Hogs

[Doc]

I have been watching a few of these programs on National Geographic channel about California game warden activities ..... "Wild Justice" I believe is the name of the program. So far I saw a couple programs that described their efforts to apprehend wild hog poachers. So out there in California, feral hogs are apparently protected to some extent. Season, bag limit, or some other level of protective laws, I'm not sure. But apparently there are laws that make some acts of pig killing illegal. Just about every other state that I have ever heard of treat feral hogs as basicly a scourge to the environment. I have heard the spread of active hog populations described as an apocalypse visited upon the environment, and a scourge that impacts the welfare of habitat and nearly all native species (human or animal), to the point where most state governments would like to see them exterminated completely. NY has adopted the policy of "kill 'em ...... kill 'em all".

So is there anyone else that's confused by this radical difference in game management policy? Having never personally witnessed the destruction that everyone talks about, and the out-of-control population explosion that is always supposed to happen to pig populations, I have to wonder how California can support any level of legal restrictions on the harvesting of their pigs. Why isn't California one huge rooted-up state with jillions of pigs over-running every yard in their state? And of course there is the question as to whether the hog impacts might just be a bit over-stated. I don't know, I can only go by what the supposed experts tell me. But then most of that does not reconcile with California's notion of "wild hog poachers". What he heck am I missing here?

[Pav2704]

Not sure either Doc... I did some quick research and it seems that only land owners in California that experiencing problems with feral hogs may apply for a permit and you must reapply each year.

[fasteddie]

I think most of the Feral Hogs are in Hollywood ..........

[erussell]

I think most of the Feral Hogs are in Hollywood ..........

I would say that law is in line with about have the garbage that seems to seep out of that state.

[Doc]

I would say that law is in line with about have the garbage that seems to seep out of that state.

Lol ..... yes, maybe I should not be so amazed at anything that happens in California, particularly as regards game laws and policies. But I've got to say that their policies on the hog issue couldn't be any further apart from what appears to be the overwhelming opinions of all of the other states. I just thought it was curious.

[landtracdeerhunter]

Thanks Doc for bring this up. California is open all year for wild pig hunting. Their issue unlimited tags but, do charge a fee of $ 21.34/ tag. They have the most problem in the San Diego river water shed areas where a large part of the harvest takes place. Compare to some of the other states, like Texas, they don't seem to have that large of a harvest number, only a few thousand. They do have to follow all big game laws when hunting hogs. Every weapon can be used except crossbows. Now my question. Can their be hog poaching in New York, if no season, no limit, no tag, no fee, any weapon permitted? No rules spelled out in the hunting guide. I realize everyday law abiding rules apply. Maybe NY should be careful on the phrasing of their press releases and take the proper steps for control, and more important, hunter regulations. Maybe CA is on the ball with this one.

Edited May 11, 2012 by landtracdeerhunter

[Doc]

If half of what they say about the environmental impacts of hog infestations are true, I would think that total un-restricted hunting, trapping, or whatever is the proper approach. Eradication should probably be the goal, not trying to squeeze some extra bucks out of the hunters. I'm thinking that "hog poaching" probably is not worth 5 seconds of our sparce DEC law enforcement personel's time. More regulations mean more enforcement time required with an already admittedly inadequate policing force. It seems to me that charging a fee for tags on a destructive invasive species really is not all that smart in that it not only hampers hunter participation in the extermination of the species, but also takes enforcement time away from truly deserving poaching enforcement. Leave it to a liberal government agency to place income above proper management.

[ny hunter]

Has anyone heard of more hog sightings in NY this year.

[k burke]

In NY's case, you need a small game hunting license, so even though there is no season and no bag limits you could still be poaching if you don't have a small game license.

Agreed that requiring tags on a environmentally destructive and non-native species is counter productive.

[landtracdeerhunter]

I believe that other states have excepted the fact that the wild hog is going to be with them, being the numbers have exploded, so why not hunt them as a game animal and generate revenue. Seem to be a good control measure, not just on the animal, but on the hunter too. New Yorks numbers are still rather low, and their approach to eliminate them is still within reach. Come the day, hopefully we never see it, that hog numbers in NY ever explode, I'm sure you're see the same as CA. is doing. I just would like to see an official stance in the hunting guide.Something to go by, if indeed it is such a problem, as they say it is.. Like they did with CWD.

[Doc]

I believe that other states have excepted the fact that the wild hog is going to be with them, being the numbers have exploded, so why not hunt them as a game animal and generate revenue. Seem to be a good control measure, not just on the animal, but on the hunter too. New Yorks numbers are still rather low, and their approach to eliminate them is still within reach. Come the day, hopefully we never see it, that hog numbers in NY ever explode, I'm sure you're see the same as CA. is doing. I just would like to see an official stance in the hunting guide.Something to go by, if indeed it is such a problem, as they say it is.. Like they did with CWD.

I'm sure that eventually NYS will copy California's lead on trying to turn a state environmental disaster into a money grab. In a state like NY that would put a financial strangle-hold on their environmental, fish and game management agency so they can pilfer the funds for more state spending elsewhere, we can assume that it hasn't happened strictly because it hasn't occurred to them yet. That doesn't make it a smart move, it only makes it a typical move.... lol.

[Doc]

In NY's case, you need a small game hunting license, so even though there is no season and no bag limits you could still be poaching if you don't have a small game license.

Agreed that requiring tags on a environmentally destructive and non-native species is counter productive.

Just to clarify, the programs I was watching were not involving casual individual license checking. They were portraying large inter-agency, organized raids. They were investing a lot of serious man-hours supposedly for the purpose of protecting these hogs. But they never did mention the specific violations (or maybe I missed it).

[Doc]

Ok, here is what I found on California's Dept of Fish & Game website:

"Until the mid 1950's, wild pigs were unclassified under state law and could be killed with no restrictions. In 1957, wild pigs were designated a game mammal by the State Legislature. The Fish and Game Commission soon established hunting seasons, bag and possession limits, method of take and the conditions for using dogs. In 1992 Fish and Game Code Sections 4650 through 4657 were added that required hunters to possess wild pig license tags while hunting pigs."

So apparently they have given feral pigs full protection as a recognized game species, complete with seasons, bag limits, and special requirements for methods of taking as well as the specific tags that were previously mentioned. I'll tell you, that is a level of protection that most states reserve for their more prized game species. Given the stories of run-away populations and breeding frequency, it sounds like granting rats protected game species status....lol.

So again I have to wonder if the claims of hog related environmental horror stories that we hear really have any credibility. There is something about these two widely divergent management claims and practices that really are hard to reconcile. Why don't we hear of California being completely over-run, rooted up and tossed into the ocean by some massive out-of-control hog population explosion.

[Fantail]

This may be off topic but NY should treat coyotes like hogs. Unprotected.