State vs private land posting

[Vince1]

Found a great spot this weekend on public land.

Problem is the landowner adjacent to this spot, I believe ate up in the range of 300 yards into state land. used garmin gps and my phone and my buddies phone we walked the overgrown logging road that the DEC Map put out that clearly shows it is on state land.

wouldn’t walk through it normally as most of it is bedding.

My issue though is he cut off any easy access to the spot that I want to hunt. My buddy actually at first just said keep out of it so we walked around it. Till he pulled out his phone after we made it to where the map and his signs agreed and saw just how much state land the guy ate up.

I probably wouldn’t even step foot in there to hunt because land features would essentially funnel most deer to the other end

But it kinda pissed me off that someone would do that. So now if I shoot a deer back there and it goes unto that land, am I wrong for going to retrieve it?

At some point im gonna get down and knock on the guys door. Googled him and he is some kinda developer and actually owns a crap load of land in the area. maybe he recently purchased it from the dec or something and they haven’t updated the maps, who knows. But i did see dec signs within his borders

also called the ECO for the area, waiting to hear back from him

[Culvercreek hunt club]

also called the ECO for the area, waiting to hear back from him

Best course of action. State land is usually very well painted, marked and maintained I'm the areas I hunt. On the order of at least every two years. I would walk the state borders and you may find out that he either removed the markers or the road may have been shown incorrectly. Usually the boarder(the STATE's markers are pretty close and easy to follow.

[Core]

What does ate up mean exactly?

I have been hunting on land that borders private (I guess it all does!) and quadruple checking on my phone the land owner had generally posted right on the border but in one case down a path I wanted to use he had posted 50 yards into state land. I simply ignore the sign because it shouldn't be there and I know it is state.

Edited November 9, 2015 by Core

[Doc]

I would think the state would be interested in knowing that. Usually there is one of the DEC people at each region that is responsible for some of the parcels in that region. He is the guy you want to be talking to.

[Vince1]

What does ate up mean exactly?

I have been hunting on land that borders private (I guess it all does!) and quadruple checking on my phone the land owner had generally posted right on the border but in one case down a path I wanted to use he had posted 50 yards into state land. I simply ignore the sign because it shouldn't be there and I know it is state.

Ate up as in eaten or gobbled up i guess. Was sayin he posted into state land

Got in contact with eco and he said its a ranger issue. Still waitin on another call back.

Keeps botherin me because the guy has stands he built into both corners of the land that is to me clearly state land which overlooks a nice bedding area all blocked off to himself.

[Core]

Ate up as in eaten or gobbled up i guess. Was sayin he posted into state land

Got in contact with eco and he said its a ranger issue. Still waitin on another call back.

Keeps botherin me because the guy has stands he built into both corners of the land that is to me clearly state land which overlooks a nice bedding area all blocked off to himself.

If he only posted, it's not really blocked, though

 

This reminds me of dump trucks carrying gravel that have signs on the back saying things like stay back 100 yards not responsible for damage. Oh, yes you are, and you don't own the road 100 yards behind, either.

 

Maybe this is a plus. If he really owns the land adjacent chances are good he has scouted this and feels it's good stuff if he is putting stands there.

 

I've gone by a nice ladder stand a lot recently which is about 10' into state land with the only shooting opportunities on the private right next to it. I assume the stand was put there by the guy who owns the private land.

[Uptown Redneck]

If your confident that the land he posted is in fact state land then ignore his posted signs. If he challenges you show him your maps and then tell him he's free to call the authorizes on you and then continue on with your hunt ignoring him and his signs until someone with the proper authority to settle the issue arrives. A friend and I faced this same issue while fishing in Harriman State Park, when we challenged the lady who claimed we were trespassing she angrily walked away never to bother us again.

Edited November 10, 2015 by Uptown Redneck

[orion]

If your confident that the land he posted is in fact state land then ignore his posted signs. If he challenges you show him your maps and then tell him he's free to call the authorizes on you and then continue on with your hunt ignoring him and his signs until someone with the proper authority to settle the issue arrives. A friend and I faced this same issue while fishing in Harriman State Park, when we challenged the lady who claimed we were trespassing she angrily walked away never to bother us again.

 

You better be damn sure its public if you do this! Challenging a landowner on his own posted land seems like a sure way to get charges pressed against you.

 

Calling DEC much better way to go.

[Uptown Redneck]

You better be damn sure its public if you do this! Challenging a landowner on his own posted land seems like a sure way to get charges pressed against you.

 

Calling DEC much better way to go.

That's why I started off by saying "if you're confident".

[Vince1]

Yeah im sure. I printed out the maps i have with the google earth images of the tracks from my garmin where i walked his border and the states map border. In places its as wide as 300 yards.

Wasted my evenin hunt doin it.

After i hear back from the ranger who handles the area who hopefully can confirm what i think i will at least knock o. The guys door and leave my contact info if he aint there.

Last thing i want to do is get into an argument over it in the middle of the woods.

Just pisses me off cause i feel like it was done on purpose and i reaaaly wana hunt this spot. Tons of sign and an actice scrape line right outside the edge he marked off. Plus i pushed 3 deer at least

Walkin through his safe zone.

[Uptown Redneck]

If it indeed is shown by the ranger to be public land I don't think I would reach out to the landowner. If he knowingly tried to take over state land for his own use I don't think your talking to him will result in anything. Better to just do your own thing knowing that you legally have the right to be there. Just remember if it is state land he too has every right to hunt there and being he already has stands posted I'm sure he will be there hunting them. Either way, whether its state or private, it looks like you're probably better off looking for a different place to hunt cause either way this guy will most likely be hunting there. 

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Ate up as in eaten or gobbled up i guess. Was sayin he posted into state land

Got in contact with eco and he said its a ranger issue. Still waitin on another call back.

Keeps botherin me because the guy has stands he built into both corners of the land that is to me clearly state land which overlooks a nice bedding area all blocked off to himself.

you can't follow  the state markers and yellow painted blazes? Even if he took the signs down I doubt he removed the paint.

[BellR]

Don't rely on google earth's lines for where the state land lies.  I have seen quite a few problems with borders that I know the location of.  Check the borders on the state lands interactive mapper http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/45415.html .  It seems to have more accurate lines than google earth. 

 

Here is an example.  Google earth on the left, state lands mapper on the right.  The one on the right is where the actual state land lines lie.  Shows you just how much it can be off in google earth.

Edited November 10, 2015 by BellR

[Doc]

I have seen so much creative land posting over the years. Some of it looks like the guy just wandered through the woods nailing signs anyplace he found a good tree. Some people don't seem to grasp the concept .... lol.

[Core]

If it indeed is shown by the ranger to be public land I don't think I would reach out to the landowner. If he knowingly tried to take over state land for his own use I don't think your talking to him will result in anything. Better to just do your own thing knowing that you legally have the right to be there. Just remember if it is state land he too has every right to hunt there and being he already has stands posted I'm sure he will be there hunting them. Either way, whether its state or private, it looks like you're probably better off looking for a different place to hunt cause either way this guy will most likely be hunting there. 

Agree 100% and there is a small ulterior motive to it as well. If you know this is legal land and the posted signs claim differently you are legally protected, but you may benefit from the same signs scaring other people off who haven't done their home work, and that means less competition for you At that point you've done your due diligence, let DEC deal with it or not deal with it.

 

BellR is right if you want to check three sources all of which may be slightly different use these:

 

1) maps.google.com

2) NY DEC interactive mapper

3) Google earth

 

Once you have google earth, download the KMZ file from NY Dec site for NY DEC land, and you then load it into google earth. It will give a slightly different result than google maps.

[jmg343]

Since I have already demonstrated my lack of knowledge when it comes to laws, rules, and regulations, let me ask another "stupid" question.  I will preface said question by saying that I do not, have not, and have no intention of ever huunting state land. 

 

If a hunter leaves a ladder stand, lock-on, etc. on a tree on state land, can anyone come along and hunt out of it when it is vacant?  I would imagine that it may be against regulations to leave a stand "permanently" affixed to a tree on a state land?  Again, I dont know.  Just curious.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Since I have already demonstrated my lack of knowledge when it comes to laws, rules, and regulations, let me ask another "stupid" question.  I will preface said question by saying that I do not, have not, and have no intention of ever huunting state land. 

 

If a hunter leaves a ladder stand, lock-on, etc. on a tree on state land, can anyone come along and hunt out of it when it is vacant?  I would imagine that it may be against regulations to leave a stand "permanently" affixed to a tree on a state land?  Again, I dont know.  Just curious.

in general (specific lands may have more strict rules) you can leave a stand on state land as long as no trimming and not attachment to the trees that damage (screw in steps) there is required information that needs to be on it and that is covered in the regulations. As far as someone getting in it, I can't see anything that would stop them, just like could happen on private land. I would bet that about any guy in it would get out if you showed up but that about screws up a hunt.

[Five Seasons]

If your confident that the land he posted is in fact state land then ignore his posted signs. If he challenges you show him your maps and then tell him he's free to call the authorizes on you and then continue on with your hunt ignoring him and his signs until someone with the proper authority to settle the issue arrives. A friend and I faced this same issue while fishing in Harriman State Park, when we challenged the lady who claimed we were trespassing she angrily walked away never to bother us again.

 

very bad advice. using a phone and gps still doesn't mean your property info is the latest. He very well could have just purchased that chunk. But of course, there's a good chance he's trying to pull a fast one too.

 

So,

 

To the OP, stick with your original goal of getting clarification from the ranger.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Belo

[wdswtr]

I will say this much, I have a piece that borders state land, In the process of posting the line there was one spot where there was no good tree to put a sign on.  Yet there was one decent one about 2 feet on the state land side.  It took less than a year for a knock on the door and LEO asking me to move it back a couple feet.  He was very cordial about it.  I thought it was not a big deal however the state apparently didnt think so.   I also have yet to never see an easily and heavily marked state boundary line.  Yellow paint where they bark has been removed, state land signs and metal corner post.  They are easy to find.

Edited November 11, 2015 by wdswtr

[Core]

Since I have already demonstrated my lack of knowledge when it comes to laws, rules, and regulations, let me ask another "stupid" question.  I will preface said question by saying that I do not, have not, and have no intention of ever huunting state land. 

 

If a hunter leaves a ladder stand, lock-on, etc. on a tree on state land, can anyone come along and hunt out of it when it is vacant?  I would imagine that it may be against regulations to leave a stand "permanently" affixed to a tree on a state land?  Again, I dont know.  Just curious.

I've seen a bunch of stands on NY DEC land. Some were locked. I'm not sure what the official rules are on this kind of state land, and I have looked. I would say leave it if you want to and are okay with it being potentially stolen. I've seen a bunch of stands including nice ones on DEC land.

 

As far as using it when nobody is there, I've read a bunch of opinions on this. Some say it's an atrocious question, others say hey you cannot reserve a particular tree on public land, so if I want to use it I will. Another question is safety, how old is it really, do you trust what a stranger put up?

 

I can't find the link now because I forgot the name of the land, but near NY City there is something else like NY DEP or something? Anyway, they own land and on their website they specifically say first come first serve and people are allowed to use your stand if you leave it there.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Core

[Elmo]

It's just common respect to other hunters.  I see people leave stands in public land all the time and I leave their stand alone.  If they're not there, I may hunt the spot but I certainly don't use or touch their stand.  I certainly hope other hunters do the same if I ever leave a stand in public land.  For DEP land, you can leave your stand but you have to remove it at the end of the season.  They give you a grace period after the season is over to remove it then they go in and remove it for you.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Found a great spot this weekend on public land.

Problem is the landowner adjacent to this spot, I believe ate up in the range of 300 yards into state land. used garmin gps and my phone and my buddies phone we walked the overgrown logging road that the DEC Map put out that clearly shows it is on state land.

wouldn’t walk through it normally as most of it is bedding.

My issue though is he cut off any easy access to the spot that I want to hunt. My buddy actually at first just said keep out of it so we walked around it. Till he pulled out his phone after we made it to where the map and his signs agreed and saw just how much state land the guy ate up.

I probably wouldn’t even step foot in there to hunt because land features would essentially funnel most deer to the other end

But it kinda pissed me off that someone would do that. So now if I shoot a deer back there and it goes unto that land, am I wrong for going to retrieve it?

At some point im gonna get down and knock on the guys door. Googled him and he is some kinda developer and actually owns a crap load of land in the area. maybe he recently purchased it from the dec or something and they haven’t updated the maps, who knows. But i did see dec signs within his borders

also called the ECO for the area, waiting to hear back from him

Vince. It has been brought up a couple times in this thread in response to your situation and you haven't responded. Did you follow the State land markers and painted blazes or are you solely relying on the internet maps and such?

[Vince1]

Vince. It has been brought up a couple times in this thread in response to your situation and you haven't responded. Did you follow the State land markers and painted blazes or are you solely relying on the internet maps and such?

Internet maps. Not many markers there. The ones that are there i found within his border.

Ranger got back to me today. Nice guy and was very helpful. Turns out they never surveyed it and this property aint high on the states improvemnt list recent small land aquisition or somethin.

He said he walked it earlier in the year and its prolly new signs. Which im pretty sure they are. He gave me a rough area along a contour line whre the boundary exists and said he would walk it again in a week or to.

Just gonna write a letter and go talk to the guy if i can. At least ask if i can retrieve from his land. Better to avoid conflict if i can.

But from the rough estimate he gave me over the phone the guy is way over in some spots. Iffy in others.

[Culvercreek hunt club]

.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Culvercreek hunt club