New crossbow

[Core]

3 hours ago, LJC said:

 they use shorter  lighter bolts it's basically the same but since you can use a scope and it's just easier to shoot .

To someone who does not no better they appear to be more then what they are . Since the bolt is shorter when  you go shoot at a target it gives  you the impression it's much more powerful . Because that little bolt disappears  in that target . If you go mesure a arrow from a 70ib 30 inch draw a  compound bow is going in about the same  thing in those targets  but because it's longer it don't seem that way 

Allso depends on you set up of a bow .

If your shooting compound on low settings sure a crossbow is more powerful.  And still in hunting conditions  in  woods practical range 40 yards. 

 

That doesn't match up what I've seen. A lot of these are shooting around 400 grain bolts, which is similar to a lot of bows. The best crossbows now are putting a 400 grain bolt out at over 400 fps. That's 150 ft lbs of KE, which no bow can touch. The PSE full throttle compound can do 100, and that's the fastest bow on the market with an IBO of 370, but that is with a light arrow as well, and only if you get the full 30" draw.

Virtually nobody has a crossbow at my range, but today at lunch a guy did. He was consistently getting 1" groups at 20 yards with his 3 arrows, which from a compound would be darn impressive group after group (and I know he had not shot this thing very much). But more than that when he hit the bag it sounded like a sledge hammer. Jacked up to 70 my bow could never hit that hard.

[ApexerER]

On ‎8‎/‎7‎/‎2016 at 7:10 PM, GreeneHunter said:

My new (first) crossbow !  Went to the Dicks / Field & Stream Grand Opening in Latham NY ... $ 249.00 Gamecrusher Crossbow .

 

 

My wife purchased that crossbow for me for Christmas last year. I haven't hunted with it yet but I have shot it and I like it. Hopefully I won't be wishing I spent more money on one in the future but as of now I am happy with it. Good luck with it....

[LJC]

They take less skill obviously btw they make compound bows with 80 90 100 ib draw weight  and those are as or more powerful then crossbow it's all relative to what u buy exactly 

[Core]

15 minutes ago, LJC said:

They take less skill obviously btw they make compound bows with 80 90 100 ib draw weight  and those are as or more powerful then crossbow it's all relative to what u buy exactly 

Very few guys are pulling 80 lbs. And still, these are not as powerful as the best crossbows. Another way to put it is a sub $300 crossbow can currently hit harder than the fastest IBO bow on the market.

The debate on compounds now is can one ever have an IBO rating of 400? Meanwhile, crossbows have already exceeded that, the next milestone will be a production 500 (I'm sure 450 is around the corner since 440 is already here).

As far as I know crossbows are also rated with 400 grain, not the 350 grain of IBO.

[Buckmaster7600]

They take less skill obviously btw they make compound bows with 80 90 100 ib draw weight  and those are as or more powerful then crossbow it's all relative to what u buy exactly 

To have a 100lb vertical compound with a 30" draw shoot you would be in the range of a 600gn arrow the speeds stay pretty consistent to a 70lb draw you are still not much over 320fps. Even then the energy drops quickly do to the added weight of the arrow.

The moral of the story is you are talking out your a$$ and have no clue what you are talking about.


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[LJC]

1 hour ago, Buckmaster7600 said:

 

 

To have a 100lb vertical compound with a 30" draw shoot you would be in the range of a 600gn arrow the speeds stay pretty consistent to a 70lb draw you are still not much over 320fps. Even then the energy drops quickly do to the added weight of the arrow.

The moral of the story is you are talking out your a$$ and have no clue what you are talking about.


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They Moral Of The Story Is They kill elephants with 80  90 ib compound bows so it does not make a difference  for deer now does it . People kill deer with 35 40 ib recurve bows all the time in fact that is  around what native Americans used 

Edited September 14, 2016 by LJC

[LJC]

Using a balistic calculator the numbers show that even at 400 fps the 350 grain arrow drops over a  foot after 40 yards 

And that's sighting 0 at 30 yards 

300 fps arrow  arrow is just a little worse not by much they both have enough kinetic energy to kill a deer at that range

You get about 5 yards in usable trajectory with 400 fps .  The drop at 40 is 5.60 - at 400 fps 

And 9.75-  for 300 fps using 350 arrow 

At 50 both ar way low over a foot .

Anything else you want to no  ?

 

[LJC]

1 hour ago, Buckmaster7600 said:

 

 

To have a 100lb vertical compound with a 30" draw shoot you would be in the range of a 600gn arrow the speeds stay pretty consistent to a 70lb draw you are still not much over 320fps. Even then the energy drops quickly do to the added weight of the arrow.

The moral of the story is you are talking out your a$$ and have no clue what you are talking about.


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Using a balistic calculator the numbers show that even at 400 fps the 350 grain arrow drops over a  foot after 40 yards 

And that's sighting 0 at 30 yards 

300 fps arrow  arrow is just a little worse not by much they both have enough kinetic energy to kill a deer at that range

You get about 5 yards in usable trajectory with 400 fps .  The drop at 40 is 5.60 - at 400 fps 

And 9.75-  for 300 fps using 350 arrow 

At 50 both ar way low over a foot .

Anything else you want to know  ?

Btw iv only been using both for 35 years I think at this point I no something about it

Edited September 14, 2016 by LJC

[turkeyfeathers]

6 minutes ago, LJC said:

 

Anything else you want to know  ?

 

Actually, yes. Where in the world does Daryl in The Walking Dead get so many bolts for his crossbow?

[LJC]

4 minutes ago, turkeyfeathers said:

Actually, yes. Where in the world does Daryl in The Walking Dead get so many bolts for his crossbow?

Walmart where else:)

[Core]

40 minutes ago, LJC said:

Using a balistic calculator the numbers show that even at 400 fps the 350 grain arrow drops over a  foot after 40 yards 

And that's sighting 0 at 30 yards 

300 fps arrow  arrow is just a little worse not by much they both have enough kinetic energy to kill a deer at that range

You get about 5 yards in usable trajectory with 400 fps .  The drop at 40 is 5.60 - at 400 fps 

And 9.75-  for 300 fps using 350 arrow 

At 50 both ar way low over a foot .

Anything else you want to no  ?

 

If you had used these calculators to begin with you would have realized that modern crossbows smoke modern compounds. That's just the objective truth. They hit harder, they shoot faster (flatter), they are more accurate. 

I don't have one. I still hope they don't open them up during compound season, but even forgetting their comparative ease of use they are more deadly and the gap will keep increasing. 

[Buckmaster7600]

Using a balistic calculator the numbers show that even at 400 fps the 350 grain arrow drops over a  foot after 40 yards 

And that's sighting 0 at 30 yards 

300 fps arrow  arrow is just a little worse not by much they both have enough kinetic energy to kill a deer at that range

You get about 5 yards in usable trajectory with 400 fps .  The drop at 40 is 5.60 - at 400 fps 

And 9.75-  for 300 fps using 350 arrow 

At 50 both ar way low over a foot .

Anything else you want to know  ?

Btw iv only been using both for 35 years I think at this point I no something about it

The difference is that a 400fps Xbow has more energy at 50 yds than that 45lb recurve does at 1yd.


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[LJC]

Lol anyway  crossbow is not archery .

They should not have the same season I agree with you there .

In new york  you can't use more then 200ib crossbow.  So there is a limit to how powerful  they get . I'm guessing that someone at the DEC figure all this out and came up with the 200 ib limit on crossbows for that reason. 

 

[Buckmaster7600]

Lol anyway  crossbow is not archery .

They should not have the same season I agree with you there .

In new york  you can't use more then 200ib crossbow.  So there is a limit to how powerful  they get . I'm guessing that someone at the DEC figure all this out and came up with the 200 ib limit on crossbows for that reason. 

 

You're showing your ignorance again! There isn't a compound crossbow made with a 200lb draw. The only thing that law does in make recurve Xbows obsolete in NY.


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[LJC]

16 minutes ago, Buckmaster7600 said:

 

 

You're showing your ignorance again! There isn't a compound crossbow made with a 200lb draw. The only thing that law does in make recurve Xbows obsolete in NY.


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There are crossbows like the Excalibur micro that are over 250 ib yea there recurve but with a limit on poundage you can only get so much power oUT of them is,my point.  

Edited September 14, 2016 by LJC

[Core]

Yes, there is a limit, but we aren't there yet. I think we'll see 500 fps within 200 lb compound in the not too distant future. That's going to be mighty tricky for a deer to duck.

[Buckmaster7600]

There are crossbows like the Excalibur micro that are over 250 ib yea there recurve but with a limit on poundage you can only get so much power oUT of them is,my point.  

This has nothing to do with my statement. Once again all the draw limit does is make recurves obsolete in NY.


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[LJC]

There not obsolete even at 200 pounds a recurve crossbow 

will slice through a deer good enough  how for into the dirt do you want your arrow to go ?   I can show you videos of 40 pound recurve bows going right through a deer . Arrows kill by bleeding you don't need much power for that .

[Buckmaster7600]

There not obsolete even at 200 pounds a recurve crossbow 

will slice through a deer good enough  how for into the dirt do you want your arrow to go ?   I can show you videos of 40 pound recurve bows going right through a deer . Arrows kill by bleeding you don't need much power for that .

You need to open up a dictionary and read the definition for obsolete "if you can read." Never once did I say they won't kill a deer.

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[LJC]

The definition is something no longer used outdated .

Crossbows Recurves are still being used and they are  getting better  just like compounds are  .

Plus they are lighter less likely to break on you and easier to fix when they do .

So no there not obsolete . Excalibur one of tye best crossbows only makes recurve crossbows for example and there are plenty of other brands that make them  

[Buckmaster7600]

The definition is something no longer used outdated .

Crossbows Recurves are still being used and they are  getting better  just like compounds are  .

Plus they are lighter less likely to break on you and easier to fix when they do .

So no there not obsolete . Excalibur one of tye best crossbows only makes recurve crossbows for example and there are plenty of other brands that make them  

The only way to make a recurve faster is to make the draw heavier and NY's law prevents that. Therefor they are stuck where they are I.E. obsolete.

I have owned an excals for 10 years I know a thing or 2 about them.

I'm not giving up 80-100fps just to shoot a recurve.


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[LJC]

Some people don't care as much  about max fps they care more about reliability in the field  and weight . that's  like saying everyone needs a 300 win mag to deer hunt over a 30-06

Or a 30 30  that's all I'm saying .

Not everyone just looks at fps when buying  a bow or crossbow if you know  what I mean . 

Edited September 14, 2016 by LJC

[bugsNbows]

IMO, speed is way over-rated. I've killed plenty of critters with old vertical recurves and compounds that were rather slow (like 200fps) or less. My current Xbow runs about 330-332 fps. Is it the fastest? No. But, it's very well built, accurate and has been without issue. It kills just fine. When you increase the speed, you then may have other considerations to deal with (such as noise, potential accuracy issues, increased stress and wear-out of strings, cams or cables, etc.).