Deer Farming News Investigation

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Like I said... delusional ... anything I thought you knew about hunting, conservation or whitetails just got shot down by your last dozen or so posts... actually it is possibly the most nonsensical rant I have ever heard by a so called hunter... your "business" has nothing to do with hunting, conservation, or the future thereof... in fact it has no place on a hunting forum at all. For the record what you know about CWD is another delusional version that you somehow concocted from listening or reading something  written by someone that obviously knows nothing about it either. There is no intelligent argument here no matter how much you have tried to make one... beyond this anyone that wastes their time responding to such nonsense has either lost their mind or lives in the same fantasy land as you.

Yes one that lost the battle and has no ammo would put up a post like that. I could blast all the proven science on CWD and it hows,whens and wheres but why waste my time. Here i thought you were one of the ones that may have kept up with research but this shows how clueless you are also.

 

I have been and will continue to be all about real conservation with my property and i will also continue to grow with the future.

Look on the bright side. May not be long and you will all be searching the Dak's looking for those one or two deer that are left up there.

 

Any time you want to match wit's on CWD, you just come a calling but do me a favor. Learn how it came about in your own state first!

[WesternNY]

http://www.dec.ny.gov/animals/33220.html

 

"First case of CWD in New York: In early April, the first case of CWD was confirmed in five white-tailed deer from two captive breeding facilities in Oneida County."

 

 

http://www.dec.ny.gov/animals/7191.html

 

 

[WesternNY]

http://chronic-wasting-disease.blogspot.com/2014/03/transmission-of-chronic-wasting-disease.html

[WesternNY]

Here is a better link to the recent study

http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0091043

[Four Season Whitetail's]

 harvest data strongly supports a frequency-dependent transmission structure with sex-specific infection rates that are two times higher in males than females!(QUOTE)

 

Only need this one sentence out of your post to blow QDMA's harvest thoughts out of the water.

 

If they continue saying to let bucks grow and mature they are supporting the spread of disease across the country.

Edited March 31, 2014 by Four Season Whitetails

[WNYBuckHunter]

Just curious, where you are pulling that quote from FSW. Do you have a link to a research paper,study or article that says the same thing?

[WesternNY]

You post quotes from other forums, I post the research.   Below is the quoted info from the study.   Why do you think the study is against QMDA practices?   The QDMA suggest harvest goals for quality and health.  Why I don't speak for the QDMA, I am sure if Buck Harvests of all age classes is needed in a CWD MANAGEMENT AREA they would support this measure.  Your arguement is so weak, everyone can see past your nonsense.  You are doing more harm to your creditabilty and to the support of deer farms... but keep slinging nonsense and digging your hole deeper.

 

"Given our model structure and data, our results provide strong support for FD transmission of CWD with the force of infection driven by changes in prevalence, which we suggest is a vital metric for focused control efforts. Generally as prevalence increases, as found in Wisconsin, infection rate also increases in the absence of intervention, producing an accelerating pattern of infection. Assuming that frequency-dependent transmission predominates (as our evaluation indicates), management to reduce prevalence will mediate potential CWD population impacts. The higher rate of infection and prevalence in males, thus, provides the basis for effective CWD management using deer harvest focused on this sex. Management to reduce prevalence might be accomplished through the synergistic effects of targeted harvest and vaccination of males. Unfortunately, we know little about the mechanisms for male infection and further research is needed before alternative management strategies to reduce male infection rates can be developed. Spatial differences in CWD infection rates, despite similar habitat and pre-CWD deer abundance, suggest that unidentified environmental or management factors may also influence disease dynamics and future trends in prevalence. Future research to understand the drivers of CWD transmission, how these vary spatially, and the relative importance of environmental and direct transmission is critical to understanding future CWD dynamics in wild deer.

Our results also indicate that even with high deer densities CWD has been spreading at a relatively slow rate across the landscape; in agreement with larger scale spatial patterns for prevalence [44]. However, as disease prevalence continues to increase, the rate of infection in yearling bucks will also increase [46]. Because dispersing bucks may be an important source of disease spread, these patterns suggest that CWD prevalence outside the core area will continue to grow and the disease may spread at an increasing rate. Although the drivers of CWD spatial spread are not generally known (see [44] for identification of landscape features that affect spread), management efforts to reduce both local prevalence and deer abundance will likely reduce dispersal of infected yearling bucks. However, the relative impact of reducing deer abundance versus prevalence in lowering the number of infected yearling bucks likely depends on disease prevalence and deer density [46]. Further research is needed to determine the factors that affect spatial spread and develop effective management strategies."

[WesternNY]

Just curious, where you are pulling that quote from FSW. Do you have a link to a research paper,study or article that says the same thing?

Read my link from the post Better link to the research.  Read the entire thing and remember.... if in a CWD Management area, the QDMA would support whatever appropriate management practices necessary.

 

 

this is the study

http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0091043

 

Four Seasons thinks this study is going to cause major issues for QDM management practices...   lol

 

In a CWD MANAGEMENT AREA, the focus is not QDM but management for CWD.

Edited March 31, 2014 by WesternNY

[ELMER J. FUDD]

Me, Im staying on the cutting edge and enjoying this great animal 24-7 and making a very good living doing so. My Choice!

How much?

[dbHunterNY]

did not vote not enough info for me 

1) I would support if managed correctly 

2) yes I think it could if not managed correctly & think there are cases where it has transferred CWD to wild deer I could be wrong on that

3 nope don't really care if I shoot a deer from a farm & would never pay that kind of money to hunt

but to each is own 

I am not one that would bash anyone for the way anyone wants to hunt if it is legal go for it

 

a lot of great posts.  this one seems right.  that said a large fence with captive deer for study aren't necessarily a deer farm like some others are.  I'd like to experience it with an open mind so I know and can say I'm weighing in with first hand experience.  I've known a few others who have done it on one occasion.  I'd never pay the going rate and it'd have to be a massive tract of land within the fence with lots of cover and a sanctuary.  none of the 200 acre fenced properties I've seen with most being field are ethical in my opinion.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Just curious, where you are pulling that quote from FSW. Do you have a link to a research paper,study or article that says the same thing?

To you i would say go back and read post#28 your brother put up.  Good science that qdma seems to be turning a blind eye at.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Read my link from the post Better link to the research.  Read the entire thing and remember.... if in a CWD Management area, the QDMA would support whatever appropriate management practices necessary.

 

 

this is the study

http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0091043

 

Four Seasons thinks this study is going to cause major issues for QDM management practices...   lol

 

In a CWD MANAGEMENT AREA, the focus is not QDM but management for CWD.

Hello..Do you think Wisconsin is the only state that has CWD.  Is that state the only state that the qdma has a foot in? No and No.

 

The science shows over and over that CWD is found in more males than females and more adult males then yearlings. Either way the qdma stands for more mature animals and that spreads CWD. Period.   Until they make it public that they change their stance then they are a part of the big problem.

[WNYBuckHunter]

To you i would say go back and read post#28 your brother put up.  Good science that qdma seems to be turning a blind eye at.

 

Thats one study. I read it. If you read the conclusionary statements at the end, they say that the study did not take many many important factors into account. Id like to see more studies that support the same theories before I put a ton of faith in it. Thats what Im asking for. Are you really basing your whole opinion around one study that has more holes than a screen door?

 

Dont get me wrong, Im being 100% serious here, as I have not done a ton of reading on CWD. Id like to see all of the different aspects.

[nyantler]

Thats one study. I read it. If you read the conclusionary statements at the end, they say that the study did not take many many important factors into account. Id like to see more studies that support the same theories before I put a ton of faith in it. Thats what Im asking for. Are you really basing your whole opinion around one study that has more holes than a screen door?

 

Dont get me wrong, Im being 100% serious here, as I have not done a ton of reading on CWD. Id like to see all of the different aspects.

Probably not going to get something that doesn't exist... you see, when someone is trying to make a ridiculous point it serves no purpose to delve too deep into the subject... but rather just stop at the study ( or a few sentences in the study) that almost makes his point.. but not really.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Probably not going to get something that doesn't exist... you see, when someone is trying to make a ridiculous point it serves no purpose to delve too deep into the subject... but rather just stop at the study ( or a few sentences in the study) that almost makes his point.. but not really.

If you are as smart as you would like some to believe you should be able to find the research yourself.   A person can go on one guys blog and find about any research ever done on CWD.

 But again you are one of the many that have no clue on the facts of CWD in your own state so we sure wont ask you about research across the country.

 If you think the point that CWD has been found more in males than females and more in mature animals is ridiculous you really remove any doubt of how much of a fool you are.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Patrick Durkin: UW study recommends killing more bucks to fight CWD

 

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March 28, 2014 5:00 pm  •  PATRICK DURKIN For the State Journal

(1) Comments

Researchers at the University of Wisconsin believe CWD could be reduced and managed by focusing heavy hunting pressure on bucks, which are twice more likely than female deer to carry the fatal disease.

Enlarge Photo

A just-released University of Wisconsin study on chronic wasting disease recommends focusing more hunting pressure on the deer most likely to carry and spread CWD in whitetails: bucks, the males of the species.

The peer-reviewed study, released March 21 and published online in PLOS ONE, was led by Christopher S. Jennelle, Ph.D., and Professor Michael D. Samuel at UW. Samuel concedes many hunters will dislike shooting more bucks to reduce CWD, but Jennelle’s study predicts the alternative is CWD increasingly infecting more deer while spreading across the landscape.

Samuel said this “acceleration of the infection rate” is already underway in the CWD’s core area in southwestern Wisconsin. Further, the researchers wrote that current deer-management practices in the area will have a predictable result: “Nearly 50 percent of adult males and 25 to 30 percent of adult females are expected to become infected within another decade.”

In fact, those numbers could be conservative.

“If we learn disease transmission is strongly tied to the amount of prions deer shed into their environment, and if that reservoir continues to build and worsen with the disease’s acceleration, our prevalence prediction would be optimistic,” Samuel said in an interview. “In a worst case, it might look like the 80 percent prevalence we saw on the Hall Farm.”

In contrast, if the Department of Natural Resources implemented a buck-focused management strategy and hunters carried it out, deer herds would soon have fewer adult bucks but lower disease rates. The study projects a buck-focused plan would soon start reducing the CWD rate and drop it into the 5 percent range in 30 to 40 years.

“We’ll probably never get rid of CWD, so the goal becomes how do we get it to a manageable level, one that doesn’t impact our deer herd; and how do we try to contain it so not every area becomes infected?” Samuel said. “If we don’t, the disease will grow worse and before long have impacts on the deer population.”

The research article put it this way: “The tradeoff between strategies is clear. CWD can eventually be reduced with fewer opportunities to harvest healthy bucks, or more adult bucks may be available for harvest but with higher rates of CWD infection.”

But “more adult bucks” is no certainty in that second scenario. Samuel said as CWD worsens, fewer bucks will reach older age classes, and hunters who managed properties for bigger bucks will start losing more of them to CWD.

“These are sobering options, but the sooner we act, the less severe the problems and choices we’ll face,” Samuel said. “If we don’t do anything, and just stick with what we’re now doing, we’ll lose more adult males because we’ll get such high infection rates. Most of those deer will probably get killed, one way or another.”

Jennelle, Samuel and their research team reached those conclusions after studying deer-harvest data from Wisconsin’s 2002 to 2013 hunting seasons, evaluating rates of CWD infection, and analyzing how alternative management plans would affect CWD and the herd.

The 12 years of data showed CWD infection rates are twice as high in males than females, and support the idea that CWD is a “frequency-dependent,” not a “density-dependent” disease. That means the rate at which deer become infected is driven by CWD prevalence in the herd, not the size of the herd.

Therefore, as prevalence rises, the rate and number of new infections also rise. Unlike many frequency-dependent diseases, however, CWD can probably be reduced because hunters could target CWD’s most likely carriers.

“Frequency-dependent diseases are typically hard to control with generalized removal strategies,” Samuel said. “If male and female deer had the same disease prevalence, the only way to reduce prevalence would be to selectively remove more infected animals than uninfected animals. We’d have to capture deer and test them, which would be very difficult and costly. Because we can easily distinguish bucks (by their antlers) from females, we’re lucky to have a management option.”

Samuel said the research reinforces his skepticism that evolution and natural selection is a viable management option. “The sooner we actually do something about CWD, the better off we’ll be,” he said. “We still don’t know how the disease spreads, but one likely way is by infected yearling bucks dispersing to new areas. The worse the disease prevalence, the higher the infection rate we’ll see in young bucks, and the more likely they’ll spread the disease.”

Samuel said CWD prevalence and its potential impacts were mostly ignored shortly after the disease was discovered in Wisconsin in November 2001. However, this new research also found that focusing hunting pressure on females to reduce deer densities won’t, by itself, reduce CWD prevalence either.

“Shooting more bucks to reduce prevalence is one key to managing this disease, but we still need to work on abundance to some extent,” Samuel said. “These things go hand in hand.”

Further, reducing buck numbers and the overall deer population in CWD areas would make vaccination a more practical possibility, should a vaccine ever become available.

“The lower the disease prevalence, the smaller the affected landscape, and the lower the deer population, the higher percentage of the herd you’d be able to treat,” Samuel said. “The better we can manage this disease now, the better we’d be able to manage it if we ever find that silver bullet.

Kinda shows how clueless the poster of post#39 really is i would say. This is just 1 of the many. So easy with some!

Edited April 2, 2014 by Four Season Whitetails

[WNYBuckHunter]

Thats the same study, just another article about it.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

but if you post it 12 times it means there is 12 times the importance

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Thats the same study, just another article about it.

Funny i see different peoples names on the ones that i read.  You can try and spin it any way you like. Facts are facts and i will be sure to post everything i read on this issue and we will see when and if the QDMA changes their stance.

 

That is if they dont implode.  I like what i am reading over there on their website. Seems person after person from s few different states thought it best to cancel their memberships for lack of caring for members and sportsmen's needs.

You do know what happens with each member lost membership right? 

[Culvercreek hunt club]

 

You do know what happens with each member lost membership right? 

 

Every organization will have disgruntled members and will drop their memberships, but since you are so fond of saying "facts are facts", the membership is at an all time high and growing. That is a fact.

[WNYBuckHunter]

Funny i see different peoples names on the ones that i read. You can try and spin it any way you like. Facts are facts and i will be sure to post everything i read on this issue and we will see when and if the QDMA changes their stance.

That is if they dont implode. I like what i am reading over there on their website. Seems person after person from s few different states thought it best to cancel their memberships for lack of caring for members and sportsmen's needs.

You do know what happens with each member lost membership right?

Why are you attacking me on this? Im just asking you for info. That article, written by different people, only references the same study. That doesnt make it a whole different study. Look, if you cant help me with info, just say so.

[WesternNY]

First off, less than 1% of QDMA members use the QDMA Forums..... people are upset because a few long time members and posters were trying to strong arm and threaten the QDMA if it did not change it's stance on the MDDI.  The MDDI is an aggressive confrontational group trying to change the Minnesota DNR via tactics the QDMA does not agree with.

 

MDDI is Minnesota Deer Density Initiative.

 

Four Seasons Whitetails is on record on these forums of saying he hopes CWD spreads to all of NY.  Maybe we should all take his quotes and links of that thread and go post them on Deer Farm Forums, or better yet, call the media and get a story in Print.   

[WesternNY]

Here is what the bright and witty Deer Farmer Four Seasons Whitetails aka Mike Kerry has said about the spread of CWD.

 

" I wish you the best on your new adventure and maybe we will get lucky and CWD will waltz across from Pa and help us all out."

 

 

But rest assured folks, deer farms pose no threat to the wild herd and this particular deer farmer gives back in the form of conservation.... how?

 

 

You can see the thread here

http://huntingny.com/forums/topic/21892-qdm-meeting-with-neighbors/

 

 

Edited April 2, 2014 by WesternNY

[Doewhacker]

"Jennelle, Samuel and their research team reached those conclusions after studying deer-harvest data from Wisconsin’s 2002 to 2013 hunting seasons, evaluating rates of CWD infection, and analyzing how alternative management plans would affect CWD and the herd"

 

Studying harvest numbers counts as science now? Yea I'd go with that.

 

http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/videonetwork/3414450242001?odyssey=mod|tvideo2|article

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Here is what the bright and witty Deer Farmer Four Seasons Whitetails aka Mike Kerry has said about the spread of CWD.

 

" I wish you the best on your new adventure and maybe we will get lucky and CWD will waltz across from Pa and help us all out."

 

 

But rest assured folks, deer farms pose no threat to the wild herd and this particular deer farmer gives back in the form of conservation.... how?

 

 

You can see the thread here

http://huntingny.com/forums/topic/21892-qdm-meeting-with-neighbors/

You bet ya. If you were half as smart about this cwd stuff as you play out to be, please.

 

1. Show us where CWD has had any impact on the wild herd numbers in any state.

2. Please explain how these states can have CWD for years and still kill record numbers of deer each year.

3 Please explain how this disease is killing the deer in the top 5 states in the record books.Mature deer!

4 Please explain the practice in Ny state of taking untested road killed deer out of known past CWD hot zones, pile them in a compost piles across the state and then have state worker put that compost in every flower bed up and down the Ny state thruway along with farmers spreading the free fertilizer across their farm fields.

 

That is just a start and should be interesting to see a reply.  If you did some research on CWD you would see that states that get CWD also get more numbers of deer and set records with top high scoring bucks.

 

CWD is still in NY state now but remember..In order to find something, you have to look for it.