Culvercreek hunt club

While many hunters favor mandatory ARs, DEC does not see a compelling biological need to alter buck age structures through regulation or legislation (Appendix 3). But they are doing it anyway...lol I think they did a piss poor job in expaining how parts of their plan were going to work.....Typical politician bull$hit....go off half cocked and they didn't do their homework. Take the special season tag fiasco. No one knew how they were going to pull it off....hell they said they didn't...now they pull it back? How about this.....do your homework....put together a thought out plan and DETAIL it. then at least we can understand it. Bottom line....if hunters don't understand what you are doing they will think you are up to something and not trust it....and not support it. (wonder why we feel like that)

very nice job Fantail.

I have had it happen a couple times. I took one of them. It is a social event for does. They have a desire to see who the dominant buck is. That is the one they want to be breed by. Kinda like college girls and a bar room brawl...lol

Geno....did u try a grunt?

Had 8a does come through at first light..three groups...just had a 12"spread six point come on same trail. Standing at 50 yards. Pretty good NZ opener

http://www.google.com/imgres?q=ruffed+grouse+scat&um=1&hl=en&sa=X&biw=1275&bih=654&tbm=isch&tbnid=UE1X_mKNg3HnTM:&imgrefurl=http://natureofthehills.wordpress.com/2010/09/05/ruffed-grouse/&docid=tNZ2NmXE0nZ0UM&imgurl=http://natureofthehills.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/dscf0544.jpg&w=800&h=600&ei=bJahToq9GOLv0gGbwNmBBQ&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=203&sig=106806168214886211433&page=1&tbnh=151&tbnw=201&start=0&ndsp=16&ved=1t:429,r:11,s:0&tx=118&ty=93

sounds like set up issues NYslowhand. My Bowtech was a great bow. I have had Bear....Proline....Bowtech and now in a Hoyt Element.....Comfort is the key to the choice you make....shoot a lot of bows. If you go into a proshop and they are hesitent to work with you to let you shoot everything in site...go somewhere else....if that is the service when you want to buy imagine how bad it will be after the money has changed hands. A shop in Henrittta lost a sale for just that reason with me. I am betting you could do very well on price after the season.

In terms of season year, not license year, a lucky few in the NZ could take one on last years license if it wasn't filled.

One buck with regular season one buck with the either sex tag for bow OR ML if you get both bow AND ML tags (or supersportsman) the second tag you get is antlerless only. (no buck) But...technically you can fill every tag you have and never shoot a buck since the regular season tag is valid in the late bow/ML and can be used for either sex....in appropriate areas. WNY is right though---there are special regional regulations

I actually took part in an experiment in college. It tested reaction time and mental awareness while drinking. Timed reactions and memory tests...base line before and after each drink....males, females, large frame to tiny gals. As you might expect the smaller body sizes were effected sooner and there were differences in the same sized folks. I can't remember for sure but I think it was serving size consumed at 20 minute intervals. I had drops after the second interval and I can handle my drinking pretty well. Was I legally impaired...nope....but there was measurable differences. I was in college....so couldn't pass up free booze...lol

It is done all the time....do we as a society tell people that can not be intoxicated in public...be intoxicated and get behind a wheel?...rights and freedoms are not boundless. I am all for the right to bare arms....but do I want every one walking into my daughters school with a 6 shooter strapped on their hip?....nope. Do I think it would be ok to show up for a defensive driving course and they serve schotch as refreshment...probably not.

Well let me chime in on what I see. folks aren't making what they were in income......BUT....they aren't hurting that much either. I have been trying to recall folks back to work and they are refusing because the unemployment has that 99 week limit. They are doing side work (under the table) and pulling in about what their checks were while working full time. So what is their incentive to go back to work. We are still having a hard time finding qualified people in the market that are off work. Most of the resumes I get are from people that were hired to fill a position in the boom at more than they are worth....and they have that previous wage in their heads and won't except any less.....and they don't have to becasue of what I stated before. They aren't hungry...there are so many safety nets in place that they can sit....just like they are with the land prices. Bail out here....bail out there....That is the difference between now and the great depression. There were none of those safety nets in place then.....people truely were hungry....soup lines...losing their houses....that is what cause the land prices to fall. People needed money to feed and house their families. It isn't there....yet

I knew this would go here on this thread......every one does...lol....25-06......no....30-06...no get a 270.....308-7mm-08...243..... well back to what I posted before. All good rounds..know why?. They are the same base cartridge .....30-06 & .308. Majority of what deer and black bear hinters are using today are them. What is the difference?....some trajectory differences based on bullet weights. But what and where will you be hunting?. For instance the 270average and the 06 both offer 150 grain....the 270 goes lower but not as high as the 06. My 06 has taken everything from chucks to moose and there are many of the same taken with the 270 as well. Research and choice...you wont go wrong with any round off these two workhorses

Hey Dom....think you misread the original post.....it was cold feet hinting......not cold feet watching the football game on TV...lol....stocking feet and lap blankets.....suddenly I have visions of Grandma

Do your homework before the gun shows. There are deals there but also a lot that are overpriced from what you can get retail elsewhere. I am a Remington fan. I am also a fan of the. 30-06. Any gun shop you go into will have 06 ammo. I don't care if you are in NYC or east bygosh Alaska. Light loads or heavy...and with the new managed recoil ammo they can be a pleasure to shoot. Both the 308new and 06the have a variety of mil surplus ammo you can get to plink with and with the bolt actions you are looking at corrosive ammo isn't that bad to clean up after. For the average hunter out there in the NE I don't think any make will be a problem for you in the bolt guns....set a budget....decide on a caliber and then go by feel.....and buy some decent glass....and GOOD mounts...and then enjoy it and don't loom back...good luck

I know some of you guys have had luck.....but I was taught "cotton kills". . I use a wicking sock and gonna sound funny but in a pinch a lady's knee high nylon...(hey broadway Joe did it...lol)...then I go with the new smart wool socks....I have three different thicknesses....on the very cold days I use the whole foot warmers that are like a dr scholl's insert. For my boots it is irishsetter elk hunters1000gram.....or when cold a 1200dr gram insulated rubber boot......most important thing is you must have room in the boots....tight boots (stuffing extra socks in your normal fitted boots) will restrict circulation.

Welllll....our rights are not guaranteed when abused. If you are convicted and in the slammer you lose the right to vote. You can also lose your right to own and use a firearm if you are a convicted felon. You know....I am ok with these. With rights come responsibilities if you abuse them you should lose them. If you are involved in a firearms accident and are under the influence there should be punishment...just like getting behind the wheel drunk. I didn't view his comments as antigen.......I viewed them as common sense. There is a difference between drinking and impaired.

I am betting it would ne easier for you to come up with schematics for a cruise missle than the basis they use. The more I see in the decisions our DEC makes the more I believe they are based in politics and not sound biology. They at the least are a reactive bunch. I would love to see a program put in place after all factors are weighed....factors for the good of the animals and good of our sport. Now before anyone starts with the comments about the other recreations in our state....I say let them pony up the money we do and then they can have a voice. As far as the carrying capacity of land....I would google Michigan....new York would have to go along way to catch ip to the herd research done there. I think I remember reading some studies on this and I am pretty sure it was Michigan.

And think of the pressure it will add to the surrounding areas that have foe tags and allow their take with bow and ml. Those blocks of state land will see a big increase in pressure

They can do it just like they do the doe permits now.....before the seasonwhen they issue the list for available doepermit areas.....the list the areas not open for bow and ml doe take. There are areas no that don't allow doe take with them.....exactly the reason I held off buying that lifetime. How would you like to be a guy that owns property in an area they close....I understand the need but midstream rule changes are hard to swallow

O anticipate it would be like it is now. The nuisance and landowner permits get first priority....then if they want they can do doe permits to general hunting public and bow ml users

it is only in effect through the 2011-2012 season right? so they could implement it for next bow season wich would be the 2012-2013 season

Annually suspend antlerless harvest during the bowhunting and muzzleloading seasons in WMUs where no DMPs are available by decision of the Department (excludes Adirondack and Tug Hill units). Where deer populations are above desired levels and DMP quotas may exceed applicant base, initiate a progressive and adaptive approach to increase antlerless harvest by: (Phase 1) expanding the use of Bonus DMPs; (Phase 2) making a portion of the early bowhunting season and late muzzleloading season valid only for antlerless deer; and (Phase 3) implementing a special antlerless-only season for muzzleloader hunters in these areas. So if you are hunting an area where they are at or below their population goal you will not be able to harvest a doe with your Bow or ML. Gonna have to burn some gas to go where you can or sit and watch the does walk by. sonce many of the low issue areas seem to be in the catskill regions and those are the ones with AR.....I would spend any money on new archery gear or new ML guys.

I totally don'[t get that from the plan. They go into detail saying it has little value. DEC does not consider there to be a compelling biological or management need for mandatory antler restrictions and evidence from the pilot antler restriction program suggests no changes in participation that would provide economic benefit for communities in an area with mandatory antler restrictions. However, DEC recognizes that interest in mandatory antler restrictions is strong among some segments of hunters and in some regional areas. Thus, this 5-year plan calls for continuing mandatory antler restrictions in the existing pilot area, and expanding mandatory antler restrictions in seven wildlife management units adjacent to the existing antler restriction area beginning with the 2012 hunting Whether it’s in support of mandatory buck harvest restrictions, or the right to choose whatever buck they want, New York deer hunters have strong feelings about the way they would like to see bucks managed in the state. Therefore, DEC believes that efforts to alter buck age structure should generally remain voluntary and not be mandated by regulation or legislation.

Sorry the Reder's Digest clips ar enot formatted correctly. The page was acting up. This may wet your appetite to read the entire proposal.....some of the changes I saw so far....bout time for some of the boys to lead an armed revolt...lol will not initiate a process to discontinue use of either-sex and antlerless only bow and muzzleloader tags in all Wildlife Management Units, but DEC will continue to explore alternative tag structures; antlerless harvest with bow and muzzleloader tags will be suspended in WMUs where no Deer Management Permits are available by decision of the DEC this plan proposes to temporarily discontinue antlerless harvest by bow and muzzleloader hunters during years when DMPs will not be issued. Begin the Southern Zone bowhunting season and the regular season in Westchester County on October 1 each year; allow bowhunting during the late muzzleloading season in the Northern Zone in areas where the late season is open; and set the Northern Zone regular season to run for 44 days beginning the 4th Saturday in October. And for some SZ areas-- clarified that a special antlerless-only season for muzzleloader hunters will only occur as the 3 rd phase of a multi-phase process, and only in WMUs where additional doe harvest is needed. The timing of such a season is no longer specified in the plan and will be determined as needed.. Does anyone know what this means?...sounds like to many damn lawyers in the DEC----------- broadened strategy for use of objective criteria to determine and evaluate optimal mechanisms for reducing harvest of yearling bucks, including mandatory antler restrictions. sounds like more hand holding for PETA and a waste of tax money-- clarified context appropriate for fertility control research in New York. Annually suspend antlerless harvest during the bowhunting and muzzleloading seasons in WMUs where no DMPs are available by decision of the Department (excludes Adirondack and Tug Hill units). Where deer populations are above desired levels and DMP quotas may exceed applicant base, initiate a progressive and adaptive approach to increase antlerless harvest by: (Phase 1) expanding the use of Bonus DMPs; (Phase 2) making a portion of the early bowhunting season and late muzzleloading season valid only for antlerless deer; and (Phase 3) implementing a special antlerless-only season for muzzleloader hunters in these areas. Strategy 3.2.2: Liberalize harvest of antlerless deer in Deer Management Focus Areas by expanding bag limits of antlerless deer, extending hunting seasons, and/or incorporating post-season hunts................................... Consideration was given to shortening the regular season in the Northern Zone and/or Southern Zone. However, this was overwhelmingly considered to be a bad idea by both Northern and Southern Zone hunters DEC believes that beginning the regular season on a Saturday continues to be an important strategy to provide opportunity for school-aged hunters and small-business owners to participate. DEC does not see significant need to alter the Southern Zone regular season timing for management or social purposes. Additionally, when asked to identify which aspect of buck hunting is most important, 50% of hunters indicated that "having the freedom to choose which buck I shoot" is most important, No significant change in breeding success or timing is expected from reducing harvest of yearling bucks. Similarly, antler restrictions have not significantly changed the timing or success of deer breeding in Pennsylvania Increased number of ≥2.5 year old bucks may reduce breeding activity of some yearling bucks, potentially affording these yearlings additional time to feed and store fat for winter. However, the extent of which increased presence of older bucks may reduce energy expenditure of yearling bucks during the rut and subsequently increase survival of these yearlings through winter is unknown. (I call this the getting your A$$ kicked factor...LOL) Increased number of ≥2.5 year old bucks may increase the amount of buck sign such as rubs and scrapes. While this may impact hunter satisfaction, social factors of deer are not expected to noticeably impact the timing of deer breeding in northern portions of deer range (Miller et al. 1995) such as New York. Whether it’s in support of mandatory buck harvest restrictions, or the right to choose whatever buck they want, New York deer hunters have strong feelings about the way they would like to see bucks managed in the state. Therefore, DEC believes that efforts to alter buck age structure should generally remain voluntary and not be mandated by regulation or legislation. DEC does not consider there to be a compelling biological or management need for mandatory antler restrictions and evidence from the pilot antler restriction program suggests no changes in participation that would provide economic benefit for communities in an area with mandatory antler restrictions. However, DEC recognizes that interest in mandatory antler restrictions is strong among some segments of hunters and in some regional areas. Thus, this 5-year plan calls for continuing mandatory antler restrictions in the existing pilot area, and expanding mandatory antler restrictions in seven wildlife management units adjacent to the existing antler restriction area beginning with the 2012 hunting DEC supports the use of crossbows during any hunting season in which other bowhunting equipment is allowed and recommends that eligibility to hunt with a crossbow be the same as eligibility to hunt with a vertical bow. DEC recommends that the setback distance for discharge of bowhunting equipment (longbows and crossbows) be reduced from 500 feet to 150 feet. DEC supports an increase of the penalties for the illegal taking of deer and efforts to enhance law enforcement capabilities.