Doc

I have always talked about getting a gun safe and using it also to store a few important papers, guns, ammo, powder and other items. The problem I'm having is with the fire-ratings that they assign to them. They are usually rated relative to a temperature value for a certain time. The problem is that they never indicate what temperature or time is adequate for safe storage of paper, ammunition, and the guns. How hot does the average housefire get? How long is that temperature maintained (on average)? How hot before ammunition or powder explodes? This would be some nice info to have before laying out the bucks. Anyone ever see this kind of info detailed anywhere? Any of you firemen have any of that kind of data or know where it can be found? Yes, if you simply want a burglar-proof/kid-proof place to store guns, a lot of that stuff doesn't matter. But for protection of materials and property from fire damage, there is a whole lot more to consider than just temp/time if you don't know what is adequate. Maybe these things are way over-built against fire .... I don't know. Or maybe they don't make a gun safe that will adequately protect some materials from fire .... I don't know that either.

How could AR not work? It kind of stands to reason that if you are forced to pass up almost every buck you see, you have to eventually see more and bigger bucks. Is anyone really arguing about that? Hey, what the heck .... if everybody was forced to stop hunting completely, you would get that result and more. Just imagine all the neat sway-backed, toothless deer pictures you could get.....lol.

Wow! ...... was he ever bugged by that camera. He didn't like that at all.

Some kind of Rorschach test I think.

Euthanized???? ......LOL. What the heck, they freakin' killed it. Man this media-speak is really something isn't it? Anyway, that is not the first rabid beaver that I have read about this year. I have never heard of it in rodents before this year. What if it got into the NYC rat population ..... Yikes!!!

Great carriers of bird flu when populations get too large. But anyway you really don't have to justify it. We shoot woodchucks, rats at the dump, and various predators and don't seem to feel that we have to justify it. I will say that I have never seen more crows flying around everywhere in my life and if anything looks like it needs a bit more control, they are it.

Well you know how they tell you to "pick a spot" when aiming? It's a little easier on these.

Or not implementing ARs might be a start

You know, if that became an every-day story, I would predict a dramatic decline in home burglaries. There's got to be a bit of a deterrent to reading that burglarizing homes has a very high mortality rate. The problem is that the pinkos have convinced the general public of the evilness of firearms in the home.

That kind of says it all doesn't it. You people don'y like the way things are going? Those last couple of sentences might give you a clue as to how to fix it. That goes for just about any hunting issue.

I'm saying that when people start with the hate-talk over these subjects and start acting like it is the most important subject in their lives, they suffer a hell of a credibility problem when talk is all they do. At some point you would think they would realize that they really aren't changing anyone's mind and move on to more credible ways of making a difference. As far as the letters are concerned, that's a great way to support your position (for those few that actually do that). Attending DEC meetings is another. But what % actually do that. Pretty darn small from what I have seen. Unfortunately, those efforts seldom trump the support of those organizations that have the lobbying infrastructure and who already have the ear (in an official way) of the legislators and the DEC. Yes, if you are lucky enough to get some sort of landslide grassroots letter campaign going, you may be able to overpower the established advocacy groups .... may be able. Letter writing campaigns do on rare occasions actually work. It's just not as reliable as an organized approach. And by the way, letter writing campaigns are another tool of organizations. But then as we have heard from Steve, letter campaigns are corrupt and apparently cannot be trusted .... lol. As far as the politics of game management, I think you've got your work cut out for you if you want that changed. I'm not even sure it is a real great idea to lock public opinion completely out of the mix. After all it does give the whiners their only avenue of recourse weak though it is. But if that is a goal, you have a long way to go because politics is interlaced with the whole system and runs all the way up to the governors appointment of the DEC commissioner.

We had a short rain (as far as anything that would mean something). It came down prtty good for a slong as it lasted. One thing I noted was that it wasn'y flowing dow the driveway like usual. The ground was sucking it up like a sponge. We need a LOT more.

Ha-ha .... I'm not far behind you, but I guess I never will catch up. Happy birthday ..... oldtimer. There ain't too many on here that I can call that.

Look, I've been listening to the "real whiners" for a few years on here. It's always those that refuse to put their money and effort where their mouth is. It is those that do not have the courage of their convictions to get involved in even the most basic ways. I am not an AR guy, but I definitely will stand up for those who have the where-with-all to climb out of their armchairs and go out and get organized, or pay their dues and offer support to those that advocate for their activities, and by the way have to suffer all the stone throwing from the peanut gallery that feels comfortable simply sitting back and whining. I am not saying that on every issue where you may have a disagreement you need to jump right up and create an organization. But I will say that when the opinions move beyond just a casual disagreement and start with the over-the-edge doom and gloom statements and the hate-speak, I would think you and others might be moved to take some action. I mean to listen to some of the comments here you would think the world is coming to an end. Wouldn't you think that with all this hatred of AR, and all the predictions of it ending hunting as we know it, somebody by now would have conjured up an anti-AR organization to push those views forward? Don't you find that strange? This isn't exactly a new issue you know. From the venom in some of these replies, you would think that more would be done than just some thread in a forum.

Oh for crying out loud. Now we start with the conspiracy stories. The DEC supposedly accepted tons of unsigned input and you are blaming AR groups? What is the matter with you people. You will find any kind of silly story to justify maintaining your ability to simply lay back and stay uninvolved. The only thing that empowers any of these organizations is the unwillingness of the whiners to actually get off their butt and take them down or replace them. That's how the desires of the few influences the situations of this so-called "silent majority".

This thread was not about one single issue, it was a rant about entire organizations. Apparently the NYB is to be looked at as some kind of evil empire and those who believe in AR should have no right to organize and advocate their beliefs. Yes it is the so-called silent majority again who whine a lot about those who convert their beliefs into action, but don't have enough passion of their own to replace these organizations or sway their beliefs. It's a whole lot easier to sit back on some forum and snipe at the efforts of others than to try to change or replace them. That is a symptom that a lot in the hunting community have .... a lot of whining and damn little action supporting their beliefs. So I have little tolerance for those that just want to sit back and throw stones without doing anything really constructive.

Actually, I have always assumed that laws dealing with releasing an arrow (hunting or otherwise) mirrored the laws dealing with the discharge of firearms. Ah but, that is an assumption. I have never seen it written ...... and you know what they say about "assume" .... lol.

Was it on this forum where somebody posted a picture of a big ol' blackbear sitting up in somebody's treestand? Now to me that would be a pretty exciting thing to happen on my way to the stand ..... especially if I was most of the way up the stand before I realized that it was occupied ..... lol.

It's not that there's so many but the ones that are there are getting mighty thirsty .... lol.

Now that's hilarious!! I can just picture that whole scenario like an Elmer Fudd cartoon. Lol .... that's is one funny mental image.

If we don't get some rain pretty soon, we may not have to be thinking about an October 1st bow opener. They might decide to close the woods down. I'm telling you, it is getting ridiculous out there. It would take absolutely nothing to get a fire started. i'm starting to wonder if my well is going to survive. I've never seen it tested to this extent before.

Well, there ya go. The silent majority is indeed silent, aren't they? So what good are they? And who cares about their opinions and how they think the world is suffering? The fact is that the organizations that you are whining about are active, energetic, advocates for what they believe. If you don't like it then take your whining somewhere besides internet forums and play the game the way it is supposed to be played. Nobody cares that you don't have the spine to do anything but complain. I get a bit irked everytime I see these people claiming "Well gosh, their views don't represent me". Get over it ..... if there are so many people who disagree with ARs and the NYB views then stop your crying and get involved like those people did. If you can't work inside of those groups then start your own. Put your damn money and effort where your mouth is instead of just moaning about those that do. I'm sorry if I appear to be coming on a little strong about this, but it is just something that finally had to be said. Enough of this worthless bashing. If you have such strong feelings about these issues then do something useful and worthwhile about it.

No question about it. If that were to happen, there would be a huge increase in hunters. Of course the problem is turning that non-hunter into a hunter. I think we have to become some super-salesmen because there are all kinds of social evolution that is fighting against us. But not to be a wet-blanket on your enthusiasm, I have to agree that we have to try if hunting is going to exist off into the future. Right now it doesn't look all that good, and I think that innovative thinking such as yours is what's required to make any kind of a difference at all.

I am simply pointing out some real options that can have some real impact. I am not pointing fingers, nor am I absolving anyone of a chance to join into the promotion of the sport. I am pointing out potential resources that at one time used to be effective, and don't seem to be all that involved anymore. We have great resources that need to somehow get re-inspired .... or we can just simply throw in the towel. Now, if that is looked at as pointing fingers, that is too bad. It is a realistic way of looking at the problem that suggests resources that no one seems to be willing to talk about.

Maybe a lap-belt on the saddle? Hey, what the heck .... I saw the Duke blazing away on horse-back in True Grit. And that was at a full run. You could be riding, chasing and gunning all at the same time. YEE-HAH !!!!