wolc123

I like the Federal classics in 150 grain. All three deer I have hit with those (from various angles) have piled up dead in their tracks.

Texas tenderloins

You lost me completely on that one Grow. Maybe go back and read the quotes to see what you missed. I will pray that your luck gets better this season.

I skip the boil and simmer completely and just skin the head while it is still fresh. Then I put on a rainsuit, fire up the 3000 psi pressure washer and blast it clean. It takes about a half hour total to do the job. Wrapping a little duct-tape around the base of the antlers keeps their natural color. You can see videos on youtube of how it is done this way. I posted a photo of one I did last year in the taxidermy section. I already did my crossbow buck this season and will probably get the rifle one done within the next week or so. My wife appreciates me staying out of the kitchen and keeping all the mess outside. The birds and vermin usually have all the mess cleaned up out there by the next day.

Chris, I have hit (5) deer that I did not recover over 35 years (3 shoulder blades with bow due to string jump, all of which likely survived, and one hit too far back which certainly did not). Another, that I know did not survive, I lost due to a poor tracking job after probably hitting him right where I aimed with my ML. I remember all of the details of those losses more than any of the successful recoveries. In the last 3 years, since turning everything over to Jesus Christ, I have cleanly killed every deer I have shot at (6 total). Faith in Jesus might not guarantee that I will not loose another but it certainly has not hurt. It just goes to show that there is hope for everyone, even a messed up sinner like myself.

Grow, I definitely appreciate your concern for safety. I was on the receiving end of one of those deals one time (you even "liked" the story in that other thread) where the guy saw the doe, but not what was beyond it (me). This time, when I was the shooter, the buck was not "sky-lined". I was about 5 feet higher than him as he approached a narrow draw that ran into the valley. I could clearly see the other side of the draw, and that is where the bullet must have landed after passing lengthwise thru him. As far as the ethics go regarding the shot, as stated, I was 99.5 % sure of making the kill in the conditions that I found myself in. I really can't help those folks who need more certainty than that. I had fired that rifle twice from my 100 yard bench, with ammo out of the same box, a month or so prior to the shot in question. Those shots struck less than 1" apart, centered on the bull. That buck was at 50 yards, standing still, there was a light wind, and I had a good rest. Mathematically and ethically, there is no reason that the bullet should not have gone straight up the poop shoot, which it did. Where the "Divine intervention" comes in was the fact that it must have been almost perfectly centered there, for there was no mess at all in gutting and no significant meat damage (just the loss of a neck roast). We just finished the tenderloins for dinner in fact and they were delicious. For those of you who are not having the best season so far this year, think about picking up a Bible and reading it a bit, maybe even in your stand. I am no expert on chapter and verse, but I do remember reading somewhere in there that: "He knows where every sparrow falls". To me, that indicates that He must also know where every Whitetail deer ends up. Why not send them to "Deer heaven", otherwise known as "Our food supply". Somewhere else in there it says that: "Man is supposed to eat animals with cloven hoofs that chew their cud". That sure sounds like deer to me. Happy hunting everyone.

Wooly you are right on there about a couple things anyhow. The little red guy is just that,, little, compared to the Big Guy in White. The two have tangled many times and every time the little red guy has came out on the short end of the stick. I know there will be more conflicts but I also know that the outcomes will never change. You are also right about the prayer part. In fact, there is a mountain ridge up there in the NW Adirondacks where all (4) hunting-related prayers I asked for were answered. God has His schedule and we have ours and they were not all answered as quickly as I would have liked. It took Him under a minute to deliver an antlered buck when I asked to see one. It took Him about 5 minutes to give me a shot at him when I asked for that, and it took Him over a half hour to let me find him when he dissapeared after my last of 3 shots (yes I am not perfect and missed the first two). I also asked to see an antlerless deer on my first afternoon ML hunt up there this season. He did not bring her around until the next morning, just after sunrise (as you saw in the ML harvest thread). The fact that He was 4/4 of answering prayers up on that ridge led me to believe that there might be some type of "Holy-Vortex" up there and maybe I could use that to help some folks I know or know of who are suffering with cancer. The next time I was up on that ridge I prayed for 3 of them. I talked with one of those (a co-worker) on the phone a short time ago who had suffered from throat cancer. He said he was finally able to remove the feeding tube and begin the final stage of recovery to return to work. The day that tube came out may have been the day I said that prayer.

Another vote here for the Mickey boots. The black ones are rated for 40 below and the whites 70. The blacks are perfect for NY state deer hunting in the winter. It is hard to go wrong for $40 surplus or $80 new. No other boot I have tried has worked better for hunting, regardless of cost. The blacks are light weight enough to work well for still hunting.

Chef you might want to consider giving Jesus a chance. Get yourself a Bible and read it a bit. You might be surprised at how that can improve your hunting, and life in general. The Bible was directly involved in all (4) deer that I have harvested so far this season, as well as two of them that I was blessed with last year. I was more than 95% sure of making each of those shots. What is your go/no go percent? Have you wounded and not recovered any deer in the last few years? Try to release that "Bitterness" that comes across so clearly in your posts. It is hurting no one more than yourself.

I just love those Jesus bumps, bring it on Chef.

I learned first hand that blaze orange will not keep you from getting shot. Too many hunters get blinders on and see only the deer and NOT what is beyond it. About 20 years ago, I was hunting from a tree stand near the back of our farm. A doe walked slowly across the far edge of a field, just a bit out of range for my old 16 gauge smoothbore slug gun. When she walked thru the hedgerow that marks the edge of our farm, I got down and walked to where she vanished. When I stepped thru that hedgerow, I saw her out in the middle of a narrow field, owned by a neighbor who does not hunt, but gave permission to those of us on either side. I was wearing a blaze orange hat and jacket and so was another "hunter" who was located directly behind that deer (about 100 yards from me) in the opposite hedgerow. I felt the pressure from his first shot against the side of my face before I heard the shot. I got a little taste of what the "lucky" solders must experience in ground combat. I hit the dirt, and slugs began landing close, throwing clumps against me. He fired 5 times, in rapid succession. Fortunately for me and the doe, they were all "near misses". That incident changed the way I hunt big time. No more "deer drives" for me. I basically stick to our own land or that of family members. I feel a lot more comfortable up in a treestand or in a raised blind on private land or land with very low hunting pressure, such as the Adirondacks. That incident happened before I had a wife and kids, and those have multiplied my dislike of public hunting grounds, deer drives, etc by a factor of four. I know that I have no control over what others do, but I do have the last say as to how I hunt. I also believe that when the Good Lord says your time on Earth is up, it is and there ain't nothing you can do to prevent it. That is no excuse for taking unnecessary risks however.

I just finished skinning this one and am able to make a better estimate on the meat damage. It is limited to the neck. He must had his head turned to the right, because the bullet exited the lower left side of the neck. The hole there in the hide was 3/4" diameter, but the hole below that in the meat was a bit over 2" diameter and the bruising extended out a few inches farther from there. The bone in the neck was badly fragmented in that area from the bullet impact. There will be no neck roast from this one. Inside, and near the other end, the tenderloins came out completely intact. My wife is making them for dinner tomorrow and they look about equal in volume to the combined total of the doe and button buck that we got at home on opening day. The rear quarters, backstraps, rib meat and front shoulders are all completely un-damaged. The top of the heart was creased, but the major damage was to the base of the neck.

The plan all came together for sure with just one (actually 50 or more) little glitches. That is about how many ticks I picked off of that carcass and killed yesterday, after I hung it up in the garage. The non-winter last year must have been very good for them buggers. I hope I don't see any more when skinning tonight, but I highly doubt that I got them all. The ones in the white hair were easy to find at least.

There was no chance of this one turning. The trail he was on led straight away and disappeared downhill in another 20 or so yards. As I mentioned in the first post, I was 99.5 % sure it was a clean kill shot. I won't regret punching my tag on that one, even if a big, Southern zone, 3-1/2 year old, 12-point presents a shot while I am out trying to fill my DMP's at home over these last few weeks. An Adirondack buck is worth that much more to me personally. That shot was taken on the last full day I had available to hunt up there this season and they don't have a late ML season there. Thanks for the reminder WNY BH, because I certainly do have to thank Jesus for letting that bullet strike exactly where it did (I ain't that good on my own). It appears that very little, if any meat was damaged, and the guts came out clean as a whistle.

Well I finally got my second Adirondack buck this past weekend (a 1-1/2 year 6 point). I don't suppose I will ever catch up with Buckmaster, since he is a few years younger than me. At least I left a lot less lead in this one (exit wound only, no entry hole needed).

In 35 years of deer hunting, I have only seen one antlered buck after the long Thanksgiving weekend. That was the final factor in convincing me to "settle" for a 1-1/2 year 6 point on my last hunt this past Saturday afternoon up in the Adirondacks. That was only my second Adirondack buck in 25 years of trying. To me, one of those is worth 10 back home. The scenery, and almost total absence of hunting pressure, makes all the difference. The area around our home, in the Southern zone, gets pounded very hard on Thanksgiving weekend. My neighbor killed the last buck I saw around here (a small, 1-1/2 year 3-point) on Thanksgiving morning just before we left for the North country. That pressure, coupled with the end of the rut, is usually sufficient to force most of the deer around here to full nocturnal until around Christmas. Drives might still be effective, but I don't like hunting that way anymore. Having your hair parted by a 12 gauge slug will do that to you. I have a couple DMP's left for around home and will get out a few more and try and fill them but I don't expect much. I have had another handful of other "four-deer" years, so I may as well go for my first "5" or "6". There are still too many deer around here according to the DEC, and lots of hungry mouths to feed.

For me to take such a shot, many variables would have to be almost perfect: short range, standing deer, solid rest, good scope, powerful rifle, good bullet, correct angle and elevation, no obstructions, light or no wind, and good lighting. It all came together for me in the early afternoon, this past Saturday up in the Adirondacks. The snow was too crunchy for still-hunting, so I set up in my tree-hammock chair, along a deer trail at the edge of a valley, on a forest edge where hardwoods met evergreens. A light breeze was blowing up from the valley and I knew there were does bedded down there from sign I had seen earlier. For about 10 minutes after getting set up in the chair, I was watching the trail to my left, because I thought that was the most likely place for a buck to approach from. When does it ever go like you plan? I heard a twig snap over my shoulder, then I swung slowly over to my right. There was a buck, walking towards me, just 40 yards away. He must have caught the motion and turned around, back the way he came, as I was lifting my rifle. He stopped at 50 yards. I centered the crosshairs just below "the spot" and squeezed the trigger. The 150 grain Federal Classic 30/06 bullet put him down there in his tracks. There was no entry wound, and the bullet exited near the center of his chest. I walked over to him and noted blood flowing out of the exit wound. He held his head up for a few seconds but had no use of his legs. His lights went out quickly, without a need for a second shot. I expected the gutting job to be a mess but was pleasantly surprised that it was not. The Butt-out 2 even worked well (after failures on the last two boiler room broadside shot deer I used it on. The stomach was not punctured at all. The bullet must not have expanded until it struck some vertibrae in the neck area. He will be skinned tomorrow and go in the fridge for a week. I will find out how much meat damage there was when I process him next weekend. The buck was a 6 point, probably 1-1/2 year old and looked and felt to be in the 150-160 lb range field dressed. I was hoping for a larger buck this year during gun season, but I took that shot for three reasons: First, I was 99.5% sure I could kill the deer cleanly with the shot. Second, there are a few folks at work who really want some venison, including the top boss at our plant who asked me personally on my last day of work prior to Thanksgiving vacation. Lastly, in 35 years of deer hunting I have seen a total of one buck after the long Thanksgiving weekend. That was during the late ML season and he got away, after walking under my treestand, when my old sidelock misfired.

I heard twice as many shots this morning, at home in zone 9F than I did on opening day. About (4) were before legal sunup, but most were between 7:30 and 8:30. There has been no shots over the last hour. I saw no deer, but the neighbor fired twice within a couple hundred yards of me. The only deer I saw here, since opening day of gun, other than the button buck my buddy shot (in my freezer now) is the doe I shot that afternoon (in my sister's freezer now). I am happy to still have my buck tag as we head up to zone 6C for the long Thanksgiving weekend within the next hour. That makes the 4-1/2 hour drive a lot more enjoyable.

You get a real good idea of the power advantage of a crossbow compared to a vertical the first time you fire one into a foam target. It buries the arrows much deeper into the target, usually requiring a beefier one than is made to be used with a vertical bow. It is also a lot harder to pull those deep buried bolts out of the foam. I no longer use a foam target with mine because a bag full of old rags stops the bolts better, makes them a lot easier to pull out, is lighter and best of all, did not cost me any cash. After every hunt, I unload my crossbow into a dot on that bag, That keeps me sharp and able to "hit that hair" throughout hunting season. You would be surprised how much it helps your confidence shooting game when you know you have just hit a dime prior to going after them. That power advantage also helps the crossbow reduce wounded and unrecovered deer during archery season. Although I would never target the shoulder blade, I am confident my "entry level" 300 fps crossbow would penetrate it easily from under 30 yards. Shoulder blades have cost me the recovery of (4) deer over 30 some years with a vertical bow. All of those were struck due to "string jump", which also becomes less of an issue with a crossbow, due to increased likelihood of shooting at "relaxed" deer.

I shot at and killed two deer with my 300 fps crossbow. The first (aprox 140 lb, 1-1/2 year buck) was at 59 yards broadside, struck thru the heart. The bolt only penetrated 8" into the deer at that range which caused me to limit future shots to 50 yards max (I bought a laser rangefinder to make sure of that). That deer ran 40 yards and expired, just out of view from my stand (I heard the fall). This years deer (aprox 170 lb, 2-1/2 year buck) was quartering to me at 20 yards and struck behind the shoulder. The bolt traveled diagonally thru the chest, exited the opposite side lower buttox, and buried 2" into the ground. That buck staggered across an open field about 50 yards, dragging the injured hind leg. I watched him wobble and fall, try to get up twice, then go down for good. The crossbow has 3 advantages over the vertical bow. First, no need to draw with the deer in close. That greatly reduces the need to shoot at "alert" deer, which often happens when they get a glimpse of your draw. Second, they can and should be fired from a rest. That greatly improves accuracy compared to shooting offhand as any rifleman knows very well. Third, they alow the use of a telescopic sight which allows the deer and the sight to be in near perfect focus at the same time. With a vertical, two of three ( peep, pin, or deer) will be blurry, hurting accuracy. All those advantages improve accuracy thus reducing the odds of a miss or a wounded deer. That is why I will not use a vertical anymore. I can pick out a hair on a deer and hit it every time with my crossbow with under and hour of total practice time. Not so with my vertical. A pie plate at 30 yards was the best I could do with many hours of practice.

I will get out at home for a couple hours, while my wife packs the van, before we head up to her folks place in the Adirondacks for the long weekend. I would like to save my buck tag for hunting up there, so it will have to be a pretty big one if I fill it here. It would be nice to leave one hanging, hide-on in the garage, because the temperatures look nearly perfect for that over the next week. I don't think we will get up there in time for an afternoon hunt on Thanksgiving day. Many years ago, I killed my largest antlered buck at home on Thanksgiving morning. Just two years ago, I killed my heaviest one up at their Adirondack camp, a day or two after Thanksgiving. Hopefully, history will repeat in one place or the other this year. Even if it does not, I still could not be more thankful for the record amount of venison the Good Lord has already blessed us with this season. Good luck to all you folks who are hunting tomorrow and stay safe while hunting and traveling.

I am against mandatory antler restrictions, but I am a pure "meat-hunter". The only reason I pass 1-1/2 year old bucks, is because the 2-1/2's and 3-1/2's taste the same but have a lot more meat on meat on them. I understand why those who are fixated on antlers rather than meat like them. In NY state at this time, those folks seem to be in the minority. I also prefer killing bucks compared to does, because they are easier for me to butcher (less fat to trim away), come with nice grab-handles to drag out of heavy cover, and nice "reminders" of past hunts. I also prefer the local deer population to be a bit on the high side, and taking a buck over a doe is a good way to help maintain that population for future years.

If I manage to fill my buck tag (which is highly unlikely because I am holding for a 2-1/2 year or older buck now), I would definitely consider carrying my crossbow while working thru my last two DMP's. I have killed a couple of bucks it, over the last three years, but no antlerless deer yet. What I would like most would be to get a button-buck with it. There is not room for much more venison in our freezer now but I could always make space for one of those, even if it means throwing out a big turkey my wife got on sale. That button meat is so darn good that it is a shame to waste any of it with a gunshot wound. What they lack in quantity, they more than make up for in quality on the table. The liver and tenderloins of the one we killed Saturday morning were "to die for". There will be room for anther one, on the hook, when I process the rest of that one Wednesday evening.

Grouse are about the only bird that I like the flavor of. Their breasts are proportionally huge, compared to most other birds, and the white meat has a much better flavor than turkey or chicken. There is more meat on the breasts than the rest of the bird. We have usually baked the whole bird in the oven, like a chicken, but I have even cooked them over a campfire on a stick. It is pretty hard to mess up cooking a grouse.

I also carry 3 with the ML (one loaded and two speedloaders in jacket pocket), but I only use that when shotgun or rifle are not legal. I also reload the ML prior to tracking the deer and only one time, out of about a dozen killed with it, did I use the second shot. One time a doe that was hit thru the lungs started to get back up when I caught up with her so I gave her the second shot in the neck. My bolt-action shotgun shoots just as accurate as my ML, plus it gives me (2) extra shots and more than double the energy at 150 yards. With that and my rifle, I nearly always carry 10. It has been a long time since I have shot at a deer moving any faster than a slow walk. I still remember the last time, maybe 15 years ago. A 10 point buck presented a standing, broadside shot at about 75 yards. I calmly centered the crosshairs behind his shoulder and fired a 12 ga sabot slug, from a solid rest. He bolted over a ditch and into the woods on the other side. I tried to follow him thru the woods with the scope, looking for an opening. When he reached one, about 50 yards away, I pulled ahead a bit for a lead, and fired. He folded up dead and skidded into a stump, just like a pheasant hit with a full pattern. As it turned out, it was a pure coincidence that he died immediately after that running shot. It never touched him, but it was timed just as he ran out of steam from damage suffered by the first shot (thru both lungs). I am not sure where that second shot struck, but I know it was safe because it was fired at a steep down angle, towards the ground. That is one big advantage in hunting from a treestand over level ground, you always have a good backstop.