Fresh Cut Logging Road Food Plot?

[Don_C]

Many of you guys chimed in on my “neighbor encounter” thread, but it’s time to move on from that nonsense. 

One of my boys called me from the property this morning and said there is a giant flatbed with a dozer and excavator pulling through the gate. Woo hoo!

After our initial walk around the property in March, I asked the owners if there was any way of cleaning up the logging roads as they were severely rutted to the point of making it impossible to get into some areas with an atv and a lot of tree tops were blocking some roads completely. He said they would hire someone to take care of it. Unfortunately It has been way too wet all summer to get in there with any kind of equipment, they reached out to me last month and said they were still going to try to get it done before fall and had hired a contractor. At this point I just figured they weren't going to do it.

The operator told my son they were going to be there for 3 days cleaning up. We wish it would have been earlier in the year, but are really happy it is being done. This first year is going to be a complete crap shoot anyway so I’m not concerned about deer movement at all. The hand clearing we did to get atvs from the parking area to the top of the property is just over a mile. It would be great if they clear a road from one end to the other.

My question is this. Is it possible to get something planted in the freshly cleared woods roads and have it be beneficial to hunting this season or is it just too late? I know nothing about planting anything at all!

 

[moog5050]

Cereal grain of some sort ASAP 

[Glen]

Winter Cereal Rye probably your best bet now.

[LET EM GROW]

Small Grain like Cereal Rye or Winter Wheat. Throw in your favorite clover blend too.. you'll benefit everything when March April comes around in Spring! You can try Winter peas too. Its a tad late but you should get some growth.. providing there is sunlight present. 

Cereal Rye will germinate down into the high 30s temperature wise and will grow down to around the freezing mark.. Plenty of time still sir. 

[G-Man]

Winter rye or wheat with 10 10 10 spread at planting asap.. 

[catskillkid]

Ditto on winter rye. Spread the seed then maybe pull something behind your atv to cover the seed. That stuff will grow on a concrete sidewalk

[Don_C]

Thank you for the feedback! I'm heading down in the morning to check out the damage. 

[Putnamcounty Bowhunter]

You definitely still have time.  Cornell did a study  looking at yields of of winter planted cereal grains in New York that involved plantings as late as November 1st And farmers regularly plant well into October to accommodate the harvest of whatever crop the grains are following.   Rye will germinate in soil temps all the way down to 33f and will grow well with soil temps above 40f .  

I agree 100% with the recommendations of use cereal rye.   The deer are crushing it on my plots at the moment.    If you want to try something a little outside the box, you could plant a perennial high sugar ryegrass like sucraseed sweet spot.  It’s a little on the expensive side, but it is a perennial so you’re not stuck planting it every year.  This is NOT your average throw and grow ryegrass, it was developed in New Zealand specifically for palatability and high sugar content.  Stays green thru the winter and the deer on my place cannot stay off it.  

Depending on how large of an area you’re planning on planting, you may want to consider using some kind of hay or straw as thatch to protect the seed.    It’s not necessary but it helps with germination this time of year when the nights are getting colder.   As the hay/straw decomposes it will provide a little extra heat and nutrients to the newly germinated cereal grain.  

Attached are a couple pics of a little trail I cut to connect two larger food plots planted in sweet spot.   It’s a highly shaded area that maybe gets 4 hours of light a day and it’s done wonderfully.   These photos show it about 2.5 weeks after planting. 

[G-Man]

On 9/13/2019 at 11:16 AM, Don_C said:

Thank you for the feedback! I'm heading down in the morning to check out the damage. 

How did you make out?

[Don_C]

Thanks for the input! We are going to try to get some seed down this weekend in a few spots and see how it goes. I'll have to see what I can get, but the sucraseed sweet spot sounds like the way to go. The guy did a really great job cleaning up the logging roads, it rained a LOT last Friday night, these pics are from Saturday morning. I'm hoping things firm up substantially this week with the warm dry weather, even walking on this was challenging in spots. Rain in the forecast for Monday so if we are actually able to get something on the ground Sunday it may a good experiment.

 

 

Edited September 17, 2019 by Don_C

[Don_C]

It seems the deer have instantly adapted to the new network on the property as well. Tracks are absolutely everywhere on the fresh roads, I have video of the dozer coming through on it's first pass on the trail to the left at the "Y" and an 8 and a 10 (together) walking down it hours later without a care. Even if we aren't able to get anything planted, this has made access and deer recovery so much easier for us. We couldn't be happier. 

[DDT]

5 hours ago, Putnamcounty Bowhunter said:

You definitely still have time.  Cornell did a study  looking at yields of of winter planted cereal grains in New York that involved plantings as late as November 1st And farmers regularly plant well into October to accommodate the harvest of whatever crop the grains are following.   Rye will germinate in soil temps all the way down to 33f and will grow well with soil temps above 40f .  

I agree 100% with the recommendations of use cereal rye.   The deer are crushing it on my plots at the moment.    If you want to try something a little outside the box, you could plant a perennial high sugar ryegrass like sucraseed sweet spot.  It’s a little on the expensive side, but it is a perennial so you’re not stuck planting it every year.  This is NOT your average throw and grow ryegrass, it was developed in New Zealand specifically for palatability and high sugar content.  Stays green thru the winter and the deer on my place cannot stay off it.  

Depending on how large of an area you’re planning on planting, you may want to consider using some kind of hay or straw as thatch to protect the seed.    It’s not necessary but it helps with germination this time of year when the nights are getting colder.   As the hay/straw decomposes it will provide a little extra heat and nutrients to the newly germinated cereal grain.  

Attached are a couple pics of a little trail I cut to connect two larger food plots planted in sweet spot.   It’s a highly shaded area that maybe gets 4 hours of light a day and it’s done wonderfully.   These photos show it about 2.5 weeks after planting. 

Wow, growing with ferns says something about it. Where do you get the sweet spot?

[Putnamcounty Bowhunter]

I ordered it from outsidepride.com but I’m pretty sure that a few of the larger online seed distributors sell it as well.   

Its available in a northern and southern blend (you’d wanna use the northern blend up here).   It’s about 50-60% “aber” variety hsg, 20-30% improved clover varieties, and a splash of chicory and ptt.  

The sweet spot blends were developed specifically for food plots/deer farming, but they also sell some seed blends for cattle that are popular choices too and come in larger bags.   If you check out the sucraseed website, it lists all the diff seed blends.  A lot of guys use the “cash cow” mix to seed larger plots.   

Haha nice catch on the ferns- they’re out of control on my lease cus the ph is so low, but I picked Up a few tricks that have allowed me to grow really lush food plots with no tillage and without tons and tons of ag lime.  

1. Apply super fast acting calcium based pellet lime.   A 30lb bag covers 5,000 sq feet and begins working almost instantly.   it doesn’t last as long as dolomitic lime and doesn’t have as much magnesium but it will get your ph to a workable level faster and with less product than any other available option.  I did supplement this with 50lbs of regular pellet lime per 5k sq feet for the magnesium and additional ph benefits and I do continue to add lime whenever possible hoping to eventually get enough down to provide some long term stability.  

2. Apply 50-150lbs of granular humic acid per acre.  The Andersons sells a product that is 74% pure humic acid derived from Leonardite- this is by far the most concentrated humic acid product I’ve found.   Humic and fulvic acids increase the organic material in the soil, aid in the growth of beneficial microbes, and act as a natural chelator that allows plants to better utilize macronutrients in subpar soils.  

Some humic acid products like antler Kings plot max or jolt (whichever one it is haha) claim to “stabilize” or even raise soil ph but this is pure nonsense- an acid, by definition, is not going to raise soil ph!  it does is help mitigate the nutrient lockout that can occur when ph is not within ideal range- which mirrors the results of having good ph but I find it really misleading when companies claim it increases ph.  

3. Add 50lbs/acre of micro nutrients.  I use an evaporated sea salt product called sea-90.  It’s loaded with dozens of micronutrients that are beneficial to both the plants and soil microbial life.   I had a small pile of it left over and found that the deer had eaten every last grain of it and proceeded to dig a big hole where it had been sitting.   Not advocating anyone break the law by putting this out as a mineral lick but it does demonstrate there is some nutrient in this product that deer crave, so using it as soil amendment should help ensure the food plot crops contain those nutrients as well. 

4.  Lastly, in addition to applying about 300lbs an acre of 15-15-15 split over two applications, I did a foliar application of a product called nutratender from keystone pest.  I used one gallon per acre and mixed 1/2 gallon of product to about 3.5 gallons of water and applied it with a backpack sprayer about 3 weeks after germination.   It’s a full spectrum fertilizer that contains all major and minor nutrients plus some biologics that aid microbial life in the soil.

I believe this helped a lot during a critical stage of growth at a time we weren’t getting a lot of rain.   The foliar fertilizer is taken up directly by the plants and isn’t impacted by soil chemistry.  I don’t think it would work as a stand alone unless you were willing to apply it once a week or maybe once every two weeks, but it’s a great way to compliment granular ferts, address acute nutrient  deficiencies, or as a boost during stress periods like drought.  

 The above suggestions are based solely on my personal experience and I am by no means an expert on any of this stuff (although I did stay at a holiday inn last night lol).   While I can’t guarantee that anyone else will have the same results with these products, I will say that everyone who has seen my food plots is shocked by how well they’ve grown on rocky virgin soil that’s never been tilled without the use of any herbicides.   I don’t have a tractor or a seed drill, most of the applications are done with a 20lb hand spreader and backpack sprayer and all the seed was broadcast ahead of rainfall.  

 I’ve successfully grown soybeans, oats, wheat, rye, triticale, turnips, hybrid brassicas, rape, radishes, chicory,  clover, peas and buckwheat using this method and the deer have readily eaten everything I’ve offered.  

My food plots are never entirely weed free but aren’t ever completely overrun either.   Most important to me is that the local deer and turkey look great, they are feeding in the plots from all day long, practically every one of the does on the property has two fawns (one even had triplets or adopted an orphaned fawn), and all of the fawns are big and healthy heading into the winter.  

Attached are some pics of this years plots and trail camera photos.  

[DDT]

On 9/17/2019 at 2:28 PM, Putnamcounty Bowhunter said:

I ordered it from outsidepride.com but I’m pretty sure that a few of the larger online seed distributors sell it as well.   

Its available in a northern and southern blend (you’d wanna use the northern blend up here).   It’s about 50-60% “aber” variety hsg, 20-30% improved clover varieties, and a splash of chicory and ptt.  

The sweet spot blends were developed specifically for food plots/deer farming, but they also sell some seed blends for cattle that are popular choices too and come in larger bags.   If you check out the sucraseed website, it lists all the diff seed blends.  A lot of guys use the “cash cow” mix to seed larger plots.   

Haha nice catch on the ferns- they’re out of control on my lease cus the ph is so low, but I picked Up a few tricks that have allowed me to grow really lush food plots with no tillage and without tons and tons of ag lime.  

1. Apply super fast acting calcium based pellet lime.   A 30lb bag covers 5,000 sq feet and begins working almost instantly.   it doesn’t last as long as dolomitic lime and doesn’t have as much magnesium but it will get your ph to a workable level faster and with less product than any other available option.  I did supplement this with 50lbs of regular pellet lime per 5k sq feet for the magnesium and additional ph benefits and I do continue to add lime whenever possible hoping to eventually get enough down to provide some long term stability.  

2. Apply 50-150lbs of granular humic acid per acre.  The Andersons sells a product that is 74% pure humic acid derived from Leonardite- this is by far the most concentrated humic acid product I’ve found.   Humic and fulvic acids increase the organic material in the soil, aid in the growth of beneficial microbes, and act as a natural chelator that allows plants to better utilize macronutrients in subpar soils.  

Some humic acid products like antler Kings plot max or jolt (whichever one it is haha) claim to “stabilize” or even raise soil ph but this is pure nonsense- an acid, by definition, is not going to raise soil ph!  it does is help mitigate the nutrient lockout that can occur when ph is not within ideal range- which mirrors the results of having good ph but I find it really misleading when companies claim it increases ph.  

3. Add 50lbs/acre of micro nutrients.  I use an evaporated sea salt product called sea-90.  It’s loaded with dozens of micronutrients that are beneficial to both the plants and soil microbial life.   I had a small pile of it left over and found that the deer had eaten every last grain of it and proceeded to dig a big hole where it had been sitting.   Not advocating anyone break the law by putting this out as a mineral lick but it does demonstrate there is some nutrient in this product that deer crave, so using it as soil amendment should help ensure the food plot crops contain those nutrients as well. 

4.  Lastly, in addition to applying about 300lbs an acre of 15-15-15 split over two applications, I did a foliar application of a product called nutratender from keystone pest.  I used one gallon per acre and mixed 1/2 gallon of product to about 3.5 gallons of water and applied it with a backpack sprayer about 3 weeks after germination.   It’s a full spectrum fertilizer that contains all major and minor nutrients plus some biologics that aid microbial life in the soil.

I believe this helped a lot during a critical stage of growth at a time we weren’t getting a lot of rain.   The foliar fertilizer is taken up directly by the plants and isn’t impacted by soil chemistry.  I don’t think it would work as a stand alone unless you were willing to apply it once a week or maybe once every two weeks, but it’s a great way to compliment granular ferts, address acute nutrient  deficiencies, or as a boost during stress periods like drought.  

 The above suggestions are based solely on my personal experience and I am by no means an expert on any of this stuff (although I did stay at a holiday inn last night lol).   While I can’t guarantee that anyone else will have the same results with these products, I will say that everyone who has seen my food plots is shocked by how well they’ve grown on rocky virgin soil that’s never been tilled without the use of any herbicides.   I don’t have a tractor or a seed drill, most of the applications are done with a 20lb hand spreader and backpack sprayer and all the seed was broadcast ahead of rainfall.  

 I’ve successfully grown soybeans, oats, wheat, rye, triticale, turnips, hybrid brassicas, rape, radishes, chicory,  clover, peas and buckwheat using this method and the deer have readily eaten everything I’ve offered.  

My food plots are never entirely weed free but aren’t ever completely overrun either.   Most important to me is that the local deer and turkey look great, they are feeding in the plots from all day long, practically every one of the does on the property has two fawns (one even had triplets or adopted an orphaned fawn), and all of the fawns are big and healthy heading into the winter.  

Attached are some pics of this years plots and trail camera photos.  

Thanks for the info. You sound alot like us, we plant enough to feed the critters year round to keep them fat and happy and coming back. Lots of work bringing the soil around. We're in Steuben county. Started with pretty sour soil too. Here's some brassicas after a 100# of urea applied on memorial day weekend. Going to pull some turnips and radishes this weekend to pickle. I hope the deer don't mind.

[Chef]

Many of you guys chimed in on my “neighbor encounter” thread, but it’s time to move on from that nonsense. 

One of my boys called me from the property this morning and said there is a giant flatbed with a dozer and excavator pulling through the gate. Woo hoo!

After our initial walk around the property in March, I asked the owners if there was any way of cleaning up the logging roads as they were severely rutted to the point of making it impossible to get into some areas with an atv and a lot of tree tops were blocking some roads completely. He said they would hire someone to take care of it. Unfortunately It has been way too wet all summer to get in there with any kind of equipment, they reached out to me last month and said they were still going to try to get it done before fall and had hired a contractor. At this point I just figured they weren't going to do it.

The operator told my son they were going to be there for 3 days cleaning up. We wish it would have been earlier in the year, but are really happy it is being done. This first year is going to be a complete crap shoot anyway so I’m not concerned about deer movement at all. The hand clearing we did to get atvs from the parking area to the top of the property is just over a mile. It would be great if they clear a road from one end to the other.

My question is this. Is it possible to get something planted in the freshly cleared woods roads and have it be beneficial to hunting this season or is it just too late? I know nothing about planting anything at all!

 

Winter rye


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