Wildlife vs. Welfare Ranchers

[ants]

You are simply amazing!

 

Better put down that crack pipe!

No .. I get what you're saying. Im asking you ..if the ranchers were black do you think the situation would be handled differently?

[wildcat junkie]

Your leanings and those of the mentioned groups seem to align. That was all. 

 

Having grown up in the Pittsburgh and (suburban) Chicago area, I "learned" about the labor movemen.

 

[Uptown Redneck]

I was a member of several unions and my wife is a teacher.

What's your point?

Wildcat, by answering, these rightwing know nothing morons will paint you as being nothing but a liberal, which, considering the stupidity these conservative fools post on a daily basis isn't a bad thing to be known as.

[greg54]

I was a member of several unions and my wife is a teacher.

What's your point?

Wildcat, by answering, these rightwing know nothing morons will paint you as being nothing but a liberal, which, considering the stupidity these conservative fools post on a daily basis isn't a bad thing to be known as.

Liberals believe the display of the Confederate flag is racist as seen in your avatar pic.

[wildcat junkie]

No .. I get what you're saying. Im asking you ..if the ranchers were black do you think the situation would be handled differently?

 

Since it's a Federal matter, no. Ruby Ridge has given the feds some reason to proceed with caution, rightfully so. As far as the botched siege at WACO I think they know that when dealing with someone that is delusional it is not a good ideal to fulfill any martyr syndrome if present..

 

 

If it had been under the jurisdiction of some local governments with criminals & thugs in a  "militarized" police department, yes, the outcome would have been swift & bloody.

 

[philoshop]

They were sentenced, and served the court mandated sentences, and were subsequently sentenced again for the same crime(s). A first year law student could have had that decision thrown out.

The Hammonds accepted it. Hmmm.

 

The town/county/state should have handled the issue from the start.

[wildcat junkie]

They were sentenced, and served the court mandated sentences, and were subsequently sentenced again for the same crime(s). A first year law student could have had that decision thrown out.

The Hammonds accepted it. Hmmm.

 

The town/county/state should have handled the issue from the start.

 

This is NOT double jeopardy, it is an appeal of the sentence, probably filed shortly after the sentence was handed down.

 

The feds were well within their rights.

 

Again;

 

Here is the legal precedent on the matter.

 

Absent a waiver, both the government and the defense have the right to appeal a sentence. Federal prosecutors generally must seek approval from "main Justice" — the Department of Justice in Washington D.C. — before appealing a ruling. That's so the feds don't make what they see as "bad law" by appealing "bad cases," and so the feds' legal stance remains relatively consistent across circuits.

 

The Hammonds COULD have been sentenced 5 years for each offense served consecutively. Hmmmm maybe they knew they didn't have a leg to stand on & didn't want to risk a longer sentence.

 

They were also threatened with a "less desirable" place of incarceration. The "state" has the option of choosing the place of incarceration I believe.

These guys are criminals. Their own blood incriminated them and they endangered hunters & guides that were on the land.

[ants]

This is NOT double jeopardy, it is an appeal of the sentence, probably filed shortly after the sentence was handed down.

 

The feds were well within their rights.

 

Again;

 

Here is the legal precedent on the matter.

 

Absent a waiver, both the government and the defense have the right to appeal a sentence. Federal prosecutors generally must seek approval from "main Justice" — the Department of Justice in Washington D.C. — before appealing a ruling. That's so the feds don't make what they see as "bad law" by appealing "bad cases," and so the feds' legal stance remains relatively consistent across circuits.

 

The Hammonds COULD have been sentenced 5 years for each offense served consecutively. Hmmmm maybe they knew they didn't have a leg to stand on & didn't want to risk a longer sentence.

 

They were also threatened with a "less desirable" place of incarceration. The "state" has the option of choosing the place of incarceration I believe.

These guys are criminals. Their own blood incriminated them and they endangered hunters & guides that were on the land.

And, once again, just to set the record straight, you would feel the same way, in regards to this situation,  if the ranchers were black….Right??

[wildcat junkie]

And, once again, just to set the record straight, you would feel the same way, in regards to this situation,  if the ranchers were black….Right??

 

Yes, why wouldn't I?

 

But white or black they should go to prison & they will.

[wildcat junkie]

And, once again, just to set the record straight, you would feel the same way, in regards to this situation,  if the ranchers were black….Right??

 

How would you feel about all this if it was YOU that had a guided hunt spoiled by slobs herd shooting & wounding deer without following up then setting the brush on fire endangering you campsite & personal well being?

 

Edited January 13, 2016 by wildcat junkie

[Curmudgeon]

You supporters of the occupiers, do you believe in the rule of law? Do you believe the SCOTUS decides what is the law? Do you believe in the democratic process? Or, do you believe that this is a reasonable approach?

 

If I lived near Burns, I would go out there birding right now with those 400 birders, so-called militiamen be damned.

Edited January 13, 2016 by Curmudgeon

[ants]

How would you feel about all this if it was YOU that had a guided hunt spoiled by slobs herd shooting & wounding deer without following up then setting the brush on fire endangering you campsite & personal well being?

 

If thats what happened ..I would be pissed,  and would want them punished, whether they were black or white.. And I would expect them to serve their sentence. 

[wildcat junkie]

If thats what happened ..I would be pissed,  and would want them punished, whether they were black or white.. And I would expect them to serve their sentence. 

 

A transcript of the testimony at their trial was included on the grazing rights refusal by the BLM. Download the PDF & take the time to read it. The testimony transcript starts on page 5 & continues to page 14.

 

 https://www.google.c...5,d.dmo&cad=rja

 

Take the time to read through the testimony that spells out the conduct of the Hammonds that endangered the lives of hunters & guides in the area they set ablaze.( A; pages 5-7) On yet another occasion they endangered the lives of fire fighters.(B; pages 7-14)

 

Of particular interest are the threats made on August 24 2006 (page 14) to BLM officials where Steve Hammond threatened to blame BLM for setting the fires if BLM "didn't make the investigation go away".

[ants]

A transcript of the testimony at their trial was included on the grazing rights refusal by the BLM. Download the PDF & take the time to read it. The testimony transcript starts on page 5 & continues to page 14.

 

 https://www.google.c...5,d.dmo&cad=rja

 

Take the time to read through the testimony that spells out the conduct of the Hammonds that endangered the lives of hunters & guides in the area they set ablaze.( A; pages 5-7) On yet another occasion they endangered the lives of fire fighters.(B; pages 7-14)

 

Of particular interest are the threats made on August 24 2006 (page 14) to BLM officials where Steve Hammond threatened to blame BLM for setting the fires if BLM "didn't make the investigation go away".

If they were convicted then they should serve the time that the judge orderer. 

[wildcat junkie]

If they were convicted then they should serve the time that the judge orderer. 

 

If you are referring to the 1st sentence, it did not meet the 5 year minimum sentencing requirements & therefore the judge could not reduce the term to less than that according to law. That is why the feds won on appeal and the Hammonds were sent back to serve the rest of the 5 year terms. .

 

Edited January 14, 2016 by wildcat junkie

[ants]

 

 

If it had been under the jurisdiction of some local governments with criminals & thugs in a  "militarized" police department, yes, the outcome would have been swift & bloody.

 

Like where???

[ants]

If you are referring to the 1st sentence, it did not meet the 5 year minimum sentencing requirements & therefore the judge could not reduce the term to less than that according to law. That is why the feds won on appeal and the Hammonds were sent back to serve the rest of the 5 year terms. .

 

If you or yours did their time, were released, and were then told that they had to go back to serve more time on the same offense, you would be OK with that?

 

NO…. you would be screaming about a "conserva-turd" conspiracy and GW Bush and a corrupt system, you would be talking about jack booted thugs, corrupt cops... and blah,,blah….freaking blah.

[philoshop]

http://www.c-span.org/video/?c4571012/rep-greg-walden-armed-standoff-oregon

 

Some interesting insight into how the Federal bureaucracy handles situations that don't go their way, from a legislator who's been in the middle of it. Greg Walden is the US Representative for that area of Oregon.