rifles in livingston county

[growalot]

County board of supervisors passed it for deer hunting and bear.....now on the way to Albany

Edited June 13, 2013 by growalot

[phade]

I hope so, that'd be cool!

[Lawdwaz]

Unreal...........................!

[growalot]

The link.....

 

http://thelcn.com/2013/06/12/county-approves-rifle-hunting-resolution/

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Missed this thread when I posted. Can't wait to take the 06 out down there.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Missed this thread when I posted. Can't wait to take the 06 out down there.

[Doc]

Ok, that is step #1 and what has become the easiest step for those of us in Ontario County. Our experience has been that after it leaves the Board of Supervisors, weird things begin to happen. We may have it licked this time around. It currently has passed the Senate and is sitting in committee in the Assembly and has been there quite a while. Our process has left the Board three times and has covered a span of three years. I hope you guys in Livingston County have much better luck with your rifle bill than we have.

[growalot]

I'm going to be honest....I don't ...We hunt Allegheny county with rifles...but the population down there is not nearly as dense as here in Livingston...We are literally hunting on top of one another...The only saving grace in it are scopes...one has to at least take the time to acquire their target in a scope ...so less swinging and shooting.

 

But more standing on property lines and shooting into other ppls lands and I think more Night shooting...hope I'm wrong but many years.... tells me different.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Yeah i could see Letchworth park with 7mag's.  Some fool shootin from East to West. Or a private land hunter ripping some down into the park!  Bad move i believe but i doubt we would ever see them on the park but who knows on the outside!

[phade]

I bet Letchworth would stay shotgun only. Many state parks do have their own requierments (and Letchworth does now) seperate from state regs.

 

.243 here I come!!!! LOL.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I'm going to be honest....I don't ...We hunt Allegheny county with rifles...but the population down there is not nearly as dense as here in Livingston...We are literally hunting on top of one another...The only saving grace in it are scopes...one has to at least take the time to acquire their target in a scope ...so less swinging and shooting.

 

But more standing on property lines and shooting into other ppls lands and I think more Night shooting...hope I'm wrong but many years.... tells me different.

 

 

I would think that is someone is going to poach at night they arent going to use a shotgun anyway. There are more accurate and less noisey options available to them. There are currently areas of the state that allow rifles with higher population densities that Livingston and they haven't experienced increases in hunting accidents.

[WNYBuckHunter]

If it goes through, Ill be fine with it. If Ontario passes as well, my shotgun will collect some major dust.

[phade]

Yeah, I just bought a new slug gun last season. That'll kind of stink because it'll be parked permanently or I'll have to take a bath on it because it won't have value in rifle counties.

[growalot]

They take deer at night with shotguns a lot around here...the one taken the other year off us was a shot gun the sheriff heard the shot from his place...remember yote hunting is open and if caught ...with out a deer in hand  it's a good excuse and then there's the raccoon hunting...night shooting sounds are common...even rifles...farm country and until 11pm nuisance hunters can use what ever they want . most of the problems aren't so much during hunting...though that's the 20mins after dark thing then...but the 1-3 in the morning crap two weeks before season opens and during bow season.

 

That said I don't believe I ever mentioned the word accident in that post..but now that you did...you know where camp is..basically...first season gun was open there neighbors...   uncle shot nephew in the arm...Then I think over by Andover someone was killed...which can happen in shot gun as I surely know...like I said saving grace are scopes...lets just hope they practice well in advance...because in hill country...a missed shot on a sky lined deer can travel a hell of a ways

[Doc]

There are currently areas of the state that allow rifles with higher population densities that Livingston and they haven't experienced increases in hunting accidents.

Many of the recent "rifle" counties are still relatively new. I have to believe that many hunters in those areas may not yet have actually ditched their prize shotgun and went out to spend the big-bucks for a new deer rifle. So, we may not have actually seen  any meaningful numbers regarding how rifles have impacted hunting safety in these more population dense areas. In fact even at it's worse, hunting fatalities in NYS have been on the decline, so there won't be a whole lot of data points available for any meaningful comparative stats until quite a few years go by. I am not going to make any predictions. There are logical pros and cons regarding the wide-spread use of rifles in deer season, and it will take a long time before the point is made one way or the other.

 

Regarding deer poaching in these new rifle counties, I see no logical reason that anything new will be happening. My thought is that if someone is going to take an illegal deer illegally, they probably are not one to worry whether they are using a legal weapon or not. If poachers want to use rifles instead of shotguns, they probably are already doing so with or without a rifle bill being passed.

 

My take on the whole issue is to try it out and let's see what really happens rather than trying to guess. Many of these rifle laws have a sunset clause attached that will be addressed after the law has been in effect for a year. That is the case with the Ontario County version. I doubt that 1 year is an adequate test  that will yield any meaningful stats, but I am certain that at anytime it can be proven that rifles are a problem, there are plenty of people who will happily offer up legislation that will reverse the new law. Lets check it out and see what happens.

[Lawdwaz]

No scope on your shotgun grow?

If I can recall clearly, I've only ever killed three deer, maybe four with open sights. One here in NYS with the inline and a couple few in PA with a flintlock.

Never killed a single one with an open sighted shotgun but then again I never tried! I've been using scopes since my first year in 1977 for whitetail.

[growalot]

I do not particularly like scopes...though I have one on the 243...and the Blk powder...Which I haven't had out in a real long time..and when cross bows were legal I lost a nice doe due to a scope and not open sights...Had I a scope on my shot gun last season the buck in my Avatar would not be there...many times I will (especially close up) pic a spot I know they are headed to and aim there...waiting for them to step in....with my long shots...100-115 yrds I won't shoot until they are at a dead stop and I have plenty of time to line up the shoulder and bead....my 22rf isn't scoped and I have shot both squirrels and crow behind the eye  as far as 80yrds...ya just got to know your gun...

[Doc]

A scope is not required equipment but I definitely do not use any big-game gun (shotgun or rifle) without one as long as I have the option. I do not take running shots or anything else where quick aquisition of the target is essential.

 

I have a peep sight (deadly...lol) on my .22 and the rest of my guns are scoped. Love the precision of those crosshairs and the magnification.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Takes a little practice but the best way to utilize a scope is to look at your target and shoulder the gun and bring the scope into your line of sight. The target will be there. Shouldering the gun and looking for the target through the scope doesn't work as well becasue of the reduced field of view. I don't have a problem this way even on moving targets.

Edited June 14, 2013 by Culvercreek hunt club

[growalot]

That is the problem I have....and with the cross bow it was once I got her targeted in.... she moved and I couldn't judge the distance with out having to lower the bow and range again...Then find her in the scope....by that time I was flustered..LOL ...keep it simple...My bead is welded to the end of my barrel...no moving parts...nothing to adjust or go out of adjustment and when my heart is pumping and my breath increases...nothing to fog over..if it's snowing or raining no spots to view through...my bead is just as deadly as a scopes cross hairs ..if you know your gun.... 30years...I know my gun.

[Lawdwaz]

.my bead is just as deadly as a scopes cross hairs ..if you know your gun.... 30years...I know my gun.

Now you've gone too far! No way is a bead on the end of your barrel as accurate as a scope. Can't happen, even at 50 yards. Adequate, yes they are but certainly not as accurate as a scope.

At far as reliable, any decent scope these days isn't going to be an issue. Ever knock a bead off the end of a barrel or have one disappear for an unknown reason? I have.

In inclement weather I'll take a scope any day over irons or a bead.

Beads will surely get the job done but for someone that really enjoys an accurate well placed shot I don't think they are many people's first choice. They work for you and that's great & all that matters.

[growalot]

Laws all I can speak to is what I know. When it comes down to... for me.. and how my brain processes what I see....many variables in that mind you...yes I can say with confidence That my sighting a target in those ranges is as deadly as a scope...and no I have never lost a bead of the end of a gun...

Now do remember... I'm talking shot guns at  a bit over one hundred yrds...not rifles which are a WHOLE different animal..sorta speak...  with longer yardage and way different ballistics...seriously ...I have not so good short range sight and excellent long range...but dang I'm not that good!...lol

 

Let me put it this way...there are ppl that can pull up a slingshot and hit a moving target all day long but not handle a gun and those that can't hit a standing target with a sling shot  ..but can shoot an elk at 400 yrds with a rifle

I can to this day ...pick up a rock with my hand and kill a rabbit...but I'm not sure I could ever master a two to 400 yrd shot with a scoped rifle...even with my 243 ...we had to buy one with a Montecarlo(sp) stock because I tend to hold my head at an odd angle...Mr B even brought guys out to help...but in the end...the way I shoot /sight through a scope is so different that no one else can pick up my 243 and shoot it...After I sighted in the 243 to a hundred yrds...those guys can't for the life of them figure out how I was hitting the bulls eye...when they shoulder the gun and shot...

No different than my not being able to use sights on my bow...I can't process an obstructed(narrow) view.

Edited June 14, 2013 by growalot

[Doc]

Different things work for different people, and that's why there are multiple sighting designs available on the market. Frankly, I enjoy the idea of magnification. It supplies a confidence factor if nothing else. And when those crosshairs are centered in the view and laying over the kill area, there is no question about wher the bullet is going to go (if you have done the proper practicing on the range).

 

There is one thing that can be a bit of a problem. Too much magnification when shooting off-hand, can be a bit un-nerving in the exaggerated movement from the optics. That can be especially a problem when you have just gone through any kind of strenuous exercise like climbing a steep hill. The fact is that I don't shoot "off-hand" completely any more. I always get to a tree or some other kind of steady rest. And when I am in a ground stand, I always make sure there are plenty of gun-rests available in all directions. I really don't want to see those crosshairs dancing around the critter. Of course it can be argued that the scope allows you to see the movements that are taking place where it may not be all that apparent with open sights but still happening anyway.

[Lawdwaz]

Laws all I can speak to is what I know. When it comes down to... for me.. and how my brain processes what I see....many variables in that mind you...yes I can say with confidence That my sighting a target in those ranges is as deadly as a scope...and no I have never lost a bead of the end of a gun...

Now do remember... I'm talking shot guns at  a bit over one hundred yrds...not rifles which are a WHOLE different animal..sorta speak...  with longer yardage and way different ballistics...seriously ...I have not so good short range sight and excellent long range...but dang I'm not that good!...lol

 

Let me put it this way...there are ppl that can pull up a slingshot and hit a moving target all day long but not handle a gun and those that can't hit a standing target with a sling shot  ..but can shoot an elk at 400 yrds with a rifle

I can to this day ...pick up a rock with my hand and kill a rabbit...but I'm not sure I could ever master a two to 400 yrd shot with a scoped rifle...even with my 243 ...we had to buy one with a Montecarlo(sp) stock because I tend to hold my head at an odd angle...Mr B even brought guys out to help...but in the end...the way I shoot /sight through a scope is so different that no one else can pick up my 243 and shoot it...After I sighted in the 243 to a hundred yrds...those guys can't for the life of them figure out how I was hitting the bulls eye...when they shoulder the gun and shot...

No different than my not being able to use sights on my bow...I can't process an obstructed(narrow) view.

 

I gotcha.  "old dog/new tricks" thing!

 

You certainly have things working for you, thats not debatable..............

 

[growalot]

Well lets get back to the topic...in a way..You know me and my little questions...I pose this...

 

What good is the 500ft rule? REALLY ...When a person according to the wording of the law can now stand several hundred yrds from a deer...say...  across and open field...that could be standing 200 ft from your home ...tucked in the woods and shoot legally..When that law went in.... NYS was a shot gun only state...500ft was a reasonable safety net...I'm NOT SURE but also no scopes at the time...maybe wrong...someone should know...