Whats so hard about passing yearling bucks?

[wztirem]

I pass all the fawns, however if the opportunity presents itself............

[nyantler]

nope.. not done growing at 2.5

[nyantler]

physiological maturity is a biological thing... not an arbitrary whatever you want it to be thing... it happens between 3.5 and 4.5  When a guy decides to hunt big bucks "only",  what he is really doing is making a choice not to shoot small ones.

[Doc]

physiological maturity is a biological thing... not an arbitrary whatever you want it to be thing... it happens between 3.5 and 4.5  When a guy decides to hunt big bucks "only",  what he is really doing is making a choice not to shoot small ones.

So for you, a mature deer has a range of age (3-1/2 to 4-1/2).  If someone says they only shoot mature deer, you consider they are talking about a deer that is between 3.5 and 4.5 and on up. I have never really read a discussion on what features or traits actually define a "mature" deer and yet I hear the term used all the time. I might have assumed that maturity might be linked to a point where the average deer stops growing, or maybe a point where certain aspects of it's physical condition begin to deteriorate in certain key ways. The actual criteria for that term still escapes me. 

[archerforever]

The answer to this question is a very personal one. Since taking up bowhunting up in 1999 and killing inmature bucks for the first couple of seasons, I progressed and really only wanted to shoot mature deer. I respect everyone's view on this topic and I believe that every deer is a trophy regardless of antler measurements. It does get easier to pass up small bucks after you have harvested a few nice mature bucks and have areas where you hunt that have pretty high deer densities. I would say that in the last 3 or 4 seasons that I have passed on 20-30 bucks each season, but that takes patience and years of practice to do so.

[nyantler]

Doc .. read up on your deer biology...The key word there was "physiological"

[nyantler]

There are also features and traits that separate mature deer. 

[Doc]

Doc .. read up on your deer biology...The key word there was "physiological"

So, is there anyone who actually knows and cares to explain the actual criteria (be they physiological and/or otherwise) that describes what makes a deer "mature"?

Doc

[nyantler]

I would explain but I think it would be better if maybe you read it from a source you trust.. because you just seem to what to contradict any fact that is stated here.. so read it for yourself. I notice you are always quick to make a comment on something you don't know anything about.

[nyantler]

Archer forever.. well put.. except the part about every deer is a trophy... if they all were trophies.. we would mount the spikes too. And for the guys that have mounted a spikehorn .. congrats on your trophy:)

[Doc]

I would explain but I think it would be better if maybe you read it from a source you trust.. because you just seem to what to contradict any fact that is stated here.. so read it for yourself. I notice you are always quick to make a comment on something you don't know anything about.

Which is kind of a slick way of saying you really don't know .

[nyantler]

I gotta tell ya Doc.. you're a riot. Read my website page about aging in the field.. GEEZ!!!

[the blur]

How long would the average deer live if there was no hunting ?

and let's not factor in starvation, and road kill.

What is the life span of a typical deer ?

I would guesstimate at least 10 years.

[Doc]

And for the guys that have mounted a spikehorn .. congrats on your trophy:)

Thanks for the congratulations. That was my 1st bow kill and I have the antlers plaque-mounted right over the fireplace.

[nyantler]

That doesn't surprise me in the least Doc. lol But I meant head mount...

[Culvercreek hunt club]

My first buck was a spike...was taken with my father watching...yes it is a trophy and means more to me than my big mounts just because of that...and the horns are mounted front and center...because of their meaning....and THAT is what you guys miss in your quest for the horns you seek

[nyantler]

I know of a wild deer Blur that lived 12 years in Forestport NY... but as for average... hard to tell... things are different now than 100's of years ago. In captivity they live quite long due to the lack of stress.

[nyantler]

I stand corrected on the spike thing..if it was your first buck. my point is that not ALL deer are trophies... but I have noticed that many guys like to say it i think to justify them shooting small deer. I will agree though that any deer COULD be a trophy... but not all are.

[Doc]

I stand corrected on the spike thing..if it was your first buck. my point is that not ALL deer are trophies... but I have noticed that many guys like to say it i think to justify them shooting small deer. I will agree though that any deer COULD be a trophy... but not all are.

The point is that a trophy is not measured in inches. There are a lot of factors that make it a trophy to an individual. For some people any deer taken fairly and legally is a trophy and it's not really up to anyone like you to be determining what should be a trophy for other people.

[nyantler]

Not claiming to tell anyone what is a trophy to them...just made the statement that not EVERY deer IS a trophy. And I stand by that statement. And I never said anything about inches of horn.. there you go again making things up. I used the spike horn as an example and also said congrats if you have a mounted spike horn as your trophy. I understand the whole first buck, special buck , special deer trophy thing. Still doesn't make EVERY deer a trophy.

[SQ2Hunter]

My first buck was a spike...was taken with my father watching...yes it is a trophy and means more to me than my big mounts just because of that...and the horns are mounted front and center...because of their meaning....and THAT is what you guys miss in your quest for the horns you seek

Yea I am with you on that, my first buck was a six point shot with my father(i still have the rack) and my younger brother I was with when he shot his first buck, a spike but, that was 27 years ago when any buck was fair game. To this day I dont have a problem with a first time hunter or one in the twilight of their career shooting a 1.5year old buck. I have a concern with those individuals who consistently shoot them year after year. eig: My 90 acres is surrounded by private land which I have a good relationship with the neighboring land owners. the land owner only hunts a couple of hours first day and shoots a buck every few years. However, he has someone who bow hunts and gun hunts as well. Make a long story short it is not to difficult to shoot a 1.5yr old buck on the property. this guy(who is very nice) shoots a 1.5 yr old with his bow and gun every year he is in his late 40's early 50's. Enough is enough I pass up bucks he shoots. Oh by the way I have passed up 10 1.5 yr old bucks so far. How about you?

[SQ2Hunter]

SQ2Hunter, don't let them get under your skin.  They throw that BS out at everyone.  The funny part is they all "claim" to not shoot the 1.5's too. 

Hey hunter-sorry Im jst responding but Ive been busy hunting. Thanks for the support but they dont get under my skin. NY State management/regulations gets under my skin. I wish our management was at least similar to Ohio. I just dont get why some hunters reject QDM- doesnt everyone want an opportunity at a mature buck?

[nyantler]

Its not so much that they reject QDM that bothers me.. they reject it without actually ever having looked at the program research from around the country. It would serve hunters good to at least take a look at how they might be able to implement deer management into New York... I hear more guys saying there they aren't seeing bucks, they aren't seeing good bucks, i need a doe tag to put meat in the freezer, All I see is does. BUT they aren't willing to take a look at why all that is happening. Honestly I'm not sure why I even care because it wouldn't affect the way I hunt at all. I just think its the right thing to do.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

13 this bow season...just couldn't get the big boys close enough. I do pass on them...my point has always been that I just won't support a restriction that takes away one of our hunters freedom to choose away. The one thing that does make it easier for me...the areas I hunt do hold big bucks. The whole hunting experience for me is about more than the harvest. I know some of you are talking about mature bucks and NOT the horns...let me throw a what if out there....a monster bodied buck walks right under you stand...I am talking a 6.5....250#er...but the monster bases are broken from fighting...about 2 inches up from the guard horns....legally a 4 point....do you harvest it?

[nyantler]

I have actually been faced with this very situation.  Remember that the concept of passing on 1.5 and trying to kill a more mature buck isn't about taking mature bucks out of the herd its about leaving the young buck in the herd to increase the amount of older deer in the following years. I would pass on the broken horned buck. Leaving him in the herd doesn't hurt the age structure. If there is no pedicle damage he will grow his antlers again the next year and still be in the pool of mature bucks to take.