Doc

I believe that was in the mid to late 80's. But then you can imagine how my memory for dates gets more and more messed up as each year goes by.... lol.

I remember back when the Honeoye yard was active, and you could drive right up to dozens of starving deer without them using the energy to move out of your way until the last minute. It was like they had given up. And there were the deer carcasses hanging from the fences where the deer were so weak, they failed to get their rear legs over the top of the fence and hung there until they died. It was a pretty gruesome and emotional sight. The snow covered mounds across the field of dead deer. Yeah it was sad. But that next fall I was out in the woods plotting to kill another one of them. It is a mixed message, and one that is difficult to explain. I don't even try.

That was a fun video. I found myself looking for the earliest flick of movement as each deer came in. kind of like real hunting where often the name of the game is to spot the deer as far out as possible so you can get the bow ready and be set for the shot. The first one was the hardest, and then once I knew where to look and what to look for it got easier.

There is a 'Gotcha" mentality that some people have that makes it imperative that they take the feats that some people have attained and try to shoot holes in their achievements. I don't know why, but it is just something they have to do.....lol. But I will quite quickly admit that there are none of those shots that I would ever be able to do once in a lifetime no matter how many years I tried it. I tend to give credit where credit is due. The guy has a whole lot of natural ability and athleticism that allows him to do things that almost all people will never be capable of doing. And no matter how much time is spent trying to tear down his abilities, most of us still will never be able to come close to matching even one of these shots successfully. So rather than throwing stones, I tend to just sit back and enjoy a skill that I have never seen before and appreciate the abilities that allow him to do this.

Great pics! ...... Definitely worth the walk. I'd say your herd looks like they are doing alright with this ugly winter.

I think you will have a lot of fun at it.

Pay attention to all the threads that we have had here about absentee landowners who find out that they have paid the big bucks to purchase the land and pay the taxes only to find out that the locals use the land as their own when the landowner isn't there. However, if you have made up your mind that this is what you want to do, It sounds like where you have your lease seems to be satisfactory, so that is probably where you should be looking. Any possibility that the people you are leasing from might want to sell off a chunk of it? I'm over here on the west end of the state so my location preferences really don't have much interest for you. I suspect that you put a lot of thought into your lease location, so most of the criteria are already set for you right there.

Ha-ha .... I think it was something like 20 yards that Fred bear shot his Brown bear with a recurve. Well, I sure wouldn't recommend that. I am convinced that was a little bit of insanity coming out. I tend to agree with you. Some animals just deserve a little extra respect. I never really had any fascination with ending up a pile of bear poop.

And if habitat health and a balance of deer vs habitat is trashed in favor solely of hunter satisfaction, just how long can inflated numbers continue to abuse habitat before there becomes no way at all to support a huntable population. There are limits as to how high you can artificially maintain large herds before mother nature decides to take over and do the managing for us. I will say that with the maturation of NYS habitat, it's only a matter of time before eventually somebody will not be very happy. I am not in favor of letting a bunch of laymen manage the herd. What are these biologists going to school for if they are going to shirk their bought and paid for expertise, handing such decisions over to hunters and farmers and nurserymen and motor vehicle accident lobbyists. That just ain't right.

The weatherman is panicking at the potential for losing his doom and gloom, ratings-boosting nightly forecasting with the advent of the warmer weather. So now they are all hyping up what they call the "return to winter" during the last two weeks of March. No they are not calling for a return to -30 degrees of wind-chill, but they are ranting and raving about the return of colder weather and more snow. Well, that's not surprising news. March is noted for at least one big ugly storm of heavy, sloppy, gloppy, heart-attack inducing, snow. No, winter is not done with us yet. I can even remember a 6" snowstorm in May. And I can remember quite a few snowy Easter-egg hunts. So there is no need to break out the shorts just yet. But it probably is not a real good idea to completely buy into the whining and hand-wringing of the weathermen either. Lately, they seem to be more interested in ratings and sensationalism than accurate forecasting.

NYS already has this management style, and has had it for quite a few years now. See http://www.dec.ny.gov/animals/7207.html No it is not a county by county activity, but the notion of gathering input from a variety of stakeholders, and essentially having them establish harvest targets was not invented by Wisconsin. Is it a good system? I'm not sure I'm all for it. I think deer densities are being managed to satisfy the politics and economics and stakeholder biases rather than attempting to use good established biological principles to match populations to carrying capacity of habitat. It sure would be interesting to see how things might work out if the agency charged with the responsibility of managing wildlife actually acted like a competency unit trained and dedicated to that responsibility fulfilling the job as everyone mistakenly assumes they are doing. Instead they have developed a system that spreads accountability among all other interest groups of NYS residents, with actual biological principles diluted with the wants and needs of anyone who has personal axes to grind. Deer management has devolved into a competing cluster of lobbyists that hold periodic popularity contests to support their individual interests. So has Wisconsin stumbled onto a new and unique management method. Not really. I really am not sure whether they have even taken a step forward with their "new" system.

Ha-ha .... a huge percentage of the threads that are on this site relate to how we mostly think the DEC is under-funded, under-staffed, and really doesn't have a clue what the heck they are doing. And yet we have no shortage of additional tasks that we want them to take on. I do believe that the re-introduction and maintenance of a NYS elk herd would be no small feat, and would soak up a lot of DEC resources and effort. How about we get control of the native critters first before we go any farther with introductions of new species.

I suspect that the DEC wants enthusiastic, knowledgeable, hunters to be filling the slot of "mentor". Perhaps the license requirement is a guaranteed attempt to do that but I can't think of any alternatives. Remember that a mentor is not to be confused with a "baby-sitter". There is a reason why you are out there accompanying a youth hunter. The hope is (and admittedly that all it is, is a "hope") that at least one of the two of you will be experienced in hunting, safety, and game identification. It may not be any guarantee, but I do think it is a worthwhile requirement that works most of the time.

Wrong!! The problem is pet owners who profess to love their animals but refuse to own them responsibly which really shows that they talk a good game but don't actually give a damn about them. Yes they turn them loose and then whine about careless driving when they run out in front of cars and become highway Frisbees. They think it is just fine for them to be torn limb from limb by coyotes or foxes or shredded birds of prey. And if they become the scourge of wild-life, it is of no concern to these people. The dog owners that "owned" the dogs that tore our sheep apart thought it was a nice thing to let their animals run loose. I have heard people moving out into the country talking how nice it is that the dogs can be allowed to run free. Yes, that is the lack of responsibility that a lot of people in this thread are responding to. If you can't control your animals, you don't deserve to have animals. And don't be blaming others for your thoughtless attitude toward pet ownership.

I know that there are darn few people that feel good about shooting animals that have been bred for domestication. But as a kid, we had some experiences where dogs got into our sheep, and I can tell you that there is nothing innocent, or loveable about a group of dogs that run loose and entertain their instincts from their ancestors. We had thousands of dollars of damage, of the most ruthless sort. These dogs were not killing out of hunger. Not a one of the sheep was actually eaten. Just enough damage was done to kill each sheep or leave them in a condition where they had to be destroyed. The interesting thing about these dogs was that they all were domestic family pets that were allowed to run free and take up some new hobbies. All of them were licensed, with tags, but totally unsupervised. I have also seen dogs running deer and ripping them apart, a bite at a time over long distances ..... not hardly the behavior that anyone assigns to the family pet, but almost always that is exactly what they are. So it's nice to have a soft spot in your heart for the loyal house pet, but don't be fooled into thinking that their calm, good nature as they are flopped out with their head on your lap is anything that cannot reverse 180 degrees when running loose with a couple of neighborhood pals. And the same thing is true of the family pussy-cat that is booted out the door in the morning to simply do what comes natural to them all day long.

A lot of them leave you wondering, "How on earth did they ever get those pictures?"

Since the other day when I saw two deer trying to move through all the snow, I have been thinking about how this winter might effect our herd. I will say that the few deer that I have seen seem to be in pretty good rig yet, but it is not all that easy to make that assessment simply by watching a couple of them for a few minutes. It did bother me that they are not able to simply walk through the snow, but rather have to kind of hop around which has to be using up valuable calories. Here's a bit of good news though. The weather people are talking about a pattern shift. No winter is not over, and there is still lots of cold and snow in our future, but the brutal stretches of cold might be over ...... according to them. Also, there is some warmer weather coming at the end of next week that may get rid of some more of this snow. Actually, we have gotten rid of about 6" of snow over the past week. Hopefully the melting will not be forming a crust. That could be fatal in a couple of different ways. Now, if you want to feel sorry for the critters, just imagine how the turkeys have to been struggling in this crap.

No, all I did was watch the commercial video. The fact that they have been super successful at getting people to send them money only tells me they are real good at what they do. The world is full of people who have become experts at extracting money from people....lol. But unfortunately they'll have to do it without my donation ..... lol. I guess it is just my natural skepticism of these kinds off "send me money" offers. Does anyone actually personally know someone who has participated in this and is happy with the way the thing is actually working? I am simply sending out a bit of caution. These internet offers are not always as good as they sound. The set-up has all the earmarks of a great scam.

I do have to point out that this whole video finishes off with a plea for donations to help pay for the tooling, etc. In return you will get some unspecified break in the price if and when you decide to buy one. So I am assuming that they are asking for your money, and at some point in time off into the future after they get everything tooled up and ready to market, you will have the opportunity to buy one at a reduced rate. That is if you can still find them around. I am picturing that inside this thing is a reservoir of honey, and a small pump ...... lol. But it sure does look impressive. I smell a scam!

One of the difficult things is to recognize the signs of deer starvation stress. The deer's winter coat covers a lot of the display of emaciation.

Looking ahead, I am wondering if this is crazy weather is a sign of another summer garden of cold, rain, and non-germinating seeds and vegetable rot? Will this record-breaking winter of extremes switch back to normalcy, or will the colder trend and excessive precipitation continue right through the summer? We'll have to wait and see.

I am getting a little concerned. The weatherman is seeing no real relief in sight, and the snow is belly deep, and deeper, on the deer. It all depends on when the weather really decides to break. If this crap continues into April there could be some real problems come next hunting season.

I'm getting a bit concerned I just got done watching three deer just off the end of the house. They don't look like they are having a fun time just moving through this unending snow. The snow is above their belly. They still look in reasonable rig as near as I can tell from 30 yards through the window. But they are not walking through the snow anymore, they are now in the hopping mode which has to be burning calories like mad.

Please repost this when the date gets close. I really don't want to miss this again this year.

Isn't that sad? A lot of what is being said about the quality of our educational system was being demonstrated in that video ..... lol. Also highlighted is the fact that such a very important part of our governmental system (voting) is being done by people who are far more incompetent than the losers that are getting voted into office. It's really quite frustrating.