wolc123

Did the butt-out work ok on the bb ? The first failure that I experienced with mine happened when I tried it on one that my buddy killed on opening day morning of gun season in 2016. I suspect that the wall thickness may not be well enough developed at that age to let the teeth engage properly. I threw the thing down next to the gut-pile that morning. In the afternoon, when momma doe showed up at milking time, I shot her right next to her fawn's gut-pile. Since the butt-out was handy, I tried it again on her and experienced my second failure. That was probably due to some of her fawn's liner material fouling the teeth. I cleaned the thing up and it worked perfect the next time (on the infamous Texas Heart Shot buck). I owe it all to you Chef, for talking me into buying that tool when the price dropped down to $ 7.00 on Amazon. Without that "bore" gauge, I never could have proved the perfect shot-placement. Although the shot placement was perfect, the results were not because the bullet took out a good neck roast on it's way out.

Buckmaster, Did you think you were on the trail of a monster buck ?

You got some good eating there, but the contest clearly states you can only enter two bucks. If you use that as your second one, you could wind up screwing yourself out of some points. I asked for clarification on this before the cut-off date and a moderator made it very clear that only two bucks and two does were allowed, regardless of "headgear. I hope you saved the liver. There is no wild game meat (short of moose tongue) that is better eating than fresh, medium rare button buck liver. Congrats on the spectacular kill. I have not been able to shoot one myself since 2012. Watch out for FSW.

Thanks for posting this. It takes guts to post your own f-ups and many of the keyboard warriors here lack those. By "going public" with this, you will help countless others avoid the same mistakes and hopefully get some good suggestions on how to avoid a repeat yourself. It sounds like you already figured out one way (aim low on an alert deer). Just how low is the question. I think you grossly underestimated how much he ducked at 8". I can tell you from recent experience that a mature buck (est 3.5 year old), measures about 43" around the chest behind the front legs. Looking at last years shed, which you posted, that buck was probably even older and bigger this year. That means that if you held for a center lung shot, he had to duck at least 20", for the arrow to miss clean over his back. The most important factor here is the attitude of the buck at the instant you released your arrow. When you grunted earlier, you told him that there was another buck in the area. That got him "ready" for an attack. You also "stopped" him with a bleat. It is hard to imagine a situation where a buck would be on a higher state of alert than that one was after hearing that bleat. That is the instant you released your arrow from a range of 25 yards. That is the exact range where the effect of "string jump" is the greatest. Closer don't give them as much time to move as far and farther is more out of the "danger-zone" where they react to the sound of a bow's release. In more than 30 bow-seasons, I have seen all this before, unfortunately multiple times. I was never so lucky as to have my arrow "miss them clean". I struck 3 in the shoulder blade, not getting any penetration, in my early years. They always duck down and back. The last deer I killed with my vertical bow must have been alerted by the sight of my draw. That stopped him about 25 yards out. When I released my arrow, aimed at the center of his chest as he stood quartering away, he ducked way down and back, taking the arrow thru the neck. That made for an easy recovery but was certainly not where I intended to hit him. I have two suggestions for you. Aiming low on alert deer is the one you already figured out. The second is to avoid shooting at alert deer altogether. You might be able to eliminate the "stopping" of walking deer, by practicing at moving targets with your bow. A balloon, tied into the middle of a tire swing, in front of a round bale might be good. You could tie a rope to it and release it, trying to pop the balloon with your arrow at various points in the swing when you release it. That would give you experience at different speeds. It is a lot easier to hit a target moving at a steady speed than it is to hit one that accelerates quickly and unpredictably after you release your arrow. I eliminated the "alerting" of them catching the draw motion by switching to a crossbow at the earliest opportunity (like today). Throughout the year, I take thousands of shots at moving targets. It is easy, cheap, fast, quiet, and convenient for me to do that by shooting at a can hung from the tab by a wire from a tree branch behind our back deck, with an adult-stocked Daisy red-ryder bb gun. All that practice made killing two moving deer last season a piece of cake with both shots striking very close to my point of aim. I had called the buck in from about 100 yards away, by making a sound like a buck clearing a scrape (I pawed the leaves out of my tree blind). He approached at a fast walk. Cruising along 30 yards away and without warning, he caught my crossbow bolt thru his chest. During gun season, I heard a doe approaching at a fast run. I aimed at an opening she was headed for and hit her in the shoulder blade, with a 12 gauge slug, when she reached it from a range of about 40 yards.

I am ready for my first deer hunt in the southern zone this season. Good luck to all those heading out for some archery hunting this weekend no matter what type of "bow" you choose.

Plastic is ugly. Wood, especially laminated, is not.

If you can't get to your scale, but want to get an approximation of field dressed weight, measure her chest girth just behind the front legs. If it is 38", that would equal a fresh dressed weight of 126 pounds, a live weight of 157 pounds, and 71 pounds of edible meat. 37" would be 115 pounds field dressed and 66 pounds of edible meat. The full chart is available on the pgc.pa website. I like chest girth measurements better than fresh weight, because when you place a fresh killed deer on a scale, most of that weight is made up of water. Water has no nutritional value. "Volume" is the important measurement - How many pint, quart or gallon-sized freezer bags will the deer yield ? Chest girth works better than weight for estimating volume because it is less dependent on how dried out the carcass is.

A momma doe with twins would be cool. Those extra tags would let me keep the family together.

I picked up a couple more 9f's today, bringing my total to four. It has been tough filling them around here the last few years. I will be thankful if I can fill one this year.

Mostly smallmouth bass for me, out on Lake Erie, the upper Niagara, St Lawrence, and a small Adirondack lake where my in-laws built their retirement home. Do you tie flies ? I take the bulk of my smallmouth bass on bucktail jigs that I tie. I have made a few trout flies and even tried them once up in the Adirondacks, but only caught a smallmouth on them in that nice looking trout stream near the North Pole. I do get out trolling on lake Ontario sometimes and take steelhead on rare occasion. They are much harder to land that kings, with lots of "aerial action". I did not get out there this year, but this was the last one from the year prior:

We have not had any in years. The houses are too far apart, here in the flood-plane. I just drove our kids to a nearby subdivision on higher ground, where the pickings should be much better. I hope so, because those chocolate treats are great up in the deer stand and I have a lot of time planned up there over the next few weeks.

I had the hide tanned from the last big one that I killed from our bedroom window at home. It looks cool, hanging next to the bar in our billiard room, but one of those is enough for my wife and I. If I were ever to kill one up at my in-laws place in the Adirondacks (I was nearly bushwacked by a wolf-sized one up there a few weeks ago), I am sure my father-in-law would spring to get it tanned. He wants to decorate their retirement home with "local species". I got him a nice whitetail buck shoulder mount for the wall, but he is still asking for a smallmouth bass, lake-trout, and bear rug. I am sure that he would love a coyote hide. What is the average cost for getting them tanned these days? I think I paid my cousin about $ 50 to tan one, about 10 years ago, but he does not do it anymore. As far as what to do with the rest of them, I just throw them out in the field. The meat must be very bad. Those are the only carcasses that the crows will not even touch. They just lay out there and dehydrate until I turn them under with the plow in the spring. Anything else (deer, racooons, possums, skunks, rabbits, turkeys, fish etc) are devoured fast.

I have been fishing NY for closer to 50 years, but I also have 36 deer seasons behind me (38 small game). The revolvers seem like they would be pretty neat. Back before rifled shotguns were legal in NY, several of my buddies were using T/C contender pistols in 35 Rem. I nearly went that route, going as far as taking the NY pistol course. They legalized rifled shotguns before I got my permit, so I never followed thru with it. I may have, had two of my best friends not missed out on what they claimed were "the largest bucks they ever saw" because their 35 Rem pistols failed to fire. The revolvers seem like a much better idea to me. A couple years ago, an older friend brought over a Ruger single-action, stainless steel, scoped 44 Magnum for me to sight in for him (he had recently suffered a detached retina and did not want to do it himself). He brought some expensive hunting ammo, and I missed the target completely with my first shot from 50 yards. I was a little scared of it, and anticipated a big recoil. I was very surprised that it actually was quite tame. I explained that was probably the reason I missed the paper and he reluctantly gave me another round to try. I put that one near the center of the target and he was "good to go". He has lost interest in hunting now (I guess that is common for retired folks) but I can see where it would be fun to hunt with one of those. He would probably sell it to me cheap if I ever got my permit.

Chomping here too. I just checked the long range forecast and made a plans for what stands to hit on Saturday and Sunday. Rain early Saturday and SW wind will keep me in my enclosed two-story blind at home (top level is open). I will go upstairs when the rain lets up as the view is better from up there. I am not sure what bucks remain around here. A neighbor nailed the big one a couple weeks ago, so there is no telling what will have moved in by now. I would be very thankful for my first antlerless deer with my crossbow (especially if it is a fat button-buck). Saturday afternoon, I am heading to my folks place, where there might still be a big, wide eight around, although they have not seen him in about a week. I did see a large-bodied fork-horn, with one side broke off, walk right up to my new pop-up blind over there last Sunday afternoon. That big body will tempt me, if he offers a shot, although I usually look for at least three points on a side to punch my buck tags during the first half of the season(s). I can not hunt that pop-up that day because my sister is planning an afternoon "haunted hayride" in the area. I will be up in a hang-on stand at the far corner of the property. Hopefully they "scare" the deer over that way. I will pack my tree umbrella in case the afternoon rain they are calling for shows up when I am up there. I can't hunt early Sunday, but the weather looks great, and the deer should be moving all day during that peak-rut time. I will be out at home, from late-morning to dark, in a stand that has produced the last two times I used it. They say "things usually happen in threes" so I will find out if that is true on Sunday. edit: Chomping even more now. I just dropped the girls off for tricker-treating, in a nearby subdivision, and we saw (3) deer exiting our block on the way. The last one was a wide-bodied 2.5 year old buck that I had to get on the breaks real hard in order to miss with my car. Had I been driving my truck or my wife's mini-van, I would have tagged him for sure. There will be no passing of that one on Saturday or Sunday, with a big body and 8 or 10 points to go with it.

Welcome and good luck with your crossbow. In my opinion, there is no finer weapon, or better time to kill a deer in NY's southern zone than those two weeks when it is legal. What are you shooting ?

That is the perfect weapon for hunting in the rain. Every whitetail deer that I have hit with mine has dropped dead in its tracks. Did your's run far after taking the bullet ? Plus, it has plenty of range to get out beyond the tree-umbrella no deer zone. I was sitting under one with mine, up in the northern zone yesterday morning, but the "no deer zone" extended as far as I could see during the rain on that day.

At least we have deer hunting to get exited about in the fall. But we still don't know if a mature buck will get within archery range of a tree umbrella during a hard rain. Congrats on that beauty. What did you kill him with ?

Yep. Shot this guy under one last year. It may be loud to you but rain is noisy everywhere in the woods. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Was it raining hard when he showed up ?

That makes sense, since it is a lot farther south. Did you see any deer sign ? What gun did you carry ? On Saturday morning, before the rain and snow, I saw one of the most well worked buck scrapes that I have ever observed. It was about a foot and one half wide, three feet long, completely cleared of leaves and pine needles, and excavated about three inches deep into the dry ground. I pissed into it and rubbed Evercalm on the licking branch, then set up my tree hammock seat about 40 yards downwind. Nothing but red squirrels showed up in the couple hours that I watched it. Certainly the rut is in full-swing up there right now and there is at least one mature buck in the area.

You got that right. There looks to be a lot more rain in the long range forecast, although Saturday and Sunday don't look too bad. Those will be my first days out deer hunting in the southern zone. I will be sure to have that tree umbrella with me both days. I also have one of those cheap pop-up blinds that Aldis was selling last year pre-positioned in a good spot. That will give me another good rain option. I suppose the "bombs going off noise" would be nearly identical or worse inside that during a hard rain. I watched a large-bodied, small-racked buck walk right up to it, late yesterday afternoon, after the rain stopped. If he repeats that performance next weekend, I might be in it and I might be shooting.

Well we know it works with does at long range, but we do not yet know if it works with mature bucks at short range. The world wonders.

A good thing about them, is that they enable you to stay out there, stay dry, and be in position as soon as the rain stops. While hunting at home, I have used my enclosed blinds like that, but so far I have only been able to kill does from under the roofs during the rain. I have moved out of them to nearby stand, immediately upon the stoppage of the rain, and killed bucks on several occasions however. I suppose that if the rain was accompanied by high winds, the noise of the rain hitting the umbrella might get drowned out, but deer seldom move in high winds and rain. Also, a tree umbrella does not provide much protection from the "sideways" rain. Were any of those mature bucks ? Like I mentioned above, I have killed a handful of does and a button buck (imagine that) in the rain (with light wind) from under a blind roof, but never an antlered buck. It was very comfortable under that tree umbrella on Sunday. It is easy to carry and setup, so I am sure that I will be using it again. It worked much better from the ground with the cheap 3-legged stool that I got at Aldis last year, than it did with my tree hammock seat. That thing acted like a funnel, collecting water that ran off the tree, resulting in a wet bottom. The tree umbrella also works well from a ladder stand (except for the seeing any deer part). I used it like that opening day in the rain last gun season and saw nothing.

What WMU were you in ? Was there any snow ? Up on the NW corner of the park, in WMU 6C, we had the first decent tracking snow of the year on Sunday morning. It lasted for a couple hours after sunrise, before the rain took it out. Hopefully, there will be more snow on Thanksgiving weekend. I killed bucks up there in the snow in 2014 and 2016, so I am due for another this year.

Has anyone ever killed a decent buck from under one of these while it is raining hard. Mine kept me pretty dry and comfortable on Sunday morning, thru some heavy rain, but the sound it made was loud and unnatural. I cant imagine a mature buck approaching within archery range with all that noise. I was up in the Northern zone, with my 30/06 at the time, so that was not such a big deal. No deer showed up even at long range.

If you have not done it yet, I would recommend a few practice shots with your broadheads, especially if you will be using the fixed-blade type. Others have reported big differences in the point of impact compared to field tips of the same weight and I have experienced it myself with one brand (fortunately on the target range). I shoot 125 grain broadheads and field points with my 300 fps crossbow. Muzzy fixed blades and o-ring style mechanicals fly identical to field tips in mine, Wasp fixed blades were very close (within 2" out to 40 yards), but Allen fixed blade 125 gr were way off (about 8" low and 6" to the left at 40 yards). They say the differences can be even greater with higher speed crossbows.