Doc

I agree. I understand that the DEC will be assigning ID's to trappers which will undoubtedly result in another list. Is that list going to be showing up on some of the more militant animal rights sites? Those wackos are definitely more psycho that the anti gun freaks, but the anti-gunners have a few derailed people of their own too. Is there nothing that the government accumulates that is safe from the Freedom of Information laws? How about individual census data. Is that up for public publishing too. I think not. So what makes pistol owners any less deserving of privacy? Certainly there must be some criteria that has to be met for this stuff to be part of public information. Doc

Lol ..... That's why I only carried it down to just below the garden. I wasn't going to lug that thing any farther than I had to. Besides, I had those deer coming through there like clockwork. It was perfect for an experiment just to see what they would do.

This thread is loaded with 20 pages of reasons. Bottom line, its a weapon more similar to a gun than anything else. i.e. scope, stock, trigger, locked and loaded, point and shoot......therefore it does not belong in the archery season. And so on and so forth. I agree. I would hate to have us all repeat those volumes of discussion again. I believe all those reasons were already on their 12th repeat the last time around. Nothing has changed in between.

My one and only attempt at decoying resulted in one very aggravated doe and her young-uns. I set up my 3-d target down below the garden while I hid in the hedgerow. Momma and her two offspring came along, got one look at the decoy and there we went with the foot stomping, head-bobbing dance routine. That lasted for about 5 minutes. I had my bow with me, but I was more interested in watching the show than trying a shot. It was pretty amusing, but I didn't get the feeling that I was fooling her for one minute.....lol. Finally, she blew me the raspberry and took off with her crew. By the way, I was completely hidden away from the line of sight, and the wind was blowing exactly away from the deer, so they had no idea I was anywhere around. Also, I didn't have the antlers on the target so it wasn't a case of her getting bothered by another pesky buck. I never tried the experiment again, but someday I will just to see what kind of reaction I get with a different bunch of deer. If nothing else it sure was entertaining. Doc

Per an article in the latest issue of New York Outdoor News, DMP tags will be lowered by 5% this year, statewide. However, just like the statewide deer harvest, that number means nothing to individual hunters. What you need to do is to look at the WMUs that you will be hunting. For example, in our WMU, 8N, the permits are less than 50% of what they were last year (from 23,600 last year to 11,300 this year) That's a long way from a 5% reduction. Also, there were 13 WMUs that didn't change at all. They had 0 permits last year and will issue 0 permits this year. Some WMUs even went up in permit numbers for this year. So the 5% number doesn't mean anything. Here is their explanation that gives a little insight into the trial and error "statistical" methods that are used to set permit numbers: "In many portions of the southern tier, after the population declines of 2003-2004, we reduced antlerless harvests (through a reduction inDMPs) for a couple of years and saw incremental deer population growth through 2006-07, Hurst said. We then began modestly ramping up antlerless harvests to keep deer populations from growing too fast and to avoid overshooting objective levels. Based on the 2008 and 2009 harvests, it appears that deer populations in many southern zone units began to level off prematurely, and easing up on antlerless harvest in these units is again necessary for 2010." Did you follow all that? First we had blasted the herd down too far so then we tried this and then we tried that, now we will try this again because the other is overshooting the mark. How are those statistics working these days? ...... lol . That's what I like .... good old statistical forcasting. Actually, if you have been keeping your ear to the ground, these results follow the exact trends that the hunters have been describing each year. Well, anyway take a look at those [last year/this year] comparisons and you will see how the DEC is reading the population changes in your particular WMU. It's kind of interesting. Maybe you'll agree, or maybe you won't :-\ Doc

The arguments back then were not so much about what the compound was as it was about the precedent being set that would eventually be used to eventually allow inappropriate weapons into bow seasons. I thought those guys were making far too much out of it. Who would have guessed how right they were and how wrong I was. Today the compound is being used as the precedent for jamming crossbows into bow seasons. It kind of makes you wonder just what the crossbow will be used as a precedent for in the near future doesn't it?

In the southern zone, if you had an opportunity to shove the whole season forward to begin at the 1st day of October, but had to relinquish the last week of the current bowseason, would you accept that kind of change. You would actually wind up with more bowhunting days, but you would give up a week of rut...... Acceptable?

Doewhacker- You are absolutely right. It's a hobby, recreation, pastime. It's not our living. It's very possible that the bulk of hunters that we lose every year are those frustrated individuals who take it all so seriously that they can't tolerate failure, or living up to the standards seen on TV. You never know. I know I hunt hard, but I also try to keep it all in perspective. How much of this super-seriousness comes from videos and TV. There's an awful lot of unrealistic expectations that can develop when we start setting our goals according to what we see on the TV screen. Doc

So they're telling you that you've got two chances to get a permit ...... slim and none.

For nearly all of my working life, I have commuted almost 80 miles, round trip per working day & a lot of Saturdays and was on the road between 3:00 and 5:00 am (in the dark), traveling through a lot of farm and forest country, and have never hit a deer (now I've done it!). On two occasions, I was hit by deer. I actually got thumped while the car was absolutely stopped, but never actually hit a deer. I did hit a pig once, but that's another story. One time I saw an oncoming car knock down a deer. I knew what happened because I saw the headlights wink and then I saw him pull over. So as I approached, I could see the deer flopping in front of the car so I pulled over to see if I could help. Before I got out of my car, the deer got up and ran over to my side of the road, circled way out in a field and came back and slammed broadside into my car. He fell down again and then got back up and ran off. Not much damage on that one plus my car was an old rusty Datsun so who cared anyway. Another time, I just got started toward work, and I spotted some deer in a neighbor's yard. I saw one was a pretty good sized buck so I pulled over and turned the car slightly to the side so they were in the edge of where the headlights were shining. I was pretty close. They all took off in different directions and the buck came right straight at me. Yup, BANG! right into my front fender. He went right down but only for a second and then he got up and smacked me again and then ran off. That time I had a little Honda CRX, and that fender took a beating. Almost had the fender rubbing on the tire. Doc

Most of the time these calls don't do a thing for me. However, there has been a couple of times years ago where I did get a look at a buck after using the grunt call along with rattling antlers. neither time did the buck ever come in within bow range. Blind calling has never worked at all for me. Of course I don't try that very often. I prefer to just try not to be noticed at all rather than run the risk of pin-pointing my location for the buck. If I see a buck that has no intention of coming within bow range then I might try some desparation measure to try to turn him in my direction. But I have yet to have that work either. Doc

That sounds like a good solution. Doc

I can't. My impression of a deer's size is unique to my own mindset. As is everyone else's idea of deer size. I don't belive there is any such thing as a universally agreed upon big deer or small deer unless it is an extreme of one or the other. Doc

Take a steel 6" scale and stick one end of it in your eye and have someone read the distance to the lens of the scope. It's a bit painful, but it will tell you if you are the recommended distance from the scope.

"Professionalism" ...... Now there's a word that you don't hear used with most hunting conversations unless you are talking about somebody that makes their living off of hunting ..... Lol. Of course there are other possible reasons to add to the list. Maybe we could add ego, or need for acceptance among other hunters. And then there might be a need to rank oneself against other hunters. Or how about inability to measure hunting success and satisfaction in any other terms than inches of antler? Yes the list of reasons is endless. Frankly, everybody has their own personal reasons for setting their hunting trophy goals where they do, and it really is nobody's concern where or why those goals are set where they are. At least that's the way I look at it. Doc

I think they must hold some permits back just in case some late applicants show up with preference points or landowner applications. I never did figure out how they hold a pure drawing when there are all kinds of different dates that people are applying. It's not like everybody throws their names into a hat and then on a given date somebody pulls names out. The drawing is always going on while new names are being added. You have to have some extras laying around with that kind of lottery. However, when one year you have a WMU with 23,600 potential permits available and you rate the odds as "high" for being selected, and then the next year you slash half of them to come up with 11,300 available, you would think that the odds would be something different than they were the year before. :-\ Doc

I have never found deer to be that predictable over any period of time. They may travel through the same general area, but deer usually are following their nose and their food. The deer that I have seen couldn't walk a straight line if they had to. Very short attention span. Another thing that I have noted is that during any phase of the rut, bucks tend to randomly travel crosswise to major deer trails. I think this is on purpose in that they can scent-check more trails that way to locate receptive does. So yes ther may be some periods of the year when deer will be habitual, but you can never count on it. Wouldn't hunting be a simple thing if they always did? Doc

That sounds like the thing I bought a few years back. It's made of plastic. It really helps steady things down. The other thing I do is incorporate some propped up logs around my gun stands that work as shooting rests.

One thing that should be remembered when using more than one tree to hold a stand, is that all year long, each one of those trees is doing its own thing and swaying in the wind and not always together. That constant pushing and pulling on nails will snap them eventually. I've had it happen. Nails do not hold up well against fatigue forces so it is always good to check all areas of the stand every year. The only exception that I have ever seen was a stand I built out of pressure treated 2"x8" which were held to the trees with heavily galvanized 5/8" diameter lag-screws. That stand is going on it's eighth year and shows absolutely no sign of anything breaking or coming apart. I have reached the point where I don't use treestands at all anymore, but I will guarantee that that stand will be there long after I'm gone, and may even outlast the trees that it is fastened to. Doc

I honestly don't have a clue about the inner workings of the permit draw system. The way I would interpret it is that there is no second permit draw if they say "none". So you may be limited to only one draw in 4F and not eligible to submit two draws for that WMU. I'm thinking that if you want a second draw, it would have to be some WMU other than 4F. However, I am just guessing.

Well, as usual, I'm confused. When I look at WMU 8N the odds of being selected for an antlerless permit as well as a second permit is supposed to be HIGH then out comes the latest issue of New York Outdoor News which shows that the number of permits to be given out in 8N this year is less than 1/2 of what was given out last year. So they can apparently cut the number of permits in half and still have a high chance of being selected in 8N. I suppose that's possible, but it sure does sound peculiar to me. What in the heck did they ever expect to do with all those permits last year? They're looking at a 10% overall statewide cut this year, so you may want to take a closer look at your WMU just to see if there are any surprises. Some of them are cut a whole lot more than just 10%. Doc

This year, we have bunnies everywhere. They hardly even get out of the way of the lawnmower. But, I have seen this before in other years and by the time the season gets here, they all disappear. Of course it doesn't help that they sit right in the middle of the yard waiting for any hungry hawk to spot them ...... the dummys! But this year we have so many of them around, there just might be a huntable population around when the season opens. Doc

Well ............. That's another way ..... lol.

3" group at 75 yards offhand is still a lot better than I can do anymore. Good ol' wobbly Doc! I won't even take an unsteadied offhand shot anymore. I have to be steadied against a tree or in a kneeling position or prone or something. It's hell to get old. Of course it beats the alternatives. ;D Doc

I'm guessing that if you had powder stored in the safe, there might be some hazard to guns, papers, and other valuables stored inside the safe in the case of a fire. In my case and maybe some others that would be a real possibility because a fire-proof safe would be the most likely place to store such powder. So if I had a fireproof gun safe, I might be tempted to reserve a spot inside for my gunpowder. So I guess one question that someone might ask is if a safe went through a typical house fire and had gunpowder inside of it, do the temperatures get high enough to ignite the powder. If so, the damage to other valuables inside the safe is obvious (fire on the outside and now a fire on the inside). Knowing that little tidbit could make the difference between whether it is a good idea to store gunpowder inside the gun-safe or have another fireproof container designated for gunpowder storage. I've always been a bit nervous about storing gunpowder on a shelf in my shop downstairs ...... talk about an accelerant!! Anyway, thanks for the info, and I will be checking out the link you supplied right now. Doc