Why not Blaze Orange?

[Mr VJP]

Sorry, Not in NJ.  Blaze Camo is not considered legal.  It used to be, but they changed that too!

:

Are you sure?

According to the wardens that gave my buddy a ticket last year, it's not legal.  The book appears to say it is, but he was ticketed, fought the ticket, and lost in court.  So am I sure, no.  Are the wardens sure, no.  To me that means it isn't legal.

[fasteddie]

I started deer hunting in 1965 . Since then , I have only met one DEC Officer while hunting and that was about 1966 . Joisey must have a lot more officers than we have . The only time I see any DEC guy now is when we have the Sportsmen's Dinners in the spring .

[wztirem]

Ed, I hunt State Land,predominantly in Putnan County and the DEC officers are very proactive.

[wztirem]

Sorry, Not in NJ.  Blaze Camo is not considered legal.  It used to be, but they changed that too!

:

Are you sure?

According to the wardens that gave my buddy a ticket last year, it's not legal.  The book appears to say it is, but he was ticketed, fought the ticket, and lost in court.  So am I sure, no.  Are the wardens sure, no.  To me that means it isn't legal.

Hanging Judge!

[Mr VJP]

That's why I so against any law making it mandatory to wear B/O.  Once they have a law to work with they will screw with you as much as they can.

[Doc]

Well Doc , you didn't let me down !  :  When I typed in my post , I knew you'd have something to say !  ???

I wear a helmet when I go biking or ride the ATV -- I don't need someone to tell me I have to .....

I wear a harness or I don't go in a stand , I don't need someone to tell me I have to .....

I wear a seatbelt when driving , sitting in the passenger seat or back seat ...I don't need someone to tell me I have to .....

I don't talk on a phone when I am driving , I don't need someone to tell me I have to .....

I wear Blaze Orange when I hunt , I don't need someone to tell me I have to .....

Making a law to make the wearing of Blaze Orange Mandatory is just another law that won't be enforced !  ( just like drivers talking on cell phones not being pulled over and ticketed ) .

Understand that all these things that you do are good things but not practiced by everyone in the woods. I have personally seen at least three people dressed in full camo (including face paint) on a very heavily pressured piece of state land, on opening day. I never saw two of them until they waved. So I know that people are out there tempting fate. Further, the records shown in the links that I posted on the other thread show that deer hunting accidents involving camoflaged hunters are actually quite frequent. So it is not like there is nobody that doesn't follow common sense like you do.

So the question is do we feel that in matters of safety, we should just take care of ourselves and the heck with those that want to play games with their lives. As I stated before, if their lives were truly the only ones affected,  a cynical person might say they get what they deserve, good for them. I guess I'm not built that way, and also I  do understand that they are not the only victims, as I have already explained. I think that the damage that they do to their families and the potential taxpayer impacts due to their stubborness does create additional innocent victims. I also believe that this kind of collateral damage should not be acceptable.

It's pretty easy to turn our backs on hard headed people who for whatever reason are not capable of taking responsible actions or making responsible decisions when it comes to safety, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's the right thing to do. Sometimes you have to think of the "secondary victims" and try to offer them some protections as well.

I realize that not everyone agrees with all that, but that is my honest opinion, and it is the prime driver behind my support of a blaze orange law.

Doc

[Mr VJP]

Fewer laws, more freedom.  Smaller government, less taxes.

[Doc]

For those that are unaware of the significance of the problem of hunters not wearing B/O, I found the following:

Data collected for NYS between 1989 and 1995

Reason for accident: Mistaken for game

5% wore B/O    94% did not    1% unknown

Reason for accident: Out of sight

37% wore B/O  58% did not    5% unknown

Reason for accident: In Line of Fire

30% wore B/O  62% did not    8% unknown

Reason for accident: Unintentional Discharge

28% wore B/O  69%  did not    3% unknown

Reason for accident: Struck by Rcochet

35% wore B/O  62% did not    3% unknown

Reason for accident: Other/Unknown

44% wore B/O  66% did not    0% unknown

Total of all reasons

24% wore B/O  73% did not    3% unknown

Is blaze orange a cure-all? ...... Obviously no. Does it prevent many accidents? ....... The numbers say yes.

Source: http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00044112.htm

Doc

[bubba]

Want to know who is pushing bo the most in NY State according to the ECO at my class yesterday?  According to the DEC, the biggest lobbyist are clothing manufacturers.  Just so the high and mighty's do not freak oit, this was a discussion after class and the students had left.  Look it up the DEC is actually against BO laws.  But again I realize I am stupid and my opinion does not matter to the higher ups here, but I will offer them regardless. If you are so much for BO, move to a state where it is mandatory, which are all states that have higher accident rates than NY.  The reason we have lower rates is the hunter education and training.  That is the proven effective solution in NY State, and the stance of the DEC.

[Doc]

Want to know who is pushing bo the most in NY State according to the ECO at my class yesterday?  According to the DEC, the biggest lobbyist are clothing manufacturers.  Just so the high and mighty's do not freak oit, this was a discussion after class and the students had left.  Look it up the DEC is actually against BO laws.  But again I realize I am stupid and my opinion does not matter to the higher ups here, but I will offer them regardless. If you are so much for BO, move to a state where it is mandatory, which are all states that have higher accident rates than NY.  The reason we have lower rates is the hunter education and training.  That is the proven effective solution in NY State, and the stance of the DEC.

Your over here raving too???? Look, over at the right of your screen there is a thing called a scroll bar. Use your left mouse button and move it up just about two replies and you will find a chart that should make you understand the importance of blaze orange during gun seasons. I can't make it any easier for you ..... I really can't. Now assuming you can read english and understand what percent signs mean, the message should be pretty clear, even to you.

As far as the clothing manufacturer's comment, that is so ridiculous that it doesn't even deserve a comment.

Doc

[bubba]

but yet you did comment. hmmm The funny part i you never respond to any questions just spew foolishness. Again I will ask why does NY have a better accident record than states that have mandatory blaze orange laws. You ridea of importance may no tbe the same s others.  Oh I will be sure to mention to my eco friend how you think his statements were ridiculous. Let me know your address so he or a colleague can stop by and explain it to you there Mr. Know it all. I beg you to do so. I know you wont because you are a typical internet wannabe. Shoot your mouth off behind a screen, but face to face you would not say boo. The net is full of guys like you. I am starting to think you are taking a liking to me and not in a natural way. You follow me around making comments about everything I talk about. Sorry I am straight and married, so look elsewhere ok.

[nyslowhand]

I really want to comment on egos, opinions and "battle of the wits", but this is about BO.

[bubba]

no it is a one sided argument about BO. Anyone opposing it is stupid. Just look back and read

[nyslowhand]

I did read all the responses before I commented, always do!

I've also read a lot of other topics where the discussions get pretty heated.

Certain members always seem to be in the midst of these battles.

Not always, but in general with no specific individual(s) being singled out.

My take is - everyone is entitled to their opinion, short of battling over whose is correct.

There is no right or wrong with an opinion, it's merely a person feelings about a subject.

Solid, fundamental opinions are fact based as opposed to weak ones that are based on hearsay.

99.9% of the time you'll never change another person's opinion.

Opinions are great, it's what makes us all different and perfect grounds for discussions.

Back to Blaze Orange, please!!

[WNYBuckHunter]

Do we really need 2 threads on the EXACT same subject?

[Doc]

I really want to comment on egos, opinions and "battle of the wits", but this is about BO.

No, you're right. This has gone too far, and is now bordering on silly. I guess I have said everything I can on the subject. I have even re-typed data and provided links to information, and it is obvious that at least one here is simply entrenched in his opinion and totally uneffected by any of that. When a guy refuses to scroll up and read actual facts, discussion of any sort with him is crazy. So I guess this has gone far enough for me.

I can only say that I am completely behind any kind of mandatory B/O law and will try to convince anyone who will actually listen. It's more than just an opinion with me. It's something I firmly believe would save lives and limbs and the data cited backs that up. That is the one reason I have stuck with the subject for this long. But the time has come to recognize that nothing is being accomplished here and it's time to move on.

Doc

[nyslowhand]

Do we really need 2 threads on the EXACT same subject?

This topic did take a detour from what the originator was asking!