nyantler

As a young hunter I found it tough to pass on anything.. maybe cause as a kid I thought maybe my friends wouldn't think I was a good hunter if I didn't get a buck every year.. as I got older I realized its not a contest to see who can stack the most bucks up each year or even deer for that matter... I'm ok with eating all my tags every year if it means not compromising my standards of what I believe to be better for the whitetail deer. I refuse to shoot a young buck or a fawn of any sex. Just not my thing even if it means getting skunked. I just feel lucky to be physically able to get out and enjoy the hunt each year.

now there is some character.. nice buck

Who ever said anything about the more does you kill the more bucks you'll have? you two really don't pay attention... I never said anything about killing more does... just killing less small bucks... and if you also payed attention you'd have read how to avoid killing fawns when filling doe tags... I have killed many does over the years and have never killed a button buck or a fawn. Last i knew antlerless was a deer without antlers... we aren't talking about balancing antlerless with antlered we're talking about balancing male and female.

I'm not a real biologist.. but i did play one on TV.. I'm sure it wouldn't make any difference to you if I was Doc. Its not about who's saying it with you.. its what is being said... you just don't want anything to do with management.. I get it.

Don't claim to be an expert but I do know a bit about what I'm talking about... been involved in this stuff long before anybody heard of QDM in NY. Actually participate and published an article on The Weller Mountain QDM program initiated by Grant Woods back in the mid 90's. I did many QDM seminars all over the state back then as well.

My son was diagnosed with Leukemia 6 years ago and is doing very well today.. I know the power of prayer and will keep you and your lady in mine.

Congrats!

I agree, AR's wouldn't bring in more hunters.. I think that most of the guys that like deer hunting are hunting already. I'm not so sure the amount of hunters would plummet from a doe only season though either... well at least from all the guys on here that say they are not buck hunters, but deer hunters. Just so everyone is clear.. I put up the question more as it would pertain the helping out the age structure of the bucks... I know the concept was very general...and of course, if it was something that was to be seriously considered. all areas of NY would have to be looked at to see where it might be a good idea and where it might not...

Pay attention larry.. I said that I am not advocating a doe only season, just put up the question to see what kind of responses I'd get about using it for helping buck age class structure... I am actually a one mature buck only advocate if anything with a doe harvest. It would do many NY hunters some good to read up on management programs in other states and see what they have done to help their herds... better yet read up on why the issue of quality deer management even exists... quality deer management is not just about deer populations and big bucks... read the whole model... you might just lean something.

Very nice buck Contender! great spread

Just the inherent nature of how rack form from the pedicle... If you've even see a deers rack immediately after the velvet falls off it looks pretty much the way its going to look during the hunting season. tips are pointed and smooth...upper beams are smooth , lower beam near the pedicle kinda knarly.

Hate to tell you Doc but all the ideas I have put up on this forum have come directly from those DEC specialists you refer to.. the only reason a lot have not already been implememented is because of the same type of resistance from guys like you... I have been doing research on deer management for the last 16 years and have spoken to nearly all the biologist that are also working on coming up with a better mangement plan. Frankly, I'm glad that you want to leave it up to the guys who know a little more.. because from what I've heard from you so far.. you really don't know alot about what you're talking about. I'm sure your an okay guy and all and really enjoy your hunting but you're the type of guy that needs to be educated a little.

If they are bred they will not come into estrus again.. so the answer is yes

(In Miss., ARs reduced the average rack size of 2.5+ bucks) SteveB I noticed this on your post.. I search three different studies and not one of them had this conclusion.. in fact the opposite conclusion was what I saw in each study. Just wondered where you saw that statement?

we have a one buck rule on our leased property... over 14" spread... we have a good age class structure of bucks on the property.. its only 700 acres... which is small in the whitetail world. We do it to give the other hunters on the lease a chance at a good buck rather than have one or two guys taking a couple each.

I think this is why i went to traditional archery... even though I have always show instinctively even with my old compounds.. i didn't like all the moving parts.. I like a bow. a string .. and an arrow...the only thing i do occasionally is check my brace height.. and practice ... practice .. practice.

See? now we are getting into some intelligent conversation and some good questions... this is how we as hunters can come up with good whitetail conservation plans. First we need to remember that what we want to accomplish.. which is make sure we keep the deer herds healthy based on their given habitat in a given area.. plus we have to remember that we need to maintain conservation revenue and keep hunters happy all at the same time.. tough feat to accomplish. Probably why I believe that education is the most important thing.. if hunters understand whats going on in the whitetail world in NY they might be more apt to do the right thing on their own without legislation.

Actually bucks rarely get to rubbing the tips that hard.. most of the heavy rubbing is near the base.. you can even see remnants of bark left on the burrs sometimes.. the tips are quite light color right after the velvet falls off...

Adk.. yes that might be the case.... Doc, I am not advocating any single statewide program... I would advocate taking a look at trouble areas first and start there... I just threw this question out there to see what guys reaction would be...

Not getting your logic larry.. we have the same number of hunters now with doe tags available... nothing would change except maybe adjusting the number of does you could take in any given WMU each year.

Can't go back to the way it was 200 years ago.. so finding a way to manage based on habitat that works both for hunters and deer herds seems logical. It isn't hard coming up with a management model.. getting guys to adopt it is what's hard.

oh! thanks for checking out the site.. hope you enjoyed it

Absolutely.. its the bi-product of management that is most talked about.. I am just saying that in this thread I was trying to see what guys thought pertaining to the management aspect... Honestly I guess I can say it bugs me a bit that a lot of hunters harp on guys that hunt big bucks like its a sin.. when the truth that faced with the choice of small buck or big buck if both are standing in front of you broadside... 99.999999999999999999999999999% of the guys are gonna kill the big boy! So I don't get the argument of how its a bad thing to want big bucks whenever AR is discussed...

Hey that could very well be a picture of me some mornings..haha

I would hunt with a hammer if they'd let me!!