Let's here from those in the know!!

[Fanaddict]

Living and hunting in 3k an AR zone going in the 4th year I've not seen a big improvement in the size or the #'s of big rack big's that everybody thought there would be!! What's everybody else observation? Do you think AR's are working? My thought is that the DEC say's the buck kill has gone up, of course it has!! The first year they took the 1.5 year old deer out of the huntable deer so the buck kill went down. Now the kill #'s are up because the 1.5 are now 2.5's so of course the kill went up but where are all the BIG BUCK's that people wanted. I say they're not there because your just killing 2.5 year old deer whats the difference!!

[nyantler]

If you are looking for loads of big bucks from a 3 on a side antler restriction you'd better not hold your breath... that is not a big enough restriction to produce boat loads of HUGE bucks... all it does is add a few more mature deer to the next couple age classes by protecting yearlings.

[Fanaddict]

If you are looking for loads of big bucks from a 3 on a side antler restriction you'd better not hold your breath... that is not a big enough restriction to produce boat loads of HUGE bucks... all it does is add a few more mature deer to the next couple age classes by protecting yearlings.

I understand that but what's the difference if those 1.5 year old bucks get killed the next year. In most guy's thinking and from what they show and preach on TV 2.5 year old buck are hardly mature!!

[nyantler]

I understand that but what's the difference if those 1.5 year old bucks get killed the next year. In most guy's thinking and from what they show and preach on TV 2.5 year old buck are hardly mature!!

The difference would be that he wouldn't be 1.5... he would have another year of age and experience making him a bit harder to see or kill therefore increasing his chances of reaching physical maturity... my point though is that the 3 on a side rule is not designed to produce big bucks... just to protect the majority of the yearlings to give bucks a leg up on reaching an older age. Restrictions need to be much higher to produce trophy deer on a large scale

[Doc]

And yet another AR thread.

[nyantler]

And yet another AR thread.

It seems to be a topic many new fellas have a lot of interest in.

[oneidacountyhunter]

And yet another AR thread.

better get comfy

[Fanaddict]

The reason I started this thread is all the BS about AR's by people who aren't living it. Many of us have been for a few years and are seeing the results, or lack of results first hand!! I say there isn't much of a difference in the size of the buck sence it started in 3K. I've been hunting for 40 plus years and have taken a number of deer mostly 1.5 year old with racks that ranged from spikes to basket raked 8 pointers. from what I see now is a bunch of basket racked 2.5 year olds. 15 years ago I shot a 13 pointer with a busted rack that had a 11 inch speard weighed 110 lbs. and was aged at 6.5 years old. The only thing that made him look old was his grey muzzel. Not many deer made it past 2 years old then and not many deer will make it pass 2 year know with the AR's in place. And as I said a 2.5 old is hardly a mature deer. Let's here from the people who are living in the AR zones who are living it and the rest of you experts stay out of the thread and just read what THEY have to say you may learn something first hand!!

[phade]

The reason I started this thread is all the BS about AR's by people who aren't living it. Many of us have been for a few years and are seeing the results, or lack of results first hand!! I say there isn't much of a difference in the size of the buck sence it started in 3K. I've been hunting for 40 plus years and have taken a number of deer mostly 1.5 year old with racks that ranged from spikes to basket raked 8 pointers. from what I see now is a bunch of basket racked 2.5 year olds. 15 years ago I shot a 13 pointer with a busted rack that had a 11 inch speard weighed 110 lbs. and was aged at 6.5 years old. The only thing that made him look old was his grey muzzel. Not many deer made it past 2 years old then and not many deer will make it pass 2 year know with the AR's in place. And as I said a 2.5 old is hardly a mature deer. Let's here from the people who are living in the AR zones who are living it and the rest of you experts stay out of the thread and just read what THEY have to say you may learn something first hand!!

That's gonna quite the crowd...not.

Believe it or not some of us have some knowledge in AR, even if we don't "live" in the area.

Not a ton of agreement, obviously, because it is one of the most dividing topics there is in hunting right now. Still, people on both sides here bring value to the table about it.

The DEC never once said the goal of AR was to produce trophy bucks. Jeremy Hurst is a broken record...saying it is only to advance the majority of 1.5 age class to 2.5.

[Uncle Nicky]

We have AR here in PA, I think it started around 2002. I hated it at first, now I'm pretty much used to it. After 10 years, I still can't say I'm excited about it, just one more issue that turns us against one another rather than uniting sportsman.

To be honest...I see more bucks than I used to, especially during archery, and bigger racks. Unfortunately, they also started giving out a lot more doe tags at the same time, so deer population has gone down overall.

Interestingly enough, I've shot 2 of the biggest bucks of my life in Allegany county, NY in the last 3 years, where there are no antler restrictions.

[joe12]

One of the areas that I hunt - 4R will have ARs for the first year this year. My dad, brother, and I let spikes and 4 pointers walk anyway, but it will be interesting to see if we start encountering larger bucks the next few years.

[steve863]

I understand that but what's the difference if those 1.5 year old bucks get killed the next year. In most guy's thinking and from what they show and preach on TV 2.5 year old buck are hardly mature!!

That is exactly what happens. Like these hunters are passing the 2.5 year olds?? BS! Most especially in many of the AR units where doe permits are very hard to get. Like these guys will go out to hunt and limit themselves to nothing??? Yeah right. Why even bother going out then?

What I can't stand is these AR proponents talking down to those who shoot 1.5 year old spikes or forkhorns, and then go thumping their own chests when they shoot that 2.5 or maybe even a 1.5 buck that happens to have at least 3 points on a side. What BS. Like they have accomplished something greater by holding out for their big one?? LOL Pure insanity and not much more.

[nyantler]

The reason I started this thread is all the BS about AR's by people who aren't living it. Many of us have been for a few years and are seeing the results, or lack of results first hand!! I say there isn't much of a difference in the size of the buck sence it started in 3K. I've been hunting for 40 plus years and have taken a number of deer mostly 1.5 year old with racks that ranged from spikes to basket raked 8 pointers. from what I see now is a bunch of basket racked 2.5 year olds. 15 years ago I shot a 13 pointer with a busted rack that had a 11 inch speard weighed 110 lbs. and was aged at 6.5 years old. The only thing that made him look old was his grey muzzel. Not many deer made it past 2 years old then and not many deer will make it pass 2 year know with the AR's in place. And as I said a 2.5 old is hardly a mature deer. Let's here from the people who are living in the AR zones who are living it and the rest of you experts stay out of the thread and just read what THEY have to say you may learn something first hand!!

Thats like saying because you hang around a service station you know something about fixing cars... you could ask 1000 hunters in that area about what they have observed an you would get 1000 different stories... just because you hunt in an AR area doesn't mean you know whats going on there... th proof is in the actual numbers.

Here is an example of hunter observation vs actuality... I lease 1000 acres with 12 other guys... in the last 10 years I have taken 5 bucks that score over 115 off the property and have seen literally 100's of bucks half of which I've taken a pass on... 4 other guys have taken a few over 115 as well and have seen many other bucks as well... but 8 of the hunters continue to complain that there are not many bucks on the property because they have seen very few in the last 10 years and none of them has taken a buck in those 10 years... their reality is not my reality, or the reality of the other 4 guys on the same piece of property... I contend that they know very little about what is really going on with the deer in that area... so 8 of 13 guys on the property if asked would say the hunting sucks there... their knowledge comes from their lack of ability to see and kill deer on the property.... the other 5 of us have walls full of bucks that have come from the property all during the same time span... so do you to take the opinion of the fellas that just haven't seen deer or killed deer...or the proof of the fellas that actually have seen and harvested many bucks on the property to determine how good of a hunting spot it is?

Edited September 28, 2012 by nyantler

[PETERBFLY]

Thats like saying because you hang around a service station you know something about fixing cars... you could ask 1000 hunters in that area about what they have observed an you would get 1000 different stories... just because you hunt in an AR area doesn't mean you know whats going on there... th proof is in the actual numbers.

Here is an example of hunter observation vs actuality... I lease 1000 acres with 12 other guys... in the last 10 years I have taken 5 bucks that score over 115 off the property and have seen literally 100's of bucks half of which I've taken a pass on... 4 other guys have taken a few over 115 as well and have seen many other bucks as well... but 8 of the hunters continue to complain that there are not many bucks on the property because they have seen very few in the last 10 years and none of them has taken a buck in those 10 years... their reality is not my reality, or the reality of the other 4 guys on the same piece of property... I contend that they know very little about what is really going on with the deer in that area... so 8 of 13 guys on the property if asked would say the hunting sucks there... their knowledge comes from their lack of ability to see and kill deer on the property.... the other 5 of us have walls full of bucks that have come from the property all during the same time span... so do you to take the opinion of the fellas that just haven't seen deer or killed deer...or the proof of the fellas that actually have seen and harvested many bucks on the property to determine how good of a hunting spot it is?

Exactly!!! A hunter who knows what they are doing versus a hunter who walks into a diner to have breakfast with all of his/her hunting clothes on. Who has no idea which direction the wind is blowing and spends most of their time spooking almost every deer in the woods. You know exactly who you are..

[sits in trees]

ive been hunting 3j where AR first started in this state some 6 or 7 years ago now and can honestly say the bucks are getting huge. been seeing more 8s 9s even 10s in the last 3 years then i have ever seen hunting here. this area was dubbed the land of the spike buck before AR and if someone even saw a 4 or 6 it was rare.

it takes time, we didnt really see results until 4 years or so....be patient it will happen.

[ELMER J. FUDD]

If these AR areas were so bad in the past, AND it was due to heavy hunting/take, it's likely that the heavy hunting has continued thus it's taking longer than expected for AR's to come to fruition. How's that for a run on sentence?

Edited September 29, 2012 by ELMER J. FUDD

[tughillhunter]

I think i might start an ar topic. Seems to be a new fad. I just wanna fit in.

[MountainHunter]

I live in 3a and hunt in 3c and 3j as well. I am seeing bigger bucks than I have in my 30 plus years of hunting. Bucks in the 120s are routinely being taken. 140 inch and 150 inch deer are being taken.

I saw the biggest buck of my life locally last week. AR's have every thing to do with this.

[jetmec]

ive been hunting 3j where AR first started in this state some 6 or 7 years ago now and can honestly say the bucks are getting huge. been seeing more 8s 9s even 10s in the last 3 years then i have ever seen hunting here. this area was dubbed the land of the spike buck before AR and if someone even saw a 4 or 6 it was rare.

it takes time, we didnt really see results until 4 years or so....be patient it will happen.

i couldnt agree with you more! since i have been skydiving in gardner in ulster county. i see many deer at the drop zone when i am there. and in the past 4 years i have seen the size and number of bucks increase very nicely!!! and every hunter i have talked to over there is very happy!

[jetmec]

funny how you dont see all the fire breathing anti ar guys on this thread. maybe because there are to many people posting mostly praise and positive results?!

[PETERBFLY]

Yes Sir!! There you go Anti AR hunters.. Its working and you have nothing to say.. Thanks for the info Sits in Trees. I have been going back and forth with these guys and they keep saying I am a dummy. I would say you heard it from the Horses mouth and I will refer everyone to you from now on. Its amazing how an animal/fish will grow to become bigger if you dont harvest it.

[jetmec]

That is exactly what happens. Like these hunters are passing the 2.5 year olds?? BS! Most especially in many of the AR units where doe permits are very hard to get. Like these guys will go out to hunt and limit themselves to nothing??? Yeah right. Why even bother going out then?

What I can't stand is these AR proponents talking down to those who shoot 1.5 year old spikes or forkhorns, and then go thumping their own chests when they shoot that 2.5 or maybe even a 1.5 buck that happens to have at least 3 points on a side. What BS. Like they have accomplished something greater by holding out for their big one?? LOL Pure insanity and not much more.

you think its crap that some choose to hold off on a 2.5 because in there opinion they want something better. just like some of us think its crap that you'll shoot the first thing that walks in front of you! its all a matter of opinion and thats a simple fact. i think its crap that some of you claim you see all these mature big racked deer and you simply let them walk to shoot a spike i bet you seen bigfoot a few times also. i think the answer more lies with the fact that you simply are not seeing many deer and when you do the urge to kill it is to much for you to handle. but that is just my opinion. not trying to be a wise ass or be little anyone.

[PETERBFLY]

I honestly think this is more about hunters who dont get to spend alot of time in the woods and when they do, there isnt much action versus guys like myself and Jet who do spend alot of time in the woods and see tons of deer. I wish we could divide the regulation so you can continue to harvest whatever you want in your area and areas like mine can impose restrictions because there are plenty of does that can go into the freezer. I have 2 does tags, plus my Super Sportsman Doe tag and my Either sex Archery Tag. I can legally take 4 doe and I would have no problem filling every tag with my bow

[nyantler]

That is exactly what happens. Like these hunters are passing the 2.5 year olds?? BS! Most especially in many of the AR units where doe permits are very hard to get. Like these guys will go out to hunt and limit themselves to nothing??? Yeah right. Why even bother going out then?

What I can't stand is these AR proponents talking down to those who shoot 1.5 year old spikes or forkhorns, and then go thumping their own chests when they shoot that 2.5 or maybe even a 1.5 buck that happens to have at least 3 points on a side. What BS. Like they have accomplished something greater by holding out for their big one?? LOL Pure insanity and not much more.

Hmmm.. I actually am inclined to agree with your last paragraph and maybe a bit of the first as well.