Interesting Youth Season Spot on News

[bellava]

I do see the potential for danger with the rifles or shotguns in the woods that time of the year but i do not think there are gonna be that many people in the woods. If they were moving reg season to oct thats a different story, that would be a disaster but we are not talking about that.

And to be honest with you WNYBuckhunter you look to be the one stirring the pot. Everytime someone brings a valid point to the argument you go crazy.

[Doc]

Doc, did you read the article? Specifically this part....

"Families Afield's latest report showed that since 2005, more than 418,000 apprentice hunting licenses for deer, upland birds, turkey and waterfowl have been sold in the USA. The report was based on 24 states and found an increase of 100,000 apprentice hunting licenses in 2009."

The term apprentice license is the same as youth license. That right there says between 24 states, there was an increase of 100,000 youth licenses in one year. Its a direct result of thise states opening youth seasons, as the article is referring to increases in participation since 2005, when youth seasons started to be established.

You also completely ignored or missed the second link I posted. You asked for stats, and I gave them to you, yet you still try to find a way to put some sort of negative slant on it. Look, I m not trying to argue your opinions, just showing that your comments that youth seasons are gimmicks and unproven, and that they wont have the desired effect on recruitment are wrong. If you have other reasons that you dont want the youth seasons in, hey, thats your porogative.

I don't suppose that any of that would correlate to the implementation of the "apprentice licenses" themselves would it? There was some reason that they stepped around flat out stating that those sales were totally due to special seasons. Any mention of what those youth license sales would have been without special seasons? I couldn't find it. Yes they are selling youth licenses and if you had bothered to read my reply you would have noted that I said the creation of youth licenses is a good thing. Add to that that also lowering hunting ages is a good thing. These are positive moves, but none of that has a thing to do with special seasons. And the spike in 2009 seems to indicate that there are other factors at work here besides just special seasons. They noted that spike but didn't explain a lot about the cause of it.

Also, I didn't see any explanation in the article of how all of a sudden they seemed to have mentors coming out of the woodwork for a special season when none can be found during the season. Ever wonder about that? Why is that? It does lend a little credence to Skully's assertion that guys want this special season to get kids out of their hair while they do their hunting. But that's another subject.

As far as my arguments against the youth season, I have made them clear. In fact you have already noted that I don't hesitate to repeat them, ad nauseum, for those that have problems understanding or who pretend not to understand them or simply want to ignore them. So don't be insinuating that I have any unstated agenda. I have been up-front and complete in describing my objections.

If you want to jump on the bandwagon have at it. I hope you don't take it too hard when it does absolutely no good. If human nature plays out as usual, there will be a lot of back-patting and congratulations and another continuation of the pretense that the problem has been put to bed. With the pressure off to come up with new solutions, it will signal the beginning of another long period lacking in creative and innovative and truly effective solutions. Whether you like it or not, even you have to have at least enough understanding of how human nature and the DEC works. They have done exactly what was demanded of them. They have "done something ..... anything". That's all we have asked of them and we have not demanded a solution that works. Well, we got what we asked for.

[Doc]

Youre a few crayons short of a full box, arent you?

You are nothing but a troll, go back under the rock you came from.

Oh come on, can't we have at least one discussion without it turning into this?

[wdswtr]

What I think Skully fails to reconize that we are avid bowhunters. His rant about a two day youth hunt before opening gun season we supposedly where so opposed against is just a stupid tyrant rant coming out his ass as he has no idea if any one of us were for or against it. So you see Skully maybe you might want to come join a conversation without accusations you have no ideal of what you are talking about. You want us to answer a question that does not exist because again like said about 20 times now. LIsten carefully since you havent already. WE SUPPORT THE YOUTH HUNT!!!!!!!!!! I dont care if its columbus weekedend or any weekend in gun season. Do you get that SKULLY? Is it transparent enough for you yet? Again we are avid bowhunters supporting a youth hunt during bow season or gun. I DID NOT COME UP WITH THE DATES if you have a problem with that, again I suggest you go to the public hearings once in awhile and voice your opinion. I love you armchair critics.

[wdswtr]

Oh come on, can't we have at least one discussion without it turning into this?

We were but your buddy Skully and his irrelevant comments are what turned this conversation into a bash fest.

[skully]

hey wdswtr, go get your earmuffs and your baseball. Last yr after the first comment period it was made public that the gun hunters went nuts about there being a youth hunt the 2 days prior to gun season. And you know what there biggest reason was " It is to cold for them that time of the year" Ok go get your thermacells you friggin Idiots, have a blast. If you think Im lying go look it up. I am sure you cut and paste boys could find it.

[WNYBuckHunter]

I do see the potential for danger with the rifles or shotguns in the woods that time of the year but i do not think there are gonna be that many people in the woods. If they were moving reg season to oct thats a different story, that would be a disaster but we are not talking about that.

And to be honest with you WNYBuckhunter you look to be the one stirring the pot. Everytime someone brings a valid point to the argument you go crazy.

There are already rifles and shotguns in the woods that time of the year.

As far as me stirring the pot or going crazy, im doing niether of those. I am discussing the subject. You know, what this forum is here for?

[WNYBuckHunter]

Oh come on, can't we have at least one discussion without it turning into this?

Seriously Doc, the guy has done nothing but troll the thread. Youd be saying the same thing if he wasnt agreeing with you.

[WNYBuckHunter]

I don't suppose that any of that would correlate to the implementation of the "apprentice licenses" themselves would it? There was some reason that they stepped around flat out stating that those sales were totally due to special seasons. Any mention of what those youth license sales would have been without special seasons? I couldn't find it. Yes they are selling youth licenses and if you had bothered to read my reply you would have noted that I said the creation of youth licenses is a good thing. Add to that that also lowering hunting ages is a good thing. These are positive moves, but none of that has a thing to do with special seasons. And the spike in 2009 seems to indicate that there are other factors at work here besides just special seasons. They noted that spike but didn't explain a lot about the cause of it.

Also, I didn't see any explanation in the article of how all of a sudden they seemed to have mentors coming out of the woodwork for a special season when none can be found during the season. Ever wonder about that? Why is that? It does lend a little credence to Skully's assertion that guys want this special season to get kids out of their hair while they do their hunting. But that's another subject.

As far as my arguments against the youth season, I have made them clear. In fact you have already noted that I don't hesitate to repeat them, ad nauseum, for those that have problems understanding or who pretend not to understand them or simply want to ignore them. So don't be insinuating that I have any unstated agenda. I have been up-front and complete in describing my objections.

If you want to jump on the bandwagon have at it. I hope you don't take it too hard when it does absolutely no good. If human nature plays out as usual, there will be a lot of back-patting and congratulations and another continuation of the pretense that the problem has been put to bed. With the pressure off to come up with new solutions, it will signal the beginning of another long period lacking in creative and innovative and truly effective solutions. Whether you like it or not, even you have to have at least enough understanding of how human nature and the DEC works. They have done exactly what was demanded of them. They have "done something ..... anything". That's all we have asked of them and we have not demanded a solution that works. Well, we got what we asked for.

Doc, the youth lisences were there beforehand, just like they are here. The articles stated that they sold xxxxxxx number of additional licenses. I pretty much expected that you couldnt go without trying to dispute the facts presented to you.

Im not going to bother with the rest of what you said, its just repeats of what youve already said in this thread.

[wdswtr]

Again Skully go read what has been written, did I say once anything about me whining about a youth hunt anywheres in this thread, this site or anywhere you can point out to me where I am against it anywhere its placed. I will save you the time. Nowhere dont bother looking. Which puts us back to you talking out your ass like you actually know what your saying. You want to raise a stink about a different subject regarding a two day hunt before gun season that you are whining about go ahead and do it. Until then just shut up cause you are making no sense at all.

[bellava]

There are already rifles and shotguns in the woods that time of the year.

As far as me stirring the pot or going crazy, im doing niether of those. I am discussing the subject. You know, what this forum is here for?

There are rifles and shotguns in the woods, Am I missing something? Please don't be one of those guys that are talking about birdshot and .22s and comparing them to high powered rifles.

[Paula]

haha

[burmjohn]

AR's

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

[biggamefish]

Here's what I don't get. If you have kids and want them hunting with you why wouldn't you take them every chance you had????????? I don't have kids but if I did I know I would want them to experience everything about the woods. Can you hunt all day maybe not but I bet it is a great experience teaching them and then maybe getting a good breakfest at a diner or IHOP. I don't understand why you even need a youth gun season. Take them bow hunting with you then when gun season starts take them gun hunting.

I hunt with a good crew in the ADK's and one guy has three sons. They where all brought up the same way and all had the same opportunities to hunt. There father hunts every weekend he can and goes out of state to hunt sometimes. Out of his three sons only one took to it like him and hunts every chance he has. Out of the other two one hunts occasional and the other hardly ever. I only say this because I think all people are different.

The sad thing is the society is moving to a point where if there isn't a special day for something people can't and don't do it. Kids don't get out and play enough (its a tech world)and we baby 90% of the society growing up.

Just a rant I guess I just don't understand why people need a special day for something they should just want to share with someone so specail to them.

[bellava]

Here's what I don't get. If you have kids and want them hunting with you why wouldn't you take them every chance you had????????? I don't have kids but if I did I know I would want them to experience everything about the woods. Can you hunt all day maybe not but I bet it is a great experience teaching them and then maybe getting a good breakfest at a diner or IHOP. I don't understand why you even need a youth gun season. Take them bow hunting with you then when gun season starts take them gun hunting.

I hunt with a good crew in the ADK's and one guy has three sons. They where all brought up the same way and all had the same opportunities to hunt. There father hunts every weekend he can and goes out of state to hunt sometimes. Out of his three sons only one took to it like him and hunts every chance he has. Out of the other two one hunts occasional and the other hardly ever. I only say this because I think all people are different.

The sad thing is the society is moving to a point where if there isn't a special day for something people can't and don't do it. Kids don't get out and play enough (its a tech world)and we baby 90% of the society growing up.

Just a rant I guess I just don't understand why people need a special day for something they should just want to share with someone so specail to them.

On the money

[wdswtr]

Here's what I don't get. If you have kids and want them hunting with you why wouldn't you take them every chance you had????????? I don't have kids but if I did I know I would want them to experience everything about the woods. Can you hunt all day maybe not but I bet it is a great experience teaching them and then maybe getting a good breakfest at a diner or IHOP. I don't understand why you even need a youth gun season. Take them bow hunting with you then when gun season starts take them gun hunting.

Its something I dont get as well. I do take my kids out quite a bit with me during all seasons. But a few that do just isnt enough and alot of the points in this thread have been brought up by almost everyone in there own words I think. It would be great if this was the case for all adult mentors to take a kid out with them at any point. Sadly its just not happening. Why I dont know, I consider this time in the woods a pretty special moment with them. I have had a couple private conversations about this very topic and told those guys that I had two pretty excited boys in the house when they found out there was a potential for a youth deer hunt. And then 2 very dissapointed boys after the news of the youth hunt being sidelined. Im not sure what the exact thing about it that excites them more than going out with me any other time. When I asked the reply is cause its a day for us and only us. Both said there friends are all talking about it as well. There are times when they just cant or dont want to go out with me. Football practice or basketball practice or there buddies Bday etc. seems to take priority at times. If they are showing this much excitement about a youth hunt, I dont understand what is the big hangup with the naysayers. Whats the big hurt to take 3 days out of a now longer season for just them? They are showing more excitement about this than any other time I have ever taken them out. Maybe to them its like opening day to most adult hunters. Its there time, they were even talking about where they wanted to hunt and where they think would be a good stand setup etc. I cant speak for others kids but mine are pretty or I should say where pretty excited about it. Its was to them there hunt, there make or break, there chance for personal success and some bragging right to friends if they were succesful. Just something about it sparked more interest in them than any other time I have taken them out. If that is 2 kids out of thousands that are showing such a greater interest I cant help but think it would be a success.

Edited July 30, 2012 by wdswtr

[wdswtr]

I also wouldnt be against having a youth archery hunt for a day and a youth gun hunt for a day in the proper seasons. Or a couple days each. I think the biggest hangup with this youth hunt for most is the point that there are going to be guns used in the now archery season for 3 days. For me I dont mind one bit giving up the 3 days for them to carry a firearm in, for some it seems it twist there marbles. Which I will never understand either. These kids are our future, our huntings future. Take a stand and voice your opinions where it counts is all I can say, talking about it on this site helps inform fellow hunters of different opinions and views but it sure doesnt voice it where the ears that need to hear it are.

[WNYBuckHunter]

There are rifles and shotguns in the woods, Am I missing something? Please don't be one of those guys that are talking about birdshot and .22s and comparing them to high powered rifles.

There are guys out hunting coyote, waterfowl, small game, turkey, etc. i dont know anyone that seriously coyote hunts that doesnt use at least a 223. Also, we arent talking about kids just being allowed to go out on their own, they will need to go with an adult. If you would really be nervous, then stay out of the woods those 3 days (which are all days we didnt even have until this year) or wear blaze orange for those days. Deer dont see blaze anyway.

[WNYBuckHunter]

Wdswtr, I have a good idea why the kids would be so excited about the youth hunt. Its because those days would be all about them, and they wont feel like they have to compete with the older guys. Alot of guys that take their kids out with them during the regular season dont leave their guns at home.

[Doc]

Here's what I don't get. If you have kids and want them hunting with you why wouldn't you take them every chance you had?????????

There should be a second part to your question. That being, if hunters are not taking kids hunting now, what makes anyone think that they will during a special season? Who are the people who will mentor kids in a special season? .... They are the same ones that are currently doing it during the regular season.... aren't they?

[bellava]

There should be a second part to your question. That being, if hunters are not taking kids hunting now, what makes anyone think that they will during a special season? Who are the people who will mentor kids in a special season? .... They are the same ones that are currently doing it during the regular season.... aren't they?

And in this crazy world we live in I am the only one taking my kids out hunting with a firearm. I do not trust anyone with my kids, especially with firearms.

[biggamefish]

Doc I think you make a good point.

[bellava]

And I am not taking somebody elses kid. I really would not want that responsibility . It would have to be family or a real close friend.

[skully]

And in this crazy world we live in I am the only one taking my kids out hunting with a firearm. I do not trust anyone with my kids, especially with firearms.

I hear you------- Jerry Sandusky with a firearm. I do not trust any mentors out there.

[WNYBuckHunter]

See, here are some of the problems....