dave6x6

Here's some of my thoughts on ag clover and why i don't use it. Ag clover is designed to feed livestock and does a great job of that because of the tonnage ratio's per acre that these forages produce. When feeding livestock, you are basically only worried about pure tonnage and not so much with protien levels and palatability. Therefore they are generally much more stemmy and fiborous. I think that many people are impressed with the ag clover because of the way it looks after they plant it. Very tall, lush and healthy looking plants. But us hunters are not attracting cows. Cows dont care what the stems taste like. Cows eat what the are fed. Deer on the other hand are much more fussy about their clover. They much prefer the tender leaves and shoots over the more rigid, fiber stalks. We have done side by side tests with a number of different clovers in an effort to find the most attractive ones to plant on our properties as well as our clients and what we found was eye opening. The ag clover was definetly a beautiful, lush green plot. The only problem was the deer never touched it until Feb. when it was the only thing left to dig for. The whitetail stuff looked like it was half as tall but only because the deer ate it straight through the season. We would litterally watch the deer enter the WI field, graze til they got to the other brands, then turn around and work through the WI plot til they got to the next side. If you hunt in big woods areas, ag clover may bring deer in, But in the agricultural areas of Central and Western NY, there is plenty of food for deer to eat during the hunting season. So if you want to pull them off the beans and the corn and the apples and acorns, Then you better have a tasty clover mix. Not just one that looks good.

NYBowhunter, You are absolutely correct about getting lab reports from Agway. I only mentioned the Whitetail Inst. lab because that is the most convenient for me. I wish i had an Agway close by. I've also sent stuff to Cornell. By all means, if you have a Co-op or farm service that is close by then that would be your best choice. It sounds like we would agree that in general, using a lab tested soil report is worth the time and effort when you absolutely need to know the nutrient levels of your soil. The DIY tests do have a place in your food plot arsenal, and i do think you can get a fairly good PH result from using some of them, but for me they are only used on plots that are existing and appear to be in good health. New ground and plots with obvious problems that you are trying to save will need lab reports to get it right. As far as ag seed vs. designer seeds go, well i guess i would respectfully disagree. We've tested many side by side and can tell you that Whitetail products work best for us. Hope that doesn't get this thread off tract. LOL

Just funnin' with you Kevin.. If that buck was on my camera, you would have a better chance of seeing naked pictures of my wife posted on here than seeing that buck.. LOL He would be my little secret until i killed him or i was pretty sure he was dead..

Not really sure about the biologic meter but i personally would not trust them if i was starting a new food plot. And i certainly would not ball park the N-P-K figures. With the cost of fertilizer today, to me it just makes more sense to send your sample off to Whitetail Inst. so that you get back the complete report on exactly what your soil needs to grow the specific plant your putting in the ground. You can certainly fudge some things with food plot plantings but why guess and run the risk of putting down products that your plants may not even need, wasting money, or worse yet, not putting down the proper amounts and having a plot that comes in like crap and becomes a hot bed for weeds the first couple years. Now for an existing plot that you have been working for a few years, the do it yourself meters would probably be fine to give you some sort of idea where it stands and if some sort of a boost is needed in the nutrient department. But still, for $17 , I would rather have the exact lab results. It may save you a couple hundred in Lime and Fertilizer. Also CBX. you cant ballpark NPK figures based on PH levels. They have nothing to do with each other. They need to be brought up to their desired levels independant of each other..

Dont think your going to get an answer to that question Kevin. Surprised he even gave the county of that beast.. Thats a Legend Maker.. WNY, Not at all surprised to see another giant from your hunting grounds. Great stuff.

Forest, Putting your heart and soul into being a great hunter will give you a life time of rewards. Do it half-ashh and you will be frustrated and bitter. As Burt stated, practice and perfect your archery skill so that they become a part of you as the ultimate preditor. Over time you will learn more and more about deer behavior and stand placements and things that will up your opportunities, but first and formost right now is to become great with your set-up. When i was at your stage, 95% of my efforts in the first few years was spent making sure i was the best archer i knew. Any joker can pick up a bow and hit plates at 20 yrds after about 10 minutes but if you put everything into studying the art of shooting a bow from the true masters(not from your buddy at school) you will have the foundation that will ensure successful kills 99% of the time.. When you practice, do it like your life depends on mastering this skill. Go have fun flinging arrow when you can but practice is serious time. Set your goals on being a great hunter after that.

In all seriousness, i personally feel like i have learned the most from the people on here that i dont always agree with and i find myself thinking about their points of view to see how it could improve both my hunting experiences and skills. It also seems like the people i've debated with hardest have turned out to be the ones i look forward to hearing from. Someone on here once said that they treat this site like your having a beer with a bunch of hunting guys. Throughout the night your going to debate some issues and toss some strong words about but at the end of the night ya'll say, "see ya tommarow?" That's helped me to keep thing from getting personal. By the way, I've learned something from almost everyone. Everyone but RifleSharpShot.. Nothing useful to me there. lol

Dinsdale. Once again you have given some great advice. Especially the bag/zipper info. I'll check it out. Also the olive oil is great idea. I'll check out that food site. Going to be bringing olive oil, some noodles, peanut butter, bacon bits and my venison jerky with the pack meals. Tomarrow we hike.. Thirty lbs to start and we'll try to get a few miles in up at Gononagan..

Dtg and others, Thanks for asking. Wish i had good news but today only sadness.. After battling cancer for 9 months, my wife and i had to put our Border Collie "Scout" down on Friday. He was a trooper and surprised all the Dr.s who gave him 4-6 weeks back in March. Well he was here right through the new year and was in great shape until this past week when things turned quickly. He was only 5 yrs. old and we called him "the good dog" lol . He was an amazing, loyal, sweet dog and my wife is crushed.. me too.. So now its just Bailey and Bandit. AKA - Ali and Frazier. Batman and the Joker, left at home and things are a bit odd without Scout. Bandit was always protecting Scout so now he has been a bit more mellow. And when Scout was sick, he got most of the attention in the house, which drove Bailey nuts so she has been much better also. She actually has been doing great lately and we have a person in Ohio that may be interested in her but nothing concrete has been discussed. In the meantime we are just going forward with the hopes of finding a great owner but also being realistic in that we may never find one. As great a dog as she is, she's still only one of thousands out there that need a home. This week we went to the Dodge dealership and Bailey decided she liked the red truck the best.. Good dog!! Also here is Scout, Bandit and Bailey. left-right

Cummins, Good info. Sounds like you share my gear-aholic bug as well. LOL We have researched this area for years in the hopes of finding a trophy Mulie area that us working stiffs can pack up the truck and head west for DIY hunt on the cheap. Well we've finally found the right spot and my brother and buddy hunted it this past yr, and were so impressed that were taking two seperate hunting teams this year, but buying all the gear is getting expensive. I'm not complaining, i love buying stuff and finding great deals but i've had to decide which stuff i need right away, and which stuff i can borrow and purchase in the years to come. Our plan is to do this every year so i've got time to upgrade things as i need. Here is where i am at right now. Clothing: Love the new Kuiu stuff by the way. Bought the softshell gloves to check out the quality and my buddy bought the complete line-up on a recomendation by our guide friend in Wyoming. I've become a huge fan of the new Russell Gear and as a matter of fact, i sold some of my Sitka gear to switch over to the Russell stuff. It's just better... Hard shell Russell Cyclone packable rain gear.. 2.5 layer, 4 way stretch, breathable.. Soft shell Russell Gale L4 for outerwear. Windproof, water resistant, breathable strech fabric.. EMS poly underlayer and probably Under Armour Evolution as well.. Cabelas packable synthetic down jacket in case it turns cold.. Boots: Your list was exactly like mine so i bought the Asolo Sasslong boots. Got a great deal and am super happy with that.. Backpack: I'm torn on this one because i have the choice of a Eberlestock or Badlands pack that i can borrow from a friend but really want to buy the Horn Hunter Big Horn pack for myself. May save the money this trip and borrow the Eberlestock.. Tent: All set there.. My brother has that ready to go. Really going to look into going Bivy next time like Dinsdale said.. Looks like a really good set-up for this type of hunt.. Food: Going to do the de-hydrated foods and have started to stock up on some already.. Still need to research and make sure i'm bringing the right stuff and getting the needed calories and all..Also need to purchase water purifier, probably gravity fed. Cooking Gear: Have some stuff i can borrow, but will be purchasing ultra-lite stove and then buy the fuel when we land in Denver. Do everything titanium pot/cup ect.. Sleeping Stuff: Having tough choice here. Can't borrow some other fellas sleeping bag. LOL Would like to get 15-20 degree bag with pack weight under 3 lbs. Probably down not synthetic. Pack size is a major issue for me. I've found bags but got to find best price. Also need good quality tarp, and sleeping pad. These things are the major issues left so any advice on brands or deals out there would be helpful..

All single ladder stands and portables get pulled. Too many to think about now.. Been slowly switching all the portables over to climbing sticks. Can literally set or take down a 20 ft stand in 15 min..

Brothers 10 bow. and gun buck with boys..

Here's a buddies from 8h. Bow

Not that i know of. Take a break and use these next couple months to make sure you have yourself organized and ready for the spring. Having a solid game plan will save you many headaches as opposed to just hitting it without much thought in the late spring. Also use this time to make sure your equipment is ready to roll come green-up. The first three things on our spring agenda are. (1) frost seed any perrenials that need a boost. (2) Weed control where needed about the time you notice your lawn needs it's first mowing. (3) Start turning dirt as soon as the conditions are right for the tractors..

Rifle buck

Scobar. Thanks for asking about Bailey. I have to admit that it is really hard to describe Bailey and our situation in this forum setting only because it is a long and complicated story. I will PM you my wife's e-mail and give you her Phone # so she can talk to you in greater detail. In short, the answer to your question is that Bailey is not the instigator but as our trainers have told us many time, Baiey is very reactionary or quik to react. She is not what i would concider high energy. But she has moments of manic excitement. (like when i come home or mommy leaves) In the two months since we have been keeping the dogs seperated, she has been the perfect family dog. Bandit and her just cant stand to breathe the same air together.LOL.

You know i woke my photographer up because it was midnight, told him to meet me in the woods at the corn feeder. Just past the salt licks and 200yrds north of the apple pile. If you get to the C'Mere Deer troth you went too far. And then he gets there and takes the picture with the bottom of the deer cut off... I'm gonna have to start interviewing new photographers for next yr.

Thanks for the congrats ya'll..

This one i shot tonight didn't need any bloating to look impressive..

Because i'm a trophy hunter, whenever i shoot a doe i just let her sit for a day or two before i get a couple pictures. They look much more impressive when their belly's about to explode..lol

Not exactly sure the weight.. She clearly needs to shop in the plus size store..

End of the line doe tonight. Super stoked to have her. She is big and pretty aint she.. The smoker did the job as she was looking pretty much right towards me. Put the bead right on the base of her neck and let it rip. She went about 30 yrds and piled up. Fun stuff and great end to a tough season..

Congrats on the does fellas..

I'd like to officially retract my last post.. My wife says the season is long enough. What was i thinking..

I would agree wwith a couple earlier posts. Take a holiday break and then open muzzy up for a couple weeks after the 1st of the year. I've never really seen bucks dropping much before Feb. and even that is early in my parts. I suppose it does happen but normally they hang on to them long enough for a late muzzy season..