Trophy on CNN @ 9 tonight. What did you think of it

[Hunter007]

So what did you think of the documentary .

It was not as biased as I thought it was going to be but still it  had that touchy feely slant to it . And they did not show how nuts many of these anti hunting groups  really  are in my opinion.

[Dinsdale]

I think of hunting in Africa like many here think of Whitetails.....I love everything about it, the travel, sights, smells, food, wildlife, and all the awesome folks I have met along the way......but it pains me to think others will take away the low points. Love to show folks the places I have been and seen and honest hard work it takes to hunt it proper; and how that keeps it going.

 

 

 

 

 

[Hunter007]

6 hours ago, Dinsdale said:

I think of hunting in Africa like many here think of Whitetails.....I love everything about it, the travel, sights, smells, food, wildlife, and all the awesome folks I have met along the way......but it pains me to think others will take away the low points. Love to show folks the places I have been and seen and honest hard work it takes to hunt it proper; and how that keeps it going.

 

 

 

 

 

O well if you think  cnn  would say how people hunt in Africa was this great challenge that was not going to happen . It is  cnn

The point they did make, is with out those farmers breeding them as a resource. 

Those animals would go extinct. 

 

Edited January 15, 2018 by Storm914

[Five Seasons]

So I stayed up and watched it, started late so i could fast forward through commercials.

I felt it was fair and balanced. Not a huge fan of the kid drilling a buck out of a blind over a feeder as the opening scene, but I know that's Texas.

The best point in the whole film is made by the one researcher who seems to take a middle ground in his thoughts. That without hunting and an economic driver a lot of these animals would be gone or their habitat wiped out for domestic animals (makes a good point about the difference between a rhino and a goat too). But also that hunters cling to a high ground that our conservation efforts are the only way to save animals and we do ignore the corruption in these territories. Basically that hunting is doing a lot of good things for these regions, but it's not the silver bullet.

Scary part for me is the poaching numbers. And of course they did shine a light but didn't spend a ton of time on canned hunts. It's tough to see that, probably the only thing that bothered me, but it is reality. They quickly scanned to the guy walking through waist high water showing the opposite side of things.

Couple other thoughts. That elephant dying scene is one many of us have had with deer, but it was tough to watch. I'm glad they showed the meat going to use.

I also lost all faith in that guy when he goes on the bible rant and puts out his anti-evolution rant. like shit, can't we get one guy without some crazy ass biblical thoughts speaking for us? 

Edited January 15, 2018 by Belo

[Five Seasons]

10 hours ago, Dinsdale said:

I think of hunting in Africa like many here think of Whitetails.....I love everything about it, the travel, sights, smells, food, wildlife, and all the awesome folks I have met along the way......but it pains me to think others will take away the low points. Love to show folks the places I have been and seen and honest hard work it takes to hunt it proper; and how that keeps it going.

 

 

 

I'd argue everything in life has its low points. even whitetail hunting. 

[Hunter007]

34 minutes ago, Belo said:

So I stayed up and watched it, started late so i could fast forward through commercials.

I felt it was fair and balanced. Not a huge fan of the kid drilling a buck out of a blind over a feeder as the opening scene, but I know that's Texas.

The best point in the whole film is made by the one researcher who seems to take a middle ground in his thoughts. That without hunting and an economic driver a lot of these animals would be gone or their habitat wiped out for domestic animals (makes a good point about the difference between a rhino and a goat too). But also that hunters cling to a high ground that our conservation efforts are the only way to save animals and we do ignore the corruption in these territories. Basically that hunting is doing a lot of good things for these regions, but it's not the silver bullet.

Scary part for me is the poaching numbers. And of course they did shine a light but didn't spend a ton of time on canned hunts. It's tough to see that, probably the only thing that bothered me, but it is reality. They quickly scanned to the guy walking through waist high water showing the opposite side of things.

Couple other thoughts. That elephant dying scene is one many of us have had with deer, but it was tough to watch. I'm glad they showed the meat going to use.

I also lost all faith in that guy when he goes on the bible rant and puts out his anti-evolution rant. like shit, can't we get one guy without some crazy ass biblical thoughts speaking for us? 

Yea 3 things I did not care for 1 was the first scene showing  the guy hunting over a feeder in blind that looked like it even had A.C. and refrigerator in it the elephant dying  scene 

And that he has to bring up religion .

Edited January 15, 2018 by Storm914

[Five Seasons]

but, all of those things are a reality. I do recommend watching it. Certainly hunters have been portrayed a lot worse. I think when they showed the crazy cecil the lion stuff they could have done a little more counterpoint there too, but instead focused on the guy losing his goats... and not sure most viewers will get the slant they were taking.

Honestly the guy crying with his harvest, the ranch manager crying about getting attached. Those are all very real. It's hard to say myself as a hunter that I like killing. I think most of us other than Stubby don't. A lot of anti's miss that part about hunters and assume we're all just blood lusting murderers. We probably care more for the animals than anyone, but we also understand it's the circle of life and it provides food for our families and actually allows better herd health. 

[left field]

Here's a little background info on how the filmmakers found the hunter.

http://beta.latimes.com/entertainment/movies/la-et-mn-trophy-hunting-documentary-20170916-story.html 

[Five Seasons]

2 hours ago, left field said:

Here's a little background info on how the filmmakers found the hunter.

http://beta.latimes.com/entertainment/movies/la-et-mn-trophy-hunting-documentary-20170916-story.html 

good read thanks for sharing. It's interesting that the filmmakers thinks he's a psychopath and yet still does a decent job of letting him tell his side in the film. More docs need to be done this way. Let the audience decie with all the facts and both sides. 

[left field]

Yes, they did a fair job with that. It would have been easy to make him out to be an idiot.

That elephant scene was tough to watch. My limited understanding is that they don't die easily and I guess that confirmed it.

The courtroom scene great. 

I would have liked an interview with the asshole shooting the crocodile, but that could have come early in the process when they were still playing observers. 

Will watch again this week. 

[fasteddie]

16 hours ago, left field said:

 

I would have liked an interview with the asshole shooting the crocodile, but that could have come early in the process when they were still playing observers. 

 

I thought that shooter was a jerk . When he thought he was going to take another shot , he had the woman hold his beer . Some language was deleted when when he shot the Croc in the head . 

Didn't like the way they carried the rifles over their shoulders and hanging onto the barrels . 

I have it on "on demand" TV and have watched about 45 minutes . Probably won't watch the rest . 

[left field]

I think it's worth another 45-minute investment. 

[Five Seasons]

19 hours ago, left field said:

Yes, they did a fair job with that. It would have been easy to make him out to be an idiot.

That elephant scene was tough to watch. My limited understanding is that they don't die easily and I guess that confirmed it.

The courtroom scene great. 

I would have liked an interview with the asshole shooting the crocodile, but that could have come early in the process when they were still playing observers. 

Will watch again this week. 

 

2 hours ago, fasteddie said:

I thought that shooter was a jerk . When he thought he was going to take another shot , he had the woman hold his beer . Some language was deleted when when he shot the Croc in the head . 

Didn't like the way they carried the rifles over their shoulders and hanging onto the barrels . 

I have it on "on demand" TV and have watched about 45 minutes . Probably won't watch the rest . 

as much as we didn't like that guy, a true doc does show all sides. And fact of the matter is, that hunter exists and in Africa it is an absolute reality that a guy with enough money can be a "shooter" and not a hunter. I thought they did a good job touching on "shooters". But some of their editing didn't line up well with the points they were trying to make. 

[Hunter007]

2 hours ago, fasteddie said:

I thought that shooter was a jerk . When he thought he was going to take another shot , he had the woman hold his beer . Some language was deleted when when he shot the Croc in the head . 

Didn't like the way they carried the rifles over their shoulders and hanging onto the barrels . 

I have it on "on demand" TV and have watched about 45 minutes . Probably won't watch the rest . 

Yea you kinda of got the impression that most these guys that do those African hunts are more into just collecting trophies then  looking for a challenging  hunt . I don't know if that is a fair representation of the guys who do that seems like they where trying to  stereotype  those guys and went out of there way to  find just that type of guy to put in the  film .

 

 

 

 

 

[left field]

You can alter timelines with editing and certainly show things out of context. What you can't do is make someone pick up a rifle and shoot a bound croc in a swimming pool. 

Is he indicative of the average African hunter? Maybe. Are the slavering antis briefly seen typical? Maybe.

I believe canned hunt guy was part of the group who the filmmakers met at the Vegas show who obviously agreed to be filmed. As there haven't been any lawsuits I guess they're okay with how they were portrayed. 

On another note, I know nothing about elephant hunting, but if this guy isn't taking the meat or the head why wouldn't he or the PH shoot it in the head until dead?  

Edited January 16, 2018 by left field

[Dinsdale]

 

20 minutes ago, left field said:

You can alter timelines with editing and certainly show things out of context. What you can't do is make someone pick up a rifle and shoot a bound croc in a swimming pool. 

Is he indicative of the average African hunter? Maybe. Are the slavering antis briefly seen typical? Maybe.

I believe canned hunt guy was part of the group who the filmmakers met at the Vegas show who obviously agreed to be filmed. As there haven't been any lawsuits I guess they're okay with how they were portrayed. 

On another note, I know nothing about elephant hunting, but if this guy isn't taking the meat or the head why wouldn't he or the PH shoot it in the head until dead?  

 

Philip is taking some heat on a few forums, where emphasis is on African hunting, over the Elephant hunt and no finishing shots.

Personally I put a head shot in mine that was clearly dead and 2 in the Buffalo in my avatar that was clearly dead. I don't think the situation was handled that great, but hunting can be messy in the moment and easy to see mistakes in hind sight.

You have to get me to STOP shooting, I make it clear on hunts I will take as many as I can as long as we can identify proper target animal. Americans often have a reputation of admiring the one shot and not working an action to reload and staying on target. That becomes easier with experience; I'm breaking bones and not worrying about meat as a non recovered animal will yield nothing.

Anyway the croc dude is a douche and there are a pile of shitty operators who do this kind of thing unfortunately.

 

For those who would like to read more response from Philip Glass about the movie you can follow 2 threads on AfricanHunting.com as he has been a member for some time; This start way back before CNN even bought the film from the producers/directors....but end up in current time after the CNN airing;

https://www.africahunting.com/threads/trophy-the-film.34748/

One started by the one of the Directors;

https://www.africahunting.com/threads/trophy-the-film-let-your-voice-be-heard.37142/

 

 

[left field]

Thanks, will read.

[left field]

On 1/15/2018 at 4:17 PM, Belo said:

good read thanks for sharing. It's interesting that the filmmakers thinks he's a psychopath and yet still does a decent job of letting him tell his side in the film. More docs need to be done this way. Let the audience decie with all the facts and both sides. 

So I looked into this "psychopath" comment a little more. Though the Schwartz was initially put off by Glass  what he said was, "let's say he's a psychpath ... can it benefit wildlife?"

Here's the interview with the filmmakers and Moore, the game warden.

 

[Five Seasons]

"give me one animal that's gone extinct while farmers were breeding and making money off it."

 

forgot how much i love that line.

[Steve D]

I watched it and as far as I am concerned it wasn't about hunters at all. It was about shooters with money in their pocket to burn. Typical CNN presentation:

 

[Five Seasons]

 

53 minutes ago, Steve D said:

I watched it and as far as I am concerned it wasn't about hunters at all. It was about shooters with money in their pocket to burn. Typical CNN presentation:

 

generally curious why you say that. 

[Steve D]

Just my opinion but I would guess less than 1% of people that hunt ...do hunt or would want to hunt in that manner.

If I was a multimillionaire I would not put down the money to go to Africa or anywhere else to pay someone to show me where the game was, lead me to the game, put up my blind, tell me when to take the shot, and to take my picture after the kill.

The only thing the guy did himself that shot the lion was load his rifle.

The other major portion of the show was the guy that invested $54 million to try to save the rhinos and was looking to legalize the selling of rhino horns in an effort to reduce poaching by making it legal to sell the horns.

He was able to accomplish his goal by addressing the government to change the law so he could continue to finance his operation, continue to grow the herd and increase the population of an almost extinct animal with the $16 million worth of Rhino horns he had under lock & key in storage.

Has nothing to do with hunting nor did the  other stories...only about shooting.

They could have had another title other than "Trophy"

[Marion]

Just my opinion but I would guess less than 1% of people that hunt ...do hunt or would want to hunt in that manner.
If I was a multimillionaire I would not put down the money to go to Africa or anywhere else to pay someone to show me where the game was, lead me to the game, put up my blind, tell me when to take the shot, and to take my picture after the kill.
The only thing the guy did himself that shot the lion was load his rifle.
The other major portion of the show was the guy that invested $54 million to try to save the rhinos and was looking to legalize the selling of rhino horns in an effort to reduce poaching by making it legal to sell the horns.
He was able to accomplish his goal by addressing the government to change the law so he could continue to finance his operation, continue to grow the herd and increase the population of an almost extinct animal with the $16 million worth of Rhino horns he had under lock & key in storage.
Has nothing to do with hunting nor did the  other stories...only about shooting.
They could have had another title other than "Trophy"

I thought he said $60 million. I couldn't understand his accent so you may have been right

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[Elmo]

Let's do the math.  The horn he cut, he said was worth around $250,000 in the black market.  Assuming the legal open market (keep in mind that he is not allowed to sell internationally) values it much less but since we don't know what the legal value would be we would have to go by the black market value.  He has 1900 rhinos.  Assuming not all are full sized adults.  Let's give it a 1/3 so about 630 adults.  630 times $250,000 means he produces $157.5 million in black market horns every 2 years.  He probably had several years worth in that storage area.

[Marion]

Let's do the math.  The horn he cut, he said was worth around $250,000 in the black market.  Assuming the legal open market (keep in mind that he is not allowed to sell internationally) values it much less but since we don't know what the legal value would be we would have to go by the black market value.  He has 1900 rhinos.  Assuming not all are full sized adults.  Let's give it a 1/3 so about 630 adults.  630 times $250,000 means he produces $157.5 million in black market horns every 2 years.  He probably had several years worth in that storage area.

Sounds like one hell of a business venture

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