Doc

That is exactly what it is. It is a gas powered spear-gun.

I also believe that jail in general should be purposely a very horrible place to be. It needs to become a punitive, unpleasant experience such that once someone gets out, it becomes very clear to them that they don't EVER want to go back. Death penalty? ...... Whenever there is no doubt of guilt, execution should be used. Yes there will be times when crap happens. But the old eye-for-an-eye philosophy seems appropriate to me.

Actually, I kept hunting logs long before PCs became a household item. Just a simple notebook, but I never really trusted my memory to handle all the little details of every hunt. But when spreadsheets came along, I discovered the ease with which patterns that were rattling around randomly and unrecognizable in my memory could all of a sudden become organized and stand out and become obvious. All of a sudden, I had something new to apply to my hunting knowledge. Why wouldn't I use it? My problem is that I tried to make it analyze some things that were based on a fluid base.

I am not sure how many generations it will take before this happens, but I to believe that they are diligently working toward that goal. Why?.... Because they are continually upset that all these "special" seasons (read that to be bowseasons) have complicated their ability to beat on the deer population when they feel the need. I do think they are working on making bow seasons into "any weapon" seasons as fast as they can. Who will stop them? ..... The NYB? .....ha-ha-ha.

Those days are still here for most hunters. However, some of us try to take it a bit further in terms of understanding all the confusing things that we see, and try to answer the question "why". I was always curious as to why a deer would show up at one location instead of another. There was always the desire to make some sense of it all. I always knew just enough to recognize that nature does have patterns, but never enough to understand and predict those patterns. And then along came a technology (Maxiplan then Excel) that kind of sparked my interest all by itself. It was a natural outfall that I would try to connect these two interests and make them work together as a hobby, and a learning tool to add to my other interests. And then there is this stage in my life where I can see the end of my participation in hunting, and I find that all the data collection of years past now serve as a memory jogger that brings a lot of those experiences back to life for me. It becomes numerical memoirs. I truly loved every minute of that data collection, and today I love all the memories that those numbers collected and preserved for me.

Aside from just recording memories, the data collection and analysis was primarily aimed at establishing local trends, and deer movements and patterns. It is unbelievable just how much a parcel of land can change and how the patterns change along with the habitat. I watched wheat field turn into brush-lots with 4" maples so thick that nothing green ever grew there again. I watched oaks mature to the point of bearing acorns in places where acorns never were. I watched edges of fields move hundreds of yards. I saw state land that was part of my hunting grounds become consumed by new uses of intense mountain bike trails with a web of these trails covering many acres of what used to be prime undisturbed deer grounds now sending the deer into primarily nocturnal movements and constant on guard existence. Large groups of hikers have also taken over this maze of trails. Some of the grounds that comprised some of the records were subdivided into posted properties. On the other side of the coin, areas that used to be ag fields may now be prime brushy bedding areas. Oak stands that were primarily saplings may now be dropping acorns like crazy. A next door neighbor may have a food plot that he put in. All of that along with the changes that you mentioned all impacted the purposes of the log and the analysis that was being performed. So when you are trying to establish trends and patterns by stirring in data of changing places that don't have the slightest similarity to what they used to be, all conclusions are polluted with irrelevant and misleading inputs and outputs.

Yeah, I don't like to hear that crap from either side of the fence.

Oh now there you go trying to apply logic. Now think like a DEC upper management person and you will start getting a feel as to how it will all really turn out.

For me it was all part of the hunt for 28 years. I don't believe there was a single hunt of scouting trip that was not included. I didn't stop until it became obvious that you cant analyze data that is 30 years old with data that occurred a few weeks ago. It all worked good for a few years, but when changes on the land started happening, the differences were coming fast and furious and totally ruining my database for overall analysis.

You guys all realize that we have a lame-duck president, accountable to no one. And now you are catching on to what happens when you get a flaming socialist in that kind of position. There's quite a lot of havoc that can be raised with people's rights when a leftie finally gets into this position of free untouchable reign. But it is funny listening to the leftist apologists defending this stuff.

It has to be a human nature thing.

For almost 30 years (1982 -2010), I collected the following data and kept it in an Excel spreadsheet: ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ LOG NO DATE LOCATION NO NO. SIGHTED TIME (AM OR PM) WEATHER clear cloudy rain snow TEMPERATURE cold cool warm hot WIND DIRECTION WIND VELOCITY heavy breezy light calm ENTRY DIRECTION EXIT DIRECTION HUNTER ACTION none passed shot RESULTS none kill wound miss deer spooked deer walked on HUNTING STYLE standing still hunting scouting going to stand coming from stand HUNTER NAME BUCK QTY DOE QTY UNIDENT QTY LOCATION CODE STAND NUMBER CLOSEST STAND NUMBER MODAY (Four digit month/day indicator) UPHILL OR DOWNHILL REMARKS ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ I also had a spread sheet identifying 9 distinct areas of the land that I hunted so that I could get a macro-look at trends. These areas took in both sides of the valley each hill, side-hill, and top and unique areas within each. There was another linked spreadsheet that described and located all of the stands I ever created or used. That was so that I could refer to a number in the main database instead of long descriptions. There were 114 entries for stands. Each stand had a complete description, with preferred (and secondary) wind directions relative to trails and traditional deer entry directions. And there were maintenance data to indicate whether they could be used as-is or needed work or were in fact destroyed or unusable. THE ANALYSIS: From all this data, I developed macros that would- -Select and list stands based on forecasted wind directions. That meant that in the morning I could print out a list of stands depending on what the weatherman had to say that morning. - Analyze the performance of each stand in terms of percentages of times that each stand produced a sighting of bucks, does, and unidentified deer. - Analyze the performances of each calendar day of the season through a special number that I used for month and day (MODAY). For example November 20th would use a MODAY of 1120. It had to be numerical in order to be mathematically useable. That gave me a graphical look at deer movement and sightings as the season progressed so I could determine if there were trends in deer movements and patterns at different times of the season due to things like weather, leaf-loss, food source maturity, etc. It was a fun project that was quite useful, entertaining and left a complete record of memories and experiences. In 2010 I discontinued it. What I found was that information that gets too old can lose it's accuracy over time because of land changes. For example, we had a severe ice storm that changed trails and patterns of the deer. Food sources changed due to maturity and new over-story of some of the areas. What was true in 1982 was totally different in 2010. There was a change in land use as the state land that I hunted became interlaced with a maze of very active mountain bike trails that were also taken over by large groups of hikers. Huge areas were basically removed from daytime deer movement. In other words, old data was becoming a pollutant to the data base. Conditions and patterns suggested by activity in the 80's looked absolutely nothing like what was going on in later years and were skewing the analysis. This is an important aspect to remember when using data for analysis purposes. However, the exercise was well worth doing, because every entry is so complete, especially with the remarks column that each hunting and scouting trip brings back those memories even better than a hunting diary. It is a great document that I will always treasure.

The thread is about this new contraption and the possibility of it being considered to be a weapon for bow season. Probably the relevance is a bit over your head.

No relevance to this thread or the quote you are referencing, but an interesting thought nonetheless.

NYB is irrelevant. Bowhunters are completely unorganized and have no political voice at all (that anyone is still listening to). We did a good job on that. So it is really of no concern whether NYB likes it or not. Outside forces are now free to steam-roller over bowhunters at will.

I am relaxed, but thank you for your misplaced concern. As far as taking away bow season, there is more than one way of making it disappear. One is to flat out remove it (not likely), or the more likely one is to keep on diluting and polluting it until it no longer has any recognizable uniqueness or difference from the regular season or even reason for existing. You know, some day there will come a time when it will occur to all that there is no real reason for a unique set-aside time for what used to be called "bow" season. Ever ask yourself why people decided to pull archery hunting out into it's own season? Already the DEC is threatening the use of firearms in "bow season". In fact sections of he season and the state already have the mix of firearms and bowhunting. No, the season may be there in name only, but it might not be something bowhunters really want to be participating in.

Dave- You are absolutely right. There are a lot of reasons that people don't want to bow hunt or should not bowhunt. It is a demanding way to hunt, and was intended to be. Not everybody wants to, or can devote time to learning the discipline of mastering a bow. Some people hurt when they undergo the stress of archery muscle manipulation. Some just plain don't get any kick out of doing it or understand the unique appeal. And there is no reason for them to feel pressured into bow hunting. On the other hand, there is no reason that they should feel entitled to cram their way into bow seasons with their own choices of weapons and rules just because using a bow is inconvenient for them. The two seasons were split apart for obvious reasons because of the different conditions required for each style of hunting. So we all participate in whichever seasons that are suited to our personal and physical abilities, interests, and situations and mindsets. It all seems reasonable to me. Why that can't be accepted by all hunters, is a mystery to me, but I guess some want it all.

The genie is out of the bottle ..... lol. I knew the crossbow was just the beginning. Technology knows no bounds. Just look at todays compound bows for proof of that. Bow season started with a bent stick and string. Now look at it. I warned of every addition to bow season setting new precedents for the next. I can only repeat that warning.

First of all, congratulations on having such a great start to your varmint calling success. That is crazy great success, and it sounds like you have instantly shown that you have learned quickly. Not to bring all that down, but somebody else out there learned a lot that day too. You got one, but four others are now on to you, and they will know you by name next time they hear that call. So phase two involves the art of change-up and improvisation. It all puts me in mind of that old saying: Fool me once shame on you fool me twice shame on me From what I have seen around our area, I think the coyotes have heard that saying too.....lol. Your task is now to "fool them twice". Good luck to you and your partner. You're off to a great start!

I think it is some time in this coming year tat the new Bass-pro gets built down near Eastview. So then between Henrietta and Victor you will have your pick of outdoor stores. Field and Stream, Bass-Pro, Gander Mountain, Dicks ..... Did I leave any out? We're pretty well outfitted now. Traffic around Eastview is always ugly, but you were there a little too close to Christmas. Everybody is still in the "return mode", ditching all those ugly sweaters and argyle socks. Also there are still some Christmas sales still going on. It's starting to back off a bit now.

Great Birthday. Wifey bought me a Canon Rebel SL1 camera and a couple lenses. Great looking unit, and now I have to de-cipher all the instructions. And then for supper she cooked up some lobster and all of my favorite veggies. Life is good!

How far are you willing to go with that philosophy. A .22 Hornet is also legal for deer in NYS. Would you advise someone to "continue using it if that is the caliber you prefer"? I think I would be tempted to speak up and try to talk them out of that one....lol. It probably would still be a good idea to take the issue to Albany as well. Frankly, I believe they blew it, but that still does not absolve the hunter from using a bit of common sense when it comes to caliber selection.

There is no caliber or weapon that absolves the hunter of a responsibility of proficiency. But just because a certain caliber has the capability to kill a deer, doesn't make it a wise choice. That quote that was just posted, says it all ("Don't use a bullet/caliber that works when everything goes right, use one that works when things don't.") , and I think tat thought represents why I made the comment that I didn't understand why people get a kick out of using the smallest caliber possible. It just doesn't make any sense to me. And inappropriate as it is, throwing archery into a rifle discussion, I would feel the same about somebody picking up one of those 15# draw fiberglass kid's-bows and trying to deer hunt with it. It just wouldn't make any sense to me.

I'm big on the challenge idea. That really is what all hunting is all about in one form or another for me. But for me it is about challenging myself with absolutely lethal equipment whether that be gun or archery. I don't go deer hunting with flu-flu arrows and field tips, just to see if it can be done.

That's exactly the attitude I just got done talking about in my last reply. You read two comments and instantly apply it to all bowhunters. This kind of nonsense has got to stop on both sides.