Is knockdown power a myth ?

[phantom]

Is knockdown power a myth ? 

[Gobbler Chaser]

When considering a 400gr arrow moving at 280fps with only a couple hundred ft lbs of force can kill just about any mammal it just might be. But if you have a large mean African mammal charging you then yes knockdown and mucho ft lbs might be something you might want. Same as handgun defense ammo and bullet weight needed to stop an attacker charging you with say a knife. 240 grns of .45 acp is something to be desired in a situation like that I'd bet

[ncountry]

It is interesting how different bullets out of the same gun, or different distances changes how it affects the deer.

Or the difference between a gun and and an arrow.

We did the experiment once of shooting a milk jug full of sand. .308 bullet just kind of thumped into it and you could pour it out. An arrow equipped with a muzzy broadhead blasted right through...

I am a big advocate of a lighter bullet for a given cartridge being more effective at "knocking " down game.   For example. I don't believe I've shot a single deer with my 300 win mag with 150(except for 1 . I gut shot and it died within sight) grain bullets that took a step afterwards. I have a friend that swears by 180 grain or larger bullets in the same gun. His all run. Not very far but they rum, and occasionally have to track.

I always pick on him. He'll say "I want a pass through and  good blood trail " 

Me I just like to walk over to where I shot it ..lol

[chrisw]

Forget "knockdown power." To knock down an animal you need massive tissue damage, or a disruption of the CNS or skeletal system. I've seen deer shot with a ton of different rifle calibers and they don't knock them straight over without a CNS or skeletal hit. There are a million variables though, if you shoot a 60lb fawn with a high energy/velocity round it may drop instantly with a lung hit, it may not. My buddy used to use a 300 WM and his deer went as far as my 25 caliber. Deer are easy to kill, no need to shoot a cannon. I never aim to drop them instantly, too much meat damage for me. Pop them in the lungs with a 120gr 25 caliber projectile and walk the 30-50 yds to them. I see no point in getting a ridiculous amount of energy just to dump it into a tree or the dirt behind the deer after it passes through. My .02.

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[phantom]

Delete double post

Edited August 25, 2021 by phantom

[G-Man]

1 minute ago, chrisw said:

Forget "knockdown power." To knock down an animal you need massive tissue damage, or a disruption of the CNS or skeletal system. I've seen deer shot with a ton of different rifle calibers and they don't knock them straight over without a CNS or skeletal hit. There are a million variables though, if you shoot a 60lb fawn with a high energy/velocity round it may drop instantly with a lung hit, it may not. My buddy used to use a 300 WM and his deer went as far as my 25 caliber. Deer are easy to kill, no need to shoot a cannon. I never aim to drop them instantly, too much meat damage for me. Pop them in the lungs with a 120gr 25 caliber projectile and walk the 30-50 yds to them. I see no point in getting a ridiculous amount of energy just to dump it into a tree or the dirt behind the deer after it passes through. My .02.

Sent from my moto g fast using Tapatalk
 

Pop the lungs and you have a dead animal with minimal damage. My butcher hates doing gun deer and will not be doing any this year, exactly for the amount of time he has to clean up blood shot meat , bow killed are much easier and nearly 0 loss of meat. Sick of complaints of I should of got more meat back..when he tells them well you destroyed a loin and a ham and a shoulder taking that frontal shot... here is the bullet I pulled out of its hip.....

[phantom]

3 minutes ago, phantom said:

I think the difference is wound channel  .  You put a bigger bullet with more power behind it its going to make a bigger hole more tissue damage some smaller   bullets can do it with speed to that's why they test them in ballistics gel . Some smaller bullets that shoot faster can do a lot of tissue damage also so it depends .  But all around bigger and faster is always best if you can shoot it good that is .  if you shoot a little off your bullet has more chance to hit the vitals with more powerful calibers .  but its not knocking anything heavy over .  Only spine shot does that .

 

[Culvercreek hunt club]

4 hours ago, Gobbler Chaser said:

When considering a 400gr arrow moving at 280fps with only a couple hundred ft lbs of force can kill just about any mammal it just might be. 

apples and oranges really. An arrow and an bullet kill very differently. An arrow by penetration and bleeding, a bullet by energy transfer and disruption of body function.