Arkansas adopts US's most restrictive abortion law

[ants]

What would you have preferred China do about their over population problem? And as far as late term, I dont like it and wouldnt totally disagree with something along the lines of what Arkansas did. But with right to lifers its usually all or nothing and agreeing to anything inbetween will usually get you called cold and callus.

Whats your opinion on abortion Doctors, if the ultrasound revealed a child was going to be an abortion doctor when it grew up would you have that baby terminated? I mean you have thrown out some pretty good hypotheticals, heres a few for you.

No I wouldn't abort if an ultrasound showed that the baby would turn out to be an abortion Dr. But you would be in favor of a woman being held down and forced to undergo an abortion, against her will, if it helps with an overpopulation problem. You have just about said so. Yes Sits, your view of life is Cold and Callus. But there are a lot of people out there that share your views so don't sweat it. Your opinion is your opinion.

[growalot]

Holy Cow...where were all these right to lifers when This country incinerated two Japanese cities full of innocent lives...Ohhh that's right.... they were doing this to there fellow countrymen(woman)...wrapped up in the flag and carrying their bibles....Also those same men ..they didn't go after the ppl of color doing the same thing as they did the wht. woman...imagine that.......I can't help but laugh at the abundant Hypocrisy...as I watch ppl scurying along lifes path.

The new mode of enforcing the criminal abortion laws brought women into contact with the criminal justice system in unprecedented ways. Like the old mode, the state's methods used interrogation and the humiliation of public exposure to penalize women who had abortions. However, rather than relying on dying declarations as the primary evidence against accused abortionists, prosecutors now took the novel approach of looking for healthy female patients to serve as witnesses against their abortionists. Prosecutors showed great persistence in tracking down women who had illegal abortions and routinely brought them into the courtroom and put their abortions on display for judge, jury, and journalist. Women had before felt the force of law during interrogations on their deathbeds; now women were forced to speak of their abortions in the male-dominated spaces of the police station and the courtroom.

Almost simultaneously with the shift in police tactics to control abortion, hospital administrators created new policies to restrict therapeutic abortion. Though the new hospital policies and state efforts to

[ants]

Holy Cow...where were all these right to lifers when This country incinerated two Japanese cities full of innocent lives...Ohhh that's right.... they were doing this to there fellow countrymen(woman)...wrapped up in the flag and carrying their bibles....Also those same men ..they didn't go after the ppl of color doing the same thing as they did the wht. woman...imagine that.......I can't help but laugh at the abundant Hypocrisy...as I watch ppl scurying along lifes path.

So you're going to put abortion and World War II on the same page? Really?? Am I getting a whiff of desperation here Grow?

Damn men !!

[Carbonelement]

you people with the "inconvenience" term are off your tree. I find it extremely disrespectful toward women. I would pay you to say that to widowers who lost their wife during child labor, that little bit in inconvenience that cost them their life it does happen.

NYHB they are fetus' just because you do not like the term does not make it change. Go back a few pages and read the definition. It is baby once it is born until that day its a fetus. Just like your AR-15 is NOT an Assault Rifle. Funny how you can pick and choose when to make up definitions. And lastly these are the facts of life, if you choose to ignore them because you either are not adult enough to discuss them with out getting angry or simply just choose to turn a blind eye thats your prerogative. and all the power to you.

She is not grasping at straws, all she is doing is making a valid comparison. Funny how people pick and choose when to be righteous. Thats why i brought up the religious aspect earlier. I went to school with many girls who got knocked up and were very fast to say i cant get an abortion it goes against my religious views. Well Mrs. those same views are against pre marital sex, where was your bible then sweety?

[Carbonelement]

We are for the most part all adults here, and know what it takes to provide for a child. Do you really think all the people in this country are willing/able to do that for their kids. I think there should be financial requirements for parents planning to have children. AND a tax increase, not cut! I never understood why the people who cost he government more got tax cuts.

As far as the border goes, wether or not you would like to admit it we need those people here. I would be willing to bet when you need work done on your house you same people who hate these "border jumpers" and quick to hire them. BECAUSE the cost is most likely less than half that it would be for a legal American company who is registered, insured, and everything else that comes along with it. You all have shopped at a fast food restaurant in your life and probably complained about the spanish speaking people who screwed up your order. Would you be willing to pay double for the same meal if it were educated americans behind the counter....I doubt it. Its the same thing as abortion topic, you want to get rid if it but don't want to support the children who are brought into the world. OH just throw them in an orphanage or foster house....those things cost money how many of you anti abortion people have donated to these causes in your life....NONE of you is what Id be willing to bet on.

EDIT*** or just tell teens not to have sex and that will work. LOL dream on dreamers, it has not worked for the past few hundred years and it wont start working tomorrow.

Edited March 9, 2013 by Carbonelement

[5.9cummins]

She is not grasping at straws, all she is doing is making a valid comparison. Funny how people pick and choose when to be righteous. Thats why i brought up the religious aspect earlier. I went to school with many girls who got knocked up and were very fast to say i cant get an abortion it goes against my religious views. Well Mrs. those same views are against pre marital sex, where was your bible then sweety?

So your going to knock there religious beliefs because they are not perfect?

I would commend them for having the fortitude to make the right decision. No one on this earth is perfect even though we are called to try and attain perfection.

Our entire society is based on the belief that pain or sacrifice has no value. That if its hard or its something you don't want to do it means its wrong. Its all about ME, Abortion, child rearing, work - just take the easy way out.

Pride and greed are taking us down a very dark path.

[Carbonelement]

have you ever thought that its being more selfless, than selfish? Like I have said before an abortion takes a toll on woman. Do you really think everyone who gets an abortion just forgets about it the next day. Its mentally crushing and takes a physical toll as well. Do you disagree that there are woman and couples out there that have thought it through and realized they may not capable to provide the child with a life worth living and it leads to their choice for an abortion? AND live with that choice every day!...I am not saying everyone but you anti's and lumping these people all together and it is wrong. To think that people who choose the path to an abortion are just using it as a way to dodge the "inconvenience" is ludicrous.

[Geno C]

I am not apposed to abortion... There are way to many people at a very young age and above who CAN NOT even support themselves let alone a child to many on state/gov aid that we pay for. A lot of younger kids having kids do not have have supportive parents that would help them raise and support the new edition. Let alone parents in general that would help if they could. I wish some of the low life leaches who cant stop having children just to get the aid they need for free. those people should be sterilized...

Some are for it and some are not for it. I would much rather see a young teen who has gotten pregnant, whos boy friend leaves them high and dry take a path of abortion and be able to pursue a career or college and further their own life and be able to have a child when they become more stable instead of having no one to help take on the responsibilities, such as boy friend or supportive parents, live in a nasty environment leaching off the system just to stay alive. i mean what kind of life is that for a baby to be brought into? im not saying everyone should abort, i mean if i had a daughter i would ultimately leave it to her decision and support her every way possible, some people in a pregnancy do not have that leisure and support.

[Carbonelement]

its not only the religious factor i just mentioned it again because I had brought it up in previous post.

[growalot]

So your going to knock there religious beliefs because they are not perfect?

I would commend them for having the fortitude to make the right decision. No one on this earth is perfect even though we are called to try and attain perfection.

Our entire society is based on the belief that pain or sacrifice has no value. That if its hard or its something you don't want to do it means its wrong. Its all about ME, Abortion, child rearing, work - just take the easy way out.

Pride and greed are taking us down a very dark path.

The problem is you do not even see the Hypocrisy in what you just wrote...No worries to the dictionary police...The following is from the Merriam-Webster

hypocrisy

Popularity

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hy·poc·ri·sy

noun \hi-ˈpä-krə-sē also hī-\

plural hy·poc·ri·sies

Definition of HYPOCRISY

1

: a feigning to be what one is not or to believe what one does not; especially : the false assumption of an appearance of virtue or religion

2

: an act or instance of hypocrisy

See hypocrisy defined for English-language learners »

See hypocrisy defined for kids »

Examples of HYPOCRISY

1. When his private letters were made public, they revealed his hypocrisy.
   
2. the hypocrisy of people who say one thing but do another
   
3. Teenagers often have a keen awareness of their parents' hypocrisies.
   

Edited March 9, 2013 by growalot

[Geno C]

people should have the option, plain and simple... its a free country correct? if i was in some of the positions some are right now as we speak, who are feeling alone and scared, who have no way of bringing up a child, no stability what so ever in their own life, no place they can call a home, no job, no nothing... basically rock bottom... if i was them i would personally like the option to be able to abort and dig myself out and try at what ever chance to start a life in this country we call the land of opportunity. Everyone here should have their own opinion but simply they should have the right for that option.

you said it CARBONELEMENT, your words: (these abortions take a mental toll on women) and maybe that mental toll can also be fuel to better them selves work hard at life and cherish the next opportunity at a pregnancy when shes ready or when it happens again...

dont get me wrong, the flip side is keeping a baby in some cases may give people the strength and desire to better themselves and give the baby what they never had. so there are many ways to look at it

[growalot]

So you're going to put abortion and World War II on the same page? Really?? Am I getting a whiff of desperation here Grow?

Damn men !!

This is where I see the light filtering through your stance....Perhaps a transparency to the real problem your having...Could it be woman in general I ask.....Now I have not made the same kind of negative stance against men in my debate....so why would you continue to repeat that phase?

[5.9cummins]

have you ever thought that its being more selfless, than selfish? Like I have said before an abortion takes a toll on woman. Do you really think everyone who gets an abortion just forgets about it the next day. Its mentally crushing and takes a physical toll as well. Do you disagree that there are woman and couples out there that have thought it through and realized they may not capable to provide the child with a life worth living and it leads to their choice for an abortion? AND live with that choice every day!...I am not saying everyone but you anti's and lumping these people all together and it is wrong. To think that people who choose the path to an abortion are just using it as a way to dodge the "inconvenience" is ludicrous.

NO!!

An abortion is not selfless - giving your life for another is selfless. There is no greater LOVE than to lay down ones life for another.

Yes it takes a great toll on a woman who has an abortion. I would argue that the abortion would take a far greater toll on the woman than having the baby and giving it up for adoption. The suicide rate, drug use, depression rates for women who have abortions are far higher than women who bring the children into the world.

I will concede that inconvenience is a poor choice of words SACRIFICE is what i should be using.

The problem is you do not even see the Hypocrisy in what you just wrote...No worries to the dictionary police...The following is from the Merriam-Webster

And your point being?

Knowing that you will be forgiven for whatever you do is not an excuse to do something.

As for me being a hypocrite do you know me or what i do in my house? Do you know my religious beliefs or how I raise my children?

Here is a short breakdown of my "Pro-life beliefes"

- Catholic (convert)

- 4 children

- We have never had an abortion

- We don't use birth control

- and we give a SUBSTANTIAL amount of our income to pro life organizations who minister to abortion victims. And when i say victims i mean the children who survive and helping mothers to recover from what they are put through.

As for morals - there are such things as moral absolutes and they are not negotiable.

[Carbonelement]

they are your morals... and I and i am sure others here respect them. BUT once again they are YOUR morals, no need to push them upon others. You are Catholic, and up until days ago the head figure of your religion has had ties to child molestation, so maybe just maybe someone can argue your "catholic morals" may be a bit off. I mean look at it logically how could you embrace a religion that puts an alleged pedophile as a central figure. Im just saying! I went to catholic collage and never had a problem, in no way am I saying all Catholics are bad Im just looking at it from the other side.

I do not know you at all, and I would be willing to put my life on the line and say that you do not condone the alleged behavior of Pope Benedict.

We live in a country that allows it's citizens to practice any religion they choose. You choose the Catholic religion and thats great but why is that "more great" than say Satanism, which may lead to a different set of morals.

EDIT*** My point here is that one religion should not effect the laws in a country where there is separation between church and state and where all citizens have the freedom to choose what religion they would like to practice

Edited March 9, 2013 by Carbonelement

[sits in trees]

No I wouldn't abort if an ultrasound showed that the baby would turn out to be an abortion Dr. But you would be in favor of a woman being held down and forced to undergo an abortion, against her will, if it helps with an overpopulation problem. You have just about said so. Yes Sits, your view of life is Cold and Callus. But there are a lot of people out there that share your views so don't sweat it. Your opinion is your opinion.

Not a chance Ants, wont be sweatin nothin, I know my children are loved and well cared for and have received everything they ever needed and thats good enough, Im gonna have to leave all that worrying about every other baby born or not on this planet to someone else, just aint got that amount of love, maybe you do...

What about taking care of babys after they're born, you know welfare mama by products which are being produced by the millions in this country with mothers who know damn well the system with your tax dollars will take care of her kids when they need 500 thousand dollar medical treatments or care for asthma at the age of 3 which will cost us about another 100K by the time the kid reaches 12?

What about kids born into welfare with heart defects, should Obama care take care of them or lower the income requirements for people who cant afford health insurance so that kid can get the heart surgery and 100s of thousands of dollars in meds its gonna need for a lifetime. What about an illegal aliens kid who comes over here with leukemia and needs medical treatment at the age of say 6 months. whats the magic age when you stop caring and wanting to make sure every child in our country is cared for, or is it just till it pops its head out of the ole love canal then yer on yer own kid, go ahead and die now.

Naa dont bother answering im pretty sure i know your answer, but maybe try and answer this one, at what point does the life of a baby, or child become not so precious where you can say,hey lady, you and your kid are on your own and if you dont have the cash for your little girls operation she just gonna have to croak, sorry.

[sits in trees]

Oh and for the record Ants, i dont care what they do in China the same way they dont care about us here in the states, if they are tying there women down and preforming abortions on them then sign up with whatever group you need to and go over and stop it....

[growalot]

So....this is my final post in this thread....That is due to the realization there are some ppl here that find it difficult to use Gods greatest gift to them...Independent rational thought....I Say in all sincerity..

Thank You God for not having infinite patients...Thank you For not interceding in natural disasters...mass Killings and

Wars...for You do know when this world needs a good cleaning....

Hey dinosaurs...a tad too big ....gone.....If Noah's Arc and the Great flood happened...Good for you in not distinguishing between the innocence and evil......So what you decided to save a chosen few and Aborted the rest...you made them ...Your choice

At this rate...I'm thinking your next cleaning won't be far off...For I understand that this ball we're on...well it has room for just so many......

(sp)

Edited March 9, 2013 by growalot

[shawnhu]

It amazes me how little value so many of you place on human life. Life begins at conception. If you don't want a kid abstain.

Cutting a child limb from limb and sucking them out a tube so you don't have a inconvenience is not something i am willing to negotiate on.

Try asking a abortion survivor (yes there are children who survive the procedure) how they feel about the subject.

They would probably say they wish they hadn't been born.

[ants]

Not a chance Ants, wont be sweatin nothin, I know my children are loved and well cared for and have received everything they ever needed and thats good enough, Im gonna have to leave all that worrying about every other baby born or not on this planet to someone else, just aint got that amount of love, maybe you do...

What about taking care of babys after they're born, you know welfare mama by products which are being produced by the millions in this country with mothers who know damn well the system with your tax dollars will take care of her kids when they need 500 thousand dollar medical treatments or care for asthma at the age of 3 which will cost us about another 100K by the time the kid reaches 12?

What about kids born into welfare with heart defects, should Obama care take care of them or lower the income requirements for people who cant afford health insurance so that kid can get the heart surgery and 100s of thousands of dollars in meds its gonna need for a lifetime. What about an illegal aliens kid who comes over here with leukemia and needs medical treatment at the age of say 6 months. whats the magic age when you stop caring and wanting to make sure every child in our country is cared for, or is it just till it pops its head out of the ole love canal then yer on yer own kid, go ahead and die now.

Naa dont bother answering im pretty sure i know your answer, but maybe try and answer this one, at what point does the life of a baby, or child become not so precious where you can say,hey lady, you and your kid are on your own and if you dont have the cash for your little girls operation she just gonna have to croak, sorry.

Your whole argument is that if the baby is too much of a burden or inconvenience abortion is O-kay, Do you hear your self? do you re-read what you post?? Because a kid might be born with heart defects?? or might develop leukemia later in life abort??

Sorry sits but when it comes to this topic you are a sick SOB. Lance that boil !!!!! You and the rest of the ladies have a nice "Bash Ants" session....Im done. Remember....Always Rationalize>>>>>>

[jjb4900]

kinda like the death penalty argument that it's not a deterrent on crime, maybe not, but it sure lessens the burden on the rest of society to support them.

[Carbonelement]

When do we get to start that thread.....ooooohhhhhhhh I CANT WAIT hahaha

[sits in trees]

Your whole argument is that if the baby is too much of a burden or inconvenience abortion is O-kay, Do you hear your self? do you re-read what you post?? Because a kid might be born with heart defects?? or might develop leukemia later in life abort??

Sorry sits but when it comes to this topic you are a sick SOB. Lance that boil !!!!! You and the rest of the ladies have a nice "Bash Ants" session....Im done. Remember....Always Rationalize>>>>>>

didnt think i would get any answers.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Culver...If a man doesn't want to risk a woman terminating a pregnancy that involves his sperm...then he should learn to keep his -ick firm tucked in his pants...That tired old saying of your goes both ways my dear...Like I said I really really feel sad ...thinking of some ppls daughters that are out there.....

Which tired old saying?

[Five Seasons]

I still love all the men who feel they can comment on this topic

[jjb4900]

I see no problem with men commenting on this topic if it would have stuck to the original post about whether or not the gov't should be able to enact laws regarding abortion.