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jjb4900

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Posts posted by jjb4900

  1. My post was a long winded explanation of why recoil will vary from rifle to rifle.

     

    The weight of the rifle & the stock geometry is why. When the rfile is lightweight, stock geometry becomes a HUGE factor.

     

    Years ago I built my brother-in-law, Daniel, a nice "Ohio Vally" .50cal muzzle loading rifle.

     

    I got my hands on a 36" x 7/8" Douglas octagon barrel in .50, something that officailly didn't exist. It was opined that it was a "back door" barrel, most likely done by someone that worked @ Douglas had made on the QT since the smallest cross section .50 Douglas profile was 15/16"

     

    Anyway, it made a nice lightweight rifle. The cast traditional cresent brass buttplate I used was very near 90° & when the top of the heel was angled W/the comb. The angle in relation to ones shoulder was quite pronounced, angling forward @ the toe. (bottom)

     

    As usual, I took the time to sight the rifle in & "adjust" the fixed sights W/a file & punch before doing any metal or wood finish. W/hunting loads of 90gr FFFg behind a patched .490 RB, the rifle would rare up & drive the comb into one's cheek bone. After firing about 10 rounds, I had the rifle sighted in, but my face looked like I had gone a few rounds W/Mike Tyson. My cheek was quite swolen. It was so bad that my right eye was partially closed.

     

    I turned the rifle over to Daniel to varify the POI. When he retrned the weapon several days later for me to do the final finish, I asked him what he thought.

     

    "Well," he said.

     

    "It beat the $hit out of you didn't it?" I replied.

     

    He answered, "yeah."

     

    I heated up the brass casting to a dull red & bent the toe of the cresent to the rear, making the angle in relationship to the shoulder to  near 0°. That turned the evil face beater into a docile, pleasant to shoot rifle.

     

    Rifles W/stocks that have the buttplate angled forward @ the toe will tend to rise upon recoil as will older style stocks W/a lot of "drop" @ the comb. Modern assualt weapons have the sights mounted high for a reason. That puts the bore axis in a straight line W/the shoulder, thus sending recoil in a straight line into the shooters body. That reduced muzzle rise  significantly.

     

    Another bit of stock geometry that reduces felt recoil is "cast on". Cast on angles the rear of the stock towards the shooter's face. This makes the rifle tend to recoil away (horizontally) from the shooters face. 

     

    My 7 1/2# (all up weight W/scope/sling/ammo) 8X57 generates 3300 ft # of Me W/"adult pressure" loads, yet it is not unpleasant to shoot dispite having a curved metal buttplate. The angle of the buttplate is nearly 0°, the drop is not ecessive & there is considerable cast on. In the picture below, you can see the angle of the buttplate & the nearly straight line from the bore axis to the heel (top) of the butt.

     

    VZ500ObendorfMauser007-1.jpg

     

    Make no mistake, this rifle has considerable recoil. The laws of physics coupled W/3300# of Me & relatively light AUW dictate that. What it does, is transmit the considerable recoil straight into the shoulder & not the face/head. That reduces "felt" recoil.

    yes, I'm aware why some rifles recoil differently then others, my "I have no idea what you just said" comment was a failed attempt at some humor directed at your extensive, but informative, response as to why guns recoil differently.   

  2. I can find those people too, and I can also find people that are sick of having restrictions, regulations and  more damned screwy laws and complexities added to their hunting, faster than the stinking regs can be printed. Everybody has more crazy fad-management ideas than you can even keep straight anymore. One buck limits, EAB, ARs, ..... I'm sure I have left some out. And now they are talking about things getting so complex that in addition to Regions, and WMUs with all their pages of verbal descriptions to keep track of, they will be needing yet another set of areas complete with yet another wall of verbiage to describe their boundaries. Where does all this nonsense stop so that people can just relax and hunt? How many people are starting to bail out because of all this craziness.

    I think people underestimate the amount of casual hunters out there....I may be way off, but I bet they out number the serious, dedicated hunters by a pretty big margin. They're either going to continue to hunt because they don't care if they kill anything at all and just enjoy going or they're gonna throw in the towel because of all the nonsense.

    • Like 3
  3. What about a few layers of painters tarps?

    that should work just as well if it's just stopping an arrow from a low poundage bow........don't make it tight, hang it a few feet behind the target and let the bottom hang free so it has some give to it.

  4. I was explaining what he said when you said you didn't understand it. In your case, what is different that is making it feel that way?

    same bullets but totally different rifles.....I also have two .308's that are night and day in felt recoil, but again different rifles. I think some one earlier said they heard a .308 has less recoil than a 30-06, I don't think you can make that blanket statement and be accurate because of the variations in rifle's out there.

  5. Let me try this. Basically if you had a 308 and an '06 in the exact same rifle platform with the same rifle weight and the same stock configurations and shooting the same grain bullet weight, the difference in felt recoil would be zero.

    yes.....that's why I had ended one of my earlier responses by saying recoil will vary rifle to rifle.

  6. "Free recoil" is the results of the weight of the ejecta (including the powder) factored W/the Mv. In the real world "free  recoil" also needs to factor in the weight of the weapon as gravity will be a factor in how much that weight is propelled backward. Felt recoil adds stock geometry into the mix & that last factor can have more affect on "felt" recoil than than anything when the other factors do not vary a great deal. "Perceived recoil" will be affected by muzzle blast too.

     

    The weight of the powder is still relavent because although it is converted to a gas, the weight of that gas & the small amout on residue left after combustion will still equal the weight of the uncombusted powder. In the case of the .308 Vs the '06, that is not a huge difference. In the case of a 4 dram black powder charge behind 1 1/4oz of shot vs a 4 dram equivalent smokeless powder load, the difference in the weight of the ejecta equals nearly 90gr more for the black powder load.

     

    The laws of physics dictate that a .308 that has nearly the same Mv W/a given bullet weight will have nearly the same recoil as a 30-06 if all other cfactors are equal. The same laws dictate that a black powder & smokeless powder shotgun loads W/equal payloads of shot that are leaving the muzzle @ the same velocity will vary considerably in recoil.

    I don't know what you just said,  all I know is one gun hurts more than the other.......

  7. Ladies please, you're both pretty. Try and get along

    it's really not a matter of getting along, it's for the most part an anonymous message board...we all post stuff that rubs people the wrong way and we either apologize for stuff we shouldn't have said or just suck it up and move along.....either way I can't think of people who change their username every few months in order to get out from under it..this wackos response is to say he should have changed his name to "IJstDidUrWife".....so he went from trying to "make nice" to going back to his old wacky self in one post....that's enough said about his mindset.

  8. Spoken like a true genius...not. I do love guys like you that forget when the long bow guys felt the same way with your compound but that's different right..ahhh not. Some people just need to feel better than huh. I guess I better take my crossbow and hunt in almost every other state that wow let's you shoot any version of a compound vertical and horizontal. We all know that the additional millions of dollars that will be spent by law abiding crossbow hunters isn't needed here in NY either. Keep spewing nonsense.

    just my 2 cents...

    Crossbows here to stay period..waited long enough.

    of course they have a place in archery season....in the hands of hunters who realize they have limitations as any other archery gear and respect that..when you get guys who say they are the end all to the limitations of what a bow can do is when you get people who have a problem with them...unless of course you have those "jesus" guided arrows, then nothing else matters.

    • Like 3
  9.  "IJstDidUrWife"...........didn't take long for your true wackjob self come out did it? if you want to play nice, stop changing your username every time you rub people the wrong way and maybe just think before you post crap...trying to come out as someone else in an effort to reinvent yourself every few months just makes you appear wackier.

  10. Well, how bad can it get?

    I don't blame it all on coaches, I think players that don't get the job done are worse. The coach isn't on the field making the plays.

    Benching Manuel was a good decision! Orton took the Bills to 9/7 and # 2 in our division. That's not to shabby when you consider the past. I think Orton might do well, at least he isn't blind to jersey color like *****patrick and throws the ball to the wrong team 68% of the time.

     

    The Bills beat some of the top ranked teams this year. They have some momentum going into next season!

     

    We had a ton of rookies on O! They kicked ass! Let 'em play and see what happens next year!

     

    Except Manuel, he's gotta go!  He did nothing in his rookie year, and less this year. The hype didn't live up to the reality!

    Cyaniderob, JustRob and now ...Rob? three username changes in 6 months has got to be some type of record.

  11. Never known a deer to treat a tree like a dog does. This looks more like the scat was tossed around that tree, deer poop in little piles, they don't spray it like in this pic. If it was all urine, I might believe it. Most of the the tracks look old, yet the scat is sitting on top of most of the tracks...

    Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...........................................................

    Cough! 

    Cyaniderob, JustRob and now ...Rob? three username changes in 6 months has got to be some type of record.

    • Like 3
  12. I will be honest and no i have not read the Quran cover to cover but I have read a lot, not by choice... just what happens when you go to collage and liberal professors try to shove propaganda down American teens throats.  And I will go out on a limb here and say I doubt you have read the entire book in its original language therefore u may not have a full understanding either.  

     

    But I have not taken anything out of context, Those are translated quotes, and i was careful in picking them, I have seen some translations that are a bit biased and did not choose them.  Answer this, do you think we should have Sharia Law in any part of the USA?

    we shouldn't have any outside laws, regardless of the institution they come from, play any part or be tolerated in the USA.

    • Like 1
  13. I don't know much about nesting....but I have noticed that the birds I have seen this year have seen have not seemed to be yearlings....i have been seeing a flock of maybe 10-15 daily checking traps and they all look to be bigger birds.

    I may be wrong, but I believe turkeys grow pretty quickly and appear to be as big as the adult hens within about 6-8 months.

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