How many think NY should do this.

[grampy]

I feel the youth season would still be a great opportunity for these young hunters to gain valuable experience. With the needed supervision.

[WNYBuckHunter]

I'm all for it...I like the apprentice idea..Learning as you grow up..but than wouldnt this effectively remove the need for a special "youth" season?

 

No. The youth days (only 3 days) are great for getting the kids out and giving them a chance at a deer at a time when they are relatively calm, and not running all over the place whacked out on hormones with the orange army chasing them down. The weather is also alot better on average, so its easier to keep them out there longer when they are just starting out.

 

I have yet to hear a good reason why the youth days are not a positive.

[JimMac]

limiting the age to 12 or 10 because of a few that win darwin awards i think is foolish

there are many 5 to 7 that are smart and shouldn't be so called punished for a select few.

 

Just like NY pistol laws , a youth can shoot a pistol ( insert age bracket ) at a range

or event , but since I'm over 21 i not allowed to touch one with out a permit .. so stupid ...

 

 

 

 

Edited September 14, 2015 by JimMac

[Doc]

I'm having a hard time coming up with a firm opinion on this. I have run into so many goofy people while hunting, some of which I would assume could be parents. The guy who was cradling his gun in the crook of his arm with the muzzle pointed right at my kneecaps until I told him to point it somewhere else. Then there was another guy who thought it was cool to rest the muzzle of his gun on the top of his boot while he yakked away forever as I was trying to hunt. And then there was the flaming red-eyed drunk that could hardly stand up. These guys could easily have had kids somewhere that they would have been mentoring. I mean some people shouldn't even have kids, let alone having them supervising kids with guns. We have no choice about them having kids, but there are some choices that can be exercised regarding when we can turn them loose telling and showing their kids all the wrong ways of safety. 

 

But then there was the guy that I ran into that had his kid (assumedly at a legal age for handling guns) out on state land with targets set up at the edge of a nice flat, un-backstopped brushy area. This was during bow season with leaves on, and him with no idea whether there was someone on stand back in there or not. This was a nice safety lesson that he was teaching his kid. So really, what is the proper age to be showing kids the wrong way to do things?

 

So like I said, settling on any proper age really winds up to be crap-shoot. I certainly can't say based on what I have seen out there. It really seems to wind up being more about the quality of the parents than anything about the kids. Ha-ha ..... maybe there should be a hunter safety re-training course required at which time the parent would at least have been re-exposed and re-certified as to the right way to be mentoring their children. 

[WNYBuckHunter]

 

So like I said, settling on any proper age really winds up to be crap-shoot. I certainly can't say based on what I have seen out there. It really seems to wind up being more about the quality of the parents than anything about the kids. Ha-ha ..... maybe there should be a hunter safety re-training course required at which time the parent would at least have been re-exposed and re-certified as to the right way to be mentoring their children. 

 

Thats a good idea, and would be fairly easy. Just make the parents attend the courses when their kids do. I sat through my daughters bow class a couple of weeks ago, and will be sitting through her gun course this coming weekend. There was only 1 parent there with their kid other than me, most just dropped them off.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Great idea, get them off the x-box, facebook, etc

 

The only thing that  seems odd to me is where it says  "must hold or have held a valid adult license"

 

IMO- the adult mentor should be a current license holder,..., if they are not a current licensee they may not be up on all curent laws/regs.

We have seen the opposite even on this forum. Holding a license doesn't mean you know the laws. I don't have an issue with a previous license holder being a mentor.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

You said...

 

"There are a lot of dumb people out in the woods and some of them shouldn't have kids let alone kids that hunt ."

 

That is what my response was about.

 

In any case, generalizing if a kid is ready to hunt at a certain age is a very broad brush approach. Ill tell you right now that my daughter has been ready for at least the last 2 years. Other kids her age may or may not be, but she is, and NY cant make that call. I can though, because I know her and I know her capabilities.

 

As a parent of 2 kids that are becoming active in school, sports, etc, I know all about what kind of distractions are out there for kids entering the NY mandated hunting age range. Its not going to be an easy feat keeping them in the woods. I cant imagine how hard it would be to get a kid that hasnt been introduced to it at a very young age, started at the age of 12.

 

You wonder why the average age of hunters keeps going up in NY? Well, making people wait till their kids are already eyeballs deep in school and sports is one of the reasons.

I have to say though, that it is the PARENTS that allow the over involvement in things like sports. I can't begin to tell you how many parents I see with kids in multiple sports that are winter, summer, fall, travel this and competition that. they honestly believe little Suzie or Timmy has the talent and "really has a shot" In almost every case the ones that I know are delusional and are trying to relive their youth in their kids.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I'm having a hard time coming up with a firm opinion on this. I have run into so many goofy people while hunting, some of which I would assume could be parents. The guy who was cradling his gun in the crook of his arm with the muzzle pointed right at my kneecaps until I told him to point it somewhere else. Then there was another guy who thought it was cool to rest the muzzle of his gun on the top of his boot while he yakked away forever as I was trying to hunt. And then there was the flaming red-eyed drunk that could hardly stand up. These guys could easily have had kids somewhere that they would have been mentoring. I mean some people shouldn't even have kids, let alone having them supervising kids with guns. We have no choice about them having kids, but there are some choices that can be exercised regarding when we can turn them loose telling and showing their kids all the wrong ways of safety. 

 

But then there was the guy that I ran into that had his kid (assumedly at a legal age for handling guns) out on state land with targets set up at the edge of a nice flat, un-backstopped brushy area. This was during bow season with leaves on, and him with no idea whether there was someone on stand back in there or not. This was a nice safety lesson that he was teaching his kid. So really, what is the proper age to be showing kids the wrong way to do things?

 

So like I said, settling on any proper age really winds up to be crap-shoot. I certainly can't say based on what I have seen out there. It really seems to wind up being more about the quality of the parents than anything about the kids. Ha-ha ..... maybe there should be a hunter safety re-training course required at which time the parent would at least have been re-exposed and re-certified as to the right way to be mentoring their children. 

Those same idiots are going to 'teach" poor safety no mater the age. I am so tired of everything being set up for the lowest common denominator.

[grampy]

I feel it's all about the parents or mentors in just about anything. Take driving a car for instance. What is a young person going to learn from a poor or reckless driver? So many things, good and bad, are learned from what a young person observes. We can't lump all the responsible parents and mentors, with the few wingnuts out there who know little more than the one's they are mentoring.

[Grizz1219]

Would be great if every state did it.... 

[Doc]

Those same idiots are going to 'teach" poor safety no mater the age. I am so tired of everything being set up for the lowest common denominator.

On the other hand it is something that has to be talked about when you are discussing children and hunting and those who are self-professed mentors. It can't be ignored. Perhaps its time to do something about those teachers (mentors, parents or otherwise) who aren't fit to fill that role and maybe require some remedial training themselves before they lay some of that ignorance on their kids. I think there might be some solutions that address that problem.

 

I don't know, I just am saying that I have observed more than a few situations that indicate that parents or other licensed individuals are not always all that competent in schooling kids in the right attitudes involving safety, ethics, and other things that have to be impressed on child- hunters. Perhaps when we are so focused on age, maybe we are missing the real point.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

On the other hand it is something that has to be talked about when you are discussing children and hunting and those who are self-professed mentors. It can't be ignored. Perhaps its time to do something about those teachers (mentors, parents or otherwise) who aren't fit to fill that role and maybe require some remedial training themselves before they lay some of that ignorance on their kids. I think there might be some solutions that address that problem.

 

I don't know, I just am saying that I have observed more than a few situations that indicate that parents or other licensed individuals are not always all that competent in schooling kids in the right attitudes involving safety, ethics, and other things that have to be impressed on child- hunters. Perhaps when we are so focused on age, maybe we are missing the real point.

I wouldn't mind a true firearms proficiency instruction and test for the younger kids. Heck might not be a bad idea for the older ones or adults...lol. I hate the thought of little Johnny's fist outing with a gun to be on game.

[Doc]

I think if I were to take on the responsibility of mentoring some young kid, I would probably need to get some remedial education myself just to get updated. I personally wouldn't mind sitting in on a class as a mandatory requirement for accompanying one of these super young people. I think that if the mentor is updated on all the latest mandated training, the hunter-age concerns go by the wayside. Seriously, I worry more about the outdated and forgotten safety knowledge of the mentors than the kids on this issue. Some of the crazy things that I have seen from hunters makes me wonder if they should be in charge of any kid at any age.

[dbHunterNY]

a kid will do what they will do.  no minimum age but between having them take the hunter safety course, parent thinking they're good to go, and then maybe have them do a gun handling field day if under a certain age then I think that would solidify their competence to be hunting with a firearm.  we all took a road test to get our drivers license.  I really don't think we should hold back a kid ever, especially at an age with fewer distractions.

 

I think think of a few instances where a grown adult did something stupid to jeopardize my safety and a kid under our current hunting age restriction pointed it out.  one was a young adult 18+ yrs old.  sitting in the back of the UTV for a ride up the hill on the farm.  his gun turned out to be loaded and he was using the scope to look at deer while we were stopped.  I was in the driver seat looking through binos.  he had the muzzle several inches from my face just behind me.  my little cousin, maybe 9, pointed it out.  I turned around and started asking questions in a calm but very serious tone.  I was told "it's ok, I have the safety on."

 

[dbHunterNY]

I wouldn't mind a true firearms proficiency instruction and test for the younger kids. Heck might not be a bad idea for the older ones or adults...lol. I hate the thought of little Johnny's fist outing with a gun to be on game.

 

agreed.... little johnny better be pounding paper plates and tin cans long before testing skills on game.  otherwise, how could anyone determine he's skill proficient and fit for the woods.