Deer familiarity w/ Humans: An advantage to Hunters or no?

[Northcountryman]

When considering Deer behavior who reside in State parks and/or suburbia , where they continually make contact w/ humans as compared to their remote deep woods brethren, do you think one group is harder to hunt due to this difference?  

[suburbanfarmer]

I have access to a suburban spot and deer travel enough to know they are being hunted. Suburbia deer while lawn mowing dont even move 10 yards during summer. Come deer season the same deer high tail out at the site of a human just like any deer.

Edited December 12, 2023 by suburbanfarmer

[Enigma]

I agree with @suburbanfarmer. Hunting them is still a challenge, but I actually enjoy the suburbia challenge more. It's a different mindset and different tactics (bowhunting mostly), but it's fun to think outside the box and get creative. I spent a lot of time in my early hunting career hunting that way. Good times. 

 

[Enigma]

And there's usually some dinks running around here and there to try and fool. Not my house in the background but I've drank gin and tonics on that patio and killed deer off that lawn lol. Suburb of Philadelphia. 

Edited December 13, 2023 by Enigma

[Northcountryman]

18 hours ago, suburbanfarmer said:

I have access to a suburban spot and deer travel enough to know they are being hunted. Suburbia deer while lawn mowing dont even move 10 yards during summer. Come deer season the same deer high tail out at the site of a human just like any deer.

 

I agree; so, it depends more on OUR behavior when theyre around us than the fact that theyre around us and make contact w/ us, correct? I remember reading an article in D&DH where a hunter described his tactics for getting a wily farm buck; what he did, was, observe the deer for awhile before even trying to hunt him. Through his observations, he noted that the Buck was NEVER alarmed by the farmhands being around in the fields performing farm chores like mowing, baling, etc, despite the loud noises made from the equipment.  As a matter of fact, one of the hands would blast Spanish music really loud while riding on the tractor. The hunter, then, used this info and drove to his spot blasting spanish music , noting the deer were conditioned to that noise and didnt alarm them. Cant do the same thing, though, with a big woods deer , so, I guess theyre harder to hunt , overall?

[airedale]

The thing is a lot of suburban Deer hunting many times has some sort of weapons restrictions, much of the hunting in those areas are limited to archery only. I would say with limited cover they would be a bit easier to find.

Al

[Northcountryman]

20 hours ago, airedale said:

The thing is a lot of suburban Deer hunting many times has some sort of weapons restrictions, much of the hunting in those areas are limited to archery only. I would say with limited cover they would be a bit easier to find.

Al

And approach.

[Enigma]

Deer conditioned to human presence are not a lot different than forest deer with respect to this: When you get busted inside their comfort zone they all bug out and get harder to hunt.

If you get busted hunting farmland deer you can probably kill the same ones tomorrow 1/2 mile away on the same farm from a different stand. Get busted hunting city deer and you might be able to kill them them the next day 150 yds away sitting on a bucket behind a neighbor's shed. It's the same idea but the size of the playing field is different. And the tactics differ.

I find city deer more nocturnal. They move around all night guided by motion sensor lights and barking dogs. Seems to me they move later in the day, shrinking shooting time.

That being said the city bucks do the same thing as big woods bucks during the rut. Get stupid. Make mistakes, get hit by cars etc. Same for the late season. They both hit food sources and hunker down.

 

[Enigma]

Find the ladder stand lol.

 

[Northcountryman]

14 hours ago, Enigma said:

Deer conditioned to human presence are not a lot different than forest deer with respect to this: When you get busted inside their comfort zone they all bug out and get harder to hunt.

If you get busted hunting farmland deer you can probably kill the same ones tomorrow 1/2 mile away on the same farm from a different stand. Get busted hunting city deer and you might be able to kill them them the next day 150 yds away sitting on a bucket behind a neighbor's shed. It's the same idea but the size of the playing field is different. And the tactics differ.

I find city deer more nocturnal. They move around all night guided by motion sensor lights and barking dogs. Seems to me they move later in the day, shrinking shooting time.

That being said the city bucks do the same thing as big woods bucks during the rut. Get stupid. Make mistakes, get hit by cars etc. Same for the late season. They both hit food sources and hunker down.

 

 

Agree w/ everything you said,but, wouldnt you agree that suburban/ Park acclimated Deer are more comfortable around humans, as long as their behavior appears to them to be non-threatening, and wont be as easily be spooked as compared to an Adirondack Buck ? Granted, there are fewer and fewer "true" Big Woods Deer in todays world, but the few that remain, that have, truly, never laid eyes on a person in their lives, are gonna freak out if they do make contact with someone, arent they? In contrast, Deer that inhabit, maybe, a WMA or county park with alot of hikers are accustomed to people walking/biking, etc. , around and through their turf, probably ona daily basis, so, theyre not going to have the same reaction to observing "a person", right?

 

[SportsmanNH]

On 12/13/2023 at 12:19 PM, Northcountryman said:

I agree; so, it depends more on OUR behavior when theyre around us than the fact that theyre around us and make contact w/ us, correct? I remember reading an article in D&DH where a hunter described his tactics for getting a wily farm buck; what he did, was, observe the deer for awhile before even trying to hunt him. Through his observations, he noted that the Buck was NEVER alarmed by the farmhands being around in the fields performing farm chores like mowing, baling, etc, despite the loud noises made from the equipment.  As a matter of fact, one of the hands would blast Spanish music really loud while riding on the tractor. The hunter, then, used this info and drove to his spot blasting spanish music , noting the deer were conditioned to that noise and didnt alarm them. Cant do the same thing, though, with a big woods deer , so, I guess theyre harder to hunt , overall?

This is not about a deer , but about a woodchuck . Years ago a couple of my buddies loved hunting them in farm fields. There was this one smartass chuck that had his hole right next to a small island clump of trees in the field about 150 yards out . Of course they had to get out of the truck to shoot . My buddy missed the shot at this chuck . Every time afterwards when they drove down that farm road that chuck would run like hell back down into his hole before they could even get out of the truck . One thing to note is they always took my buddies old truck that had a louder exhaust on these hunts . After 7 or 8 times seeing that woodchuck run down his hole , he figured that chuck knew the sound of his truck meant danger. We thought he was nuts and that chuck probably runs scared now with any vehicle going down that farm road  The next time they tried they took his friends car instead . Sure enough , that freakin chuck met his match and just sat there and got blasted. LOL . We had so much fun making jokes at my buddy for years after that. Sent him anonymous birthday  and christmas cards with a woodchuck pic on it with different sayings like " Miss Me Yet ? " or " Did You Fix That Exhaust pipe Yet ? "  LOL  Critters do decipher different sounds and actions

[wolc123]

3 hours ago, Northcountryman said:

Agree w/ everything you said,but, wouldnt you agree that suburban/ Park acclimated Deer are more comfortable around humans, as long as their behavior appears to them to be non-threatening, and wont be as easily be spooked as compared to an Adirondack Buck ? Granted, there are fewer and fewer "true" Big Woods Deer in todays world, but the few that remain, that have, truly, never laid eyes on a person in their lives, are gonna freak out if they do make contact with someone, arent they? In contrast, Deer that inhabit, maybe, a WMA or county park with alot of hikers are accustomed to people walking/biking, etc. , around and through their turf, probably ona daily basis, so, theyre not going to have the same reaction to observing "a person", right?

 

This brings to mind an old alpha-doe that I killed about a dozen years ago, in a very remote area that was roughly 25 miles outside the NW corner of the Adirondack park.  She was probably between 4 and 6 years old, and very likely had never encountered another hunter.  
 

I was able to get into position, up on an oak ridge that was very far from any public road, about an hour before sunrise.  It was a short hike from a lakeside cabin that my in-laws used to rent for a couple long weekends each fall.  The seasonal road to that lake was treacherous on that end, and the long, winding driveway to the cabin, even more so.  

The year prior, I had been fishing the lakeshore below that ridge, with an onshore wind direction.  I heard deer snorts from up top, so I decided that I would check that spot out the following year, on opening morning of early ML season.  
 

The next year, I heard the sound of branches breaking, just as the sun was starting to rise.  The big doe was leading a group of (6) antlerless deer in my direction.  I was seated on a big flat rock, near some white oaks.  I could see that she was clearly the largest of the group, and that none on the “followers” had antlers.  
 

When she got up next to me, about 20 yards away, I settled my crosshairs behind her shoulder and pulled the trigger.     When the smoke cleared, I’ll never forget the look that she gave me.  It was like “what the heck just happened”.  It made me believe that she really had absolutely no clue what I was (I was in full camo with zero blaze orange required back then). 
 

All (6) deer stood there, frozen like statues, for what seemed an eternity.  After what might have been 20 seconds or so, her knees began to wobble, and she fell over sideways and away from me.  The ground there was very steep, almost a cliff, and she slid down.  
 

The other (5) deer began to wander around up top rather aimlessly, none following her down the cliff.  Clearly they had no clue what to do or where to go, having just lost their leader.  
 

They dispersed, after another minute or two, and I reloaded and butt-slid down to the doe. She had landed on the winding driveway to the cabin, which I did not even realize was down there.  She started to stand up and I put a second round into her neck to finish her.  I left the gut pile right there in the drive and went back for my father in laws atv to drag her back to the boathouse for hanging.

[Northcountryman]

The survivors definitely learned something from that encounter, though- didnt they!!

[wolc123]

3 hours ago, Northcountryman said:

The survivors definitely learned something from that encounter, though- didnt they!!

I suppose they may have.  That was the last time that I hunted that spot.  My in-laws used to rent that cabin every year, but they bought their current place (right on the edge of the ADK park), the following year.  
 

I had hunted that old spot about 10 years and that was the only deer that I ever got there.  The way the rental weekends worked out, about half of those hunts were opening weekend of early ML and the other half were opening weekend of gun.  
 

I never saw a buck while hunting there, but I did see a pair of 6-pointers run across, between the lake one cabin, on one weekend in late September.   I also had another close encounter with a big doe, during gun season, on the other side of the lake.  
 

A connected river looped around the back over on that side and I would take the rowboat over, and hike up the ridge over there.  No doe permits are given out up there, so I could only watch her.

Some day, I hope to get back to that spot.  It’s all pretty heavily posted, but my father in law is still good friends with owner of that cabin that we used to rent, so I could probably get permission to hunt it if I tried.  They don’t hunt it at all.  They only fish up there.  

After I retire, in about (7) years, I’d like to move up to that general area.  There’s enough ag around up there, so that the deer taste just as good as the ones from back here in WNY do.  The scenery is many times  better up there though, and there’s a lot less people around.  

 

[Enigma]

11 hours ago, Northcountryman said:

Agree w/ everything you said,but, wouldnt you agree that suburban/ Park acclimated Deer are more comfortable around humans, as long as their behavior appears to them to be non-threatening, and wont be as easily be spooked as compared to an Adirondack Buck ? Granted, there are fewer and fewer "true" Big Woods Deer in todays world, but the few that remain, that have, truly, never laid eyes on a person in their lives, are gonna freak out if they do make contact with someone, arent they? In contrast, Deer that inhabit, maybe, a WMA or county park with alot of hikers are accustomed to people walking/biking, etc. , around and through their turf, probably ona daily basis, so, theyre not going to have the same reaction to observing "a person", right?

 

Deer live in a variety of environments including some that live in very close proximity to humans. Their behavior and reactions to human interaction are going to vary. 

Yes, I agree, a big woods buck is going to react differently to a bad human experience when compared to a suburban deer. But it'd be a stretch for me to say that a big woods deer is going to now be more freaked out and spooked, now more elusive in some way, now a mental basket case that's somehow now unhuntable, after one bad human encounter. If that were the case deer trackers in the northern states would never be successful.

Edited December 16, 2023 by Enigma