily, sometimes the effect becomes  permanent.

Each hunter is responsible for his own actions.  If you don't have life insurance, you are a fool.  You could get hit by a truck on your way to your deer hunt and suffer the same consequences as being shot by another hunter

If the situation is severe enough, the burden of the family  can be turned over to the taxpayer. Besides the family, there are  friends that are impacted.

Turn the burden over to the shooter and his family then.

Also, the shooter is impacted. Yes most of  the time their carelessness contributed to the accident.

Most of the time??  All of the Time!!  How can anyone not see where the responsibility of the shooting lies.  If you enter the woods with a rifle, you are totally responsible for anything bad that happens from your use of that rifle.

But as far as  I'm concerned some guy sneaking around in the bushes in camo during a  gun season certainly bears part of the responsibility for the shooting. 

Now you sound like a Lawyer trying to deflect blame from his client.  Rule *1 of gun safety - Know your target!  Don't submit to a "Blame the victim mentality".  Women get raped because they dress provocatively??  No Sir.  The blame lies with the person who failed to observe proper safety measures with that rifle.

You've heard of suicide by cop? Well running around the woods in camo  as I have personally witnessed several times is tantamount to "suicide  by hunter".

I said I wear an Orange hat until I'm on stand.  And I do that because I fear someone who shoots at anything that moves.  There is a law against that already, is there not?  And there should be because you hurt someone besides yourself if you break it.  What slays me is the warden giving a ticket to the guy not wearing orange.  You are being fined because the state allows unsafe hunting in the woods.

And of course there is the situation where death does not  occur but rather results in catastrophic wounding or a prolonged death  in which the family exhausts all of their insurance money and whatever  resources they may have and are left destitute, in which case again it  is the taxpayer once again to the rescue.

This is saying the shooter is not accountable.  I believe he is.  Sue the SOB who is responsible for the shooting.  The taxpayers didn't pull the trigger.  The shooter, and his estate, deserve to be held fully responsible for his actions.

So anyone who thinks  that there is only one victim in hunting accidents is not seeing the  entire picture of the residue of such accidents.

The shooter creates only one victim.  The man without a plan for his family, should anything happen to him, creates more.  Society, that allows the responsible party to get away with it, creates more still.

No, blaze orange is  not a cure-all, but the statistics linked on the other B/O thread show  without a doubt that B/O does save lives during firearms deer seasons  in states that have the common sense to make it mandatory.

If we wish to allow the government to decide what we can or can not do on the basis of saving lives, we will have no freedom at all and will have to submit to a Nanny State legal system.  Besides can I sue the state if I'm wearing Orange and get shot anyway?

There is no  such data or even logic that says that the same effect of B/O would be  expected in any other hunting season.

Never said it would.  The point was it sure as heck doesn't help you harvest deer.  I'll go as far as to say it may even prevent it.  I'll stand by a man's freedom of choice and keep the government as much out of my life as I possibly can.  Your fears are your own.  Do what you feel you must when you hunt, but don't decide choices for others who don't agree with you.

[fasteddie]

I wear Blaze Orange but don't feel that is should be mandatory ...........

And the obvious question would be ...... why not?

Well Doc , you didn't let me down !  :  When I typed in my post , I knew you'd have something to say !  ???

I wear a helmet when I go biking or ride the ATV -- I don't need someone to tell me I have to .....

I wear a harness or I don't go in a stand , I don't need someone to tell me I have to .....

I wear a seatbelt when driving , sitting in the passenger seat or back seat ...I don't need someone to tell me I have to .....

I don't talk on a phone when I am driving , I don't need someone to tell me I have to .....

I wear Blaze Orange when I hunt , I don't need someone to tell me I have to .....

Making a law to make the wearing of Blaze Orange Mandatory is just another law that won't be enforced !  ( just like drivers talking on cell phones not being pulled over and ticketed ) .

[Mr VJP]

NJ has had mandatory B/O for years.  The state has suddenly decided that's not good enough. 

Now they come around and check your B/O with a meter to see if it's orange enough!  That's right, orange that is faded a little will get you a fine the same $$$ as no orange at all.

Do you really think the government is ever gonna be satisfied with the little bit of freedom you give up for them?  No, they will keep coming back, little by little, until they can lock you up for looking at them the wrong way.

No sir.  Enough with legislation that infringes on individual liberty.  Penalize crime and negligence and let people be free to live as they deem fit!

[fasteddie]

Would this pass the test ?

[Mr VJP]

Sorry, Not in NJ.  Blaze Camo is not considered legal.  It used to be, but they changed that too!

:

[wztirem]

Orange Requirement:

NJ requirement.

[wztirem]

New Jersey  Hunting regulations: http://www.state.nj.us/dep/fgw/njregs.htm. Hunter Harassment law: 23:7A-2. Prevention of lawful taking of wildlife prohibited ...

www.huntsab.org/new_jersey.htm - Cached - Similar    Orange Requirement:  

[wztirem]

Requirement

During the period September 1 through the last day of February, hunters are required to wear at least 400 square inches of fluorescent orange clothing above the waist and visible from all sides. An orange hat, in addition to a coat or vest, is strongly recommended. The following hunters are exempt from this requirement: Archery Deer Hunters during most seasons, Archery and Firearms Turkey Hunters, Waterfowl Hunters while hunting from boats, duck blinds, or other stationary positions, Crow Hunters while hunting from blinds or a stationary position, Raccoon and Opossum Hunters when hunting from 1/2 hour after sunset until 1/2 hour before sunrise, and Landowners while hunting deer on their own property. Family members are still required to wear fluorescent orange. Persons hunting with deer damage permits are also subject to the fluorescent orange requirement.

Ct Requirement is twice the NJ requirement!

[wztirem]

It's time for Vt. hunters to see orange: Times Argus Online  Jan 17, 2010 ... It's time Vermont caught up with 40 other states in this country. A blaze orange law would save lives. That's good enough for me. ...

www.timesargus.com/article/20100117/.../1015/FEATURES06 - Cached    Interesting link!

[fasteddie]

I have Blaze Orange Tabs on my hunting blinds and I also hang BO marking tape on my blinds so it can be seen bu hunters , etc ...... It's not mandatory but I do it anyway .

[Mr VJP]

Hunter Orange in NJ

Firearm hunters must wear a cap made of solid

daylight fluorescent orange or an outer garment

containing at least 200 square inches of fluorescent

orange material visible from all sides at all times

while engaged in hunting. A camo-orange hat alone

is not adequate.

This applies to all persons while hunting with a

firearm for deer, bear, rabbit, hare, squirrel, coyote,

fox, railbirds, and game birds including while in

a tree stand.

Exceptions: this law does not apply to waterfowl,

crow, wild turkey, coyote/fox (during the special

permit season, page 63), woodchuck nor bowhunters

except that a bowhunter using a deer decoy

must wear hunter orange, as described above,

while transporting the decoy into and out of the

woods and fields. During the Six-day Firearm

Season, it is recommended that bowhunters wear

hunter orange.

[fasteddie]

Well , I guess i'm not going to drive down to New Jersey to hunt !  ???

[wztirem]

Sorry, Not in NJ.  Blaze Camo is not considered legal.  It used to be, but they changed that too!

:

Are you sure?

[wztirem]

Well , I guess i'm not going to drive down to New Jersey to hunt !  ???

Ed, look through the Jersey website and refer particularly to their Hunter Education program. The topic of hunter education requirements would probably be worth discussing in terms of comparison to NY and adjoining states.