Posted signs

[stoneam2006]

"Bye" because I had to go back to work. You haven't gotten rid of me.

No lead on the property. No coyote shooting. Don't like Cuomo or the safe act. Don't like Astorino because he is pro-fracking. Who do I vote for?

Back to Belo - He suggests that posted signs only apply to deer hunters, not to coyote hunters. Is there anyone out there who feels that way?

Even tho this should be in different thread....voting for No one isn't goi NH to help anybody. ...if Cuomo gets Reelected he will do everything he can to strip your gun rights...and that's just the start what happens after those are taken can only look in history books for insight....Astrino pro fracking is going to create jobs...ik there's negatives but it will put nyers to work.

[Five Seasons]

"Bye" because I had to go back to work. You haven't gotten rid of me.

 

No lead on the property. No coyote shooting. Don't like Cuomo or the safe act. Don't like Astorino because he is pro-fracking. Who do I vote for?

 

Back to Belo - He suggests that posted signs only apply to deer hunters, not to coyote hunters. Is there anyone out there who feels that way?

 

 

woah, woah, woah. Never said that. Just said that with permission I haven't been denied or would I deny someone.

 

Secondly, you can't get away that easy. Tell us more how predator hunting is useless and has a negative affect on the deer population?

 

[Culvercreek hunt club]

And I do my best to hit or exceed the 70% mark. I would live to see their season moves to 365 a year

[Curmudgeon]

I've never met a hunter who owns land that did not allow yote hunters access after deer season. Same even for turkey. It's the all mighty whitetail or animal rights activists that tend to be the most enforced.

 

We are going off topic but I need to respond.

 

Thanks Papist for the science. It saves me the time.

 

What Belo said is above. He never met a hunter who "did not allow yote hunters access after deer season". This clearly suggests he is only talking to people with a similar mentality, or choosing to ignore the others. The two neighbors I cited are not close friends, just people I talk to and ended up commiserating with. Why do I have no trouble finding people who have these problems? One of the two hunts deer. The other encourages deer hunting on his property. At a meeting in Stamford - this may have been 5 or more years ago -  a DEC wildlife guy told me the greatest threat to coyote hunting with hounds was the number of complaints they get about hounds running on land where they are not welcome. Maybe some are antis, but not all.

 

~9 people hunt my land each season, none has ever shot a coyote. This isn't due to any rule I put in place. Most are family who share a common love and respect for predators. My nephew came back from a hunt last season with a bunch of photos of one. A day in the woods where I get to watch a fox hunt, or see a fisher, is a better day than one when I kill a buck. I've killed a lot of deer. I have not seen a lot of fishers. I spent about a half hour once squeeking at a weasel while it poked its head in and out of a pile of brush. My daughter the professor calls weasels "charismatic mini-fauna". That's my girl.

 

Culver Creek somehow took my love of predators and questioned if it fit with some kind of statewide political agenda. That's a stretch. However, I do love predators. Predators' ability to do what they do well is at times unbelievable. I've had falconers hunt here. The speed of the birds when after prey is amazing. I have a photo of 6 eagles feeding at once on road kill on my property. A deer killed with a lead bullet that fragmented into hundreds of pieces could have poisoned every one of those birds. The neighbor who encountered the belligerent coyote hunter owns 1200 acres and also does not allow lead ammo used on his land. He only allows bow hunting and insists that every hunter fill a DMAP tag before taking a buck. How weird is that?

 

I've made the point in other posts that there are too many deer in the state. Well over half the deer killed legally are anterless. This is by design! Why should Culver Creek be trying to kill enough coyotes to increase deer numbers? Except for the big woods - and maybe the areas with deep lake-effect snow - the result will be too many deer for the health of the forests, and more DMPs to lower the population. Coyotes are no threat to healthy adult deer in most of the state. They are no threat to healthy adult bucks except under extreme conditions. What is the problem?

 

Unless an animal is a direct threat to my household economics, I do not kill anything I do not eat. There is no shortage of venison.   

 

You might think me out of the mainstream, however, when I was on the deer management task force for 4F a couple of years back, we had no trouble reaching consensus. I am not a reactionary, just someone who hopes to prompt others will ask themselves why.

 

 

[Doc]

I'm not sure ho or why a thread called "Posted Signs" is not completely turned toward coyote control .... lol, but I'll play along.

 

It seems to me that in our area, the coyote is at the top of his food chain with only disease to control their numbers. Certainly Mother Nature knows how to do a very good job of controlling populations, but it is not always the most kind or humane way of doing business. Fortunately, one of the legitimate purposes for hunting /trapping of animals is to help control populations. More hunting/trapping....more control. There is nothing healthy about leaving the residents of the top end of the food chain to a lingering fate of disease or starvation. We don't do that to deer, and it probably is even more important not to do that to coyotes. So if there are those that want to thin the coyote population a bit, more power to them. They are performing a legitimate wild game management activity.

[Ford]

And I do my best to hit or exceed the 70% mark. I would live to see their season moves to 365 a year

 

 

Excellent! I would like to see that as well. If "they" say we have to control 70% of the coyote population to make a dent, lets do it. Forget deer, (for now) small game takes a huge hit from these predators. Should coyotes have free reign? What will the outcome of that be? Were they always the top predator here in NY? Were there ever wolves here? They seem to like yote meat, at least according to the vast footage taken in Yellowstone. Coyote seems to be what's for dinner for wolves. Absent wolves, which will never be reintroduced in NY, how do we control them? Rhetorical question of course.  

[Curmudgeon]

There will be no 365 day season. DEC has been funding research on coyotes - some of which is to determine when they whelp because some have been known to do so before the season ends. This may result in a shortened season. Coyotes - like all wildlife - belong to the people of the state. There would be outrage.

 

Where is the science that says small game takes a "huge hit"? I know a DEC guy who is releasing what he calls "chickens" right now. They are probably taking such a hit. Then again, they are not wild birds.

 

The 70% goal is doomed to fail. Since this level of persecution cannot be achieved or sustained beyond a small area, it's a waste of energy that will result in no change. The only benefit will be your emotional satisfaction. Your small game populations will not improve.

 

I see groups of turkeys most days. I have too many squirrels and am dealing with them myself. The rabbit population is very high right now. Grouse are low but this one species cannot be laid at the feet of coyotes.

 

This conversation just affirms that this is not about game management. It is an emotional reaction to competition.

 

Wolves, now there's an idea for controlling coyotes.

[Five Seasons]

We are going off topic but I need to respond.

Thanks Papist for the science. It saves me the time.

What Belo said is above. He never met a hunter who "did not allow yote hunters access after deer season". This clearly suggests he is only talking to people with a similar mentality, or choosing to ignore the others. The two neighbors I cited are not close friends, just people I talk to and ended up commiserating with. Why do I have no trouble finding people who have these problems? One of the two hunts deer. The other encourages deer hunting on his property. At a meeting in Stamford - this may have been 5 or more years ago - a DEC wildlife guy told me the greatest threat to coyote hunting with hounds was the number of complaints they get about hounds running on land where they are not welcome. Maybe some are antis, but not all.

~9 people hunt my land each season, none has ever shot a coyote. This isn't due to any rule I put in place. Most are family who share a common love and respect for predators. My nephew came back from a hunt last season with a bunch of photos of one. A day in the woods where I get to watch a fox hunt, or see a fisher, is a better day than one when I kill a buck. I've killed a lot of deer. I have not seen a lot of fishers. I spent about a half hour once squeeking at a weasel while it poked its head in and out of a pile of brush. My daughter the professor calls weasels "charismatic mini-fauna". That's my girl.

Culver Creek somehow took my love of predators and questioned if it fit with some kind of statewide political agenda. That's a stretch. However, I do love predators. Predators' ability to do what they do well is at times unbelievable. I've had falconers hunt here. The speed of the birds when after prey is amazing. I have a photo of 6 eagles feeding at once on road kill on my property. A deer killed with a lead bullet that fragmented into hundreds of pieces could have poisoned every one of those birds. The neighbor who encountered the belligerent coyote hunter owns 1200 acres and also does not allow lead ammo used on his land. He only allows bow hunting and insists that every hunter fill a DMAP tag before taking a buck. How weird is that?

I've made the point in other posts that there are too many deer in the state. Well over half the deer killed legally are anterless. This is by design! Why should Culver Creek be trying to kill enough coyotes to increase deer numbers? Except for the big woods - and maybe the areas with deep lake-effect snow - the result will be too many deer for the health of the forests, and more DMPs to lower the population. Coyotes are no threat to healthy adult deer in most of the state. They are no threat to healthy adult bucks except under extreme conditions. What is the problem?

Unless an animal is a direct threat to my household economics, I do not kill anything I do not eat. There is no shortage of venison.

You might think me out of the mainstream, however, when I was on the deer management task force for 4F a couple of years back, we had no trouble reaching consensus. I am not a reactionary, just someone who hopes to prompt others will ask themselves why.

Again, you said it hurts a deer heard to hunt yotes. Papists post simply states it might not help a heard, but did not mention it being detrimental.

This is the last time I'll ask you to explain your stance, and honestly I really don't care.

[Five Seasons]

Excellent! I would like to see that as well. If "they" say we have to control 70% of the coyote population to make a dent, lets do it. Forget deer, (for now) small game takes a huge hit from these predators. Should coyotes have free reign? What will the outcome of that be? Were they always the top predator here in NY? Were there ever wolves here? They seem to like yote meat, at least according to the vast footage taken in Yellowstone. Coyote seems to be what's for dinner for wolves. Absent wolves, which will never be reintroduced in NY, how do we control them? Rhetorical question of course.

Excellent point. We've seen a bi decline in turkey populations, and other than habitat lost the predators are a big part of that.

[Curmudgeon]

Again, you said it hurts a deer heard to hunt yotes. Papists post simply states it might not help a heard, but did not mention it being detrimental.

This is the last time I'll ask you to explain your stance, and honestly I really don't care.

Belo -

 

You say I said "it hurts a deer herd to hunt yotes". What I actually did was to ask why someone would want to increase a herd that is already too large. I speculated that if enough coyotes could be killed continually to increase deer numbers, those numbers would negatively impact forests. The idea that coyote hunters could achieve such goals is hypothetical and impossible.

 

Deer numbers are too high now - thus the >50% anterless harvest - so yes it could be inferred that increasing them is not good for the herd. However, since it would be impossible to achieve such a goal, it is a moot point.

 

It does not hurt the deer herd to hunt coyotes. If has no effect on deer numbers on a regional or population scale. Unless an unrealistic, unsustainable amount of energy is put into killing them, there is no impact on coyote numbers. Someone might be able to have an effect in a small area for a short time but young animals looking for territories will just keep moving in from outside. Coyote and deer populations are not affected to any significant degree by coyote hunting.

 

People hunt coyotes for recreation, to get out in the winter, to socialize, for some income. If you believe hunting them changes the amount of other game you hunt, consider doing more reading, more research, and show us the science.

 

[Five Seasons]

Belo -

You say I said "it hurts a deer herd to hunt yotes". What I actually did was to ask why someone would want to increase a herd that is already too large. I speculated that if enough coyotes could be killed continually to increase deer numbers, those numbers would negatively impact forests. The idea that coyote hunters could achieve such goals is hypothetical and impossible.

Deer numbers are too high now - thus the >50% anterless harvest - so yes it could be inferred that increasing them is not good for the herd. However, since it would be impossible to achieve such a goal, it is a moot point.

It does not hurt the deer herd to hunt coyotes. If has no effect on deer numbers on a regional or population scale. Unless an unrealistic, unsustainable amount of energy is put into killing them, there is no impact on coyote numbers. Someone might be able to have an effect in a small area for a short time but young animals looking for territories will just keep moving in from outside. Coyote and deer populations are not affected to any significant degree by coyote hunting.

People hunt coyotes for recreation, to get out in the winter, to socialize, for some income. If you believe hunting them changes the amount of other game you hunt, consider doing more reading, more research, and show us the science.

Herds in some areas are not too large

Edited October 1, 2014 by Belo

[Curmudgeon]

Herds in some areas are not too large

 

True, but statewide, overall the herd is too large.

[bigpaul]

Just to let you all know, I went with my name and full address on my posted signs.  I ordered them with Voss signs and I had them within a week.  A very pleasant company to deal with and a quality sign that should last for years.  Thanks for all the input!

[Culvercreek hunt club]

I am sure we have an impact on the areas we hunt. We will continue to kill them and when new ones move in they will be dealt with in the same fashion.

[Curmudgeon]

Isn't this a beautiful animal?

[New York Hillbilly]

Absolutely, it is beautiful. I would love that mounted exactly as it is standing, in my living room!

[Culvercreek hunt club]

Absolutely, it is beautiful. I would love that mounted exactly as it is standing, in my living room!

Or sell that pelt for some cash in hand

[Curmudgeon]

Hillbilly -

 

You made the Curmudgeon laugh out loud this morning.

 

[Paula]

Nice and healthy looking

[Five Seasons]

Isn't this a beautiful animal?

 

simply stunning

 

 

 

Edited October 2, 2014 by Belo

[stoneam2006]

simply stunning

Are those your pics?

[Five Seasons]

no just google search coyote fawn and you'll find a lot more like it