Too Many Yote's!!

[Mr VJP]

Hounds77, this article is for you. Coyote pelts will fetch $100 now if they are good ones.

http://hunting.scout.com/story/1509064-kill-a-coyote-get-100

[Four Season Whitetail's]

I live in a heavy snowbelt area. Many farms around here. An elk farm. Chickens, goats. sheep, pigs, cows with calves. My friend and neighbor has beef cows with free stalls. Geese and ducks. Pheasants, game birds all running free. We have a healthy coyote population. NEVER has one been lost to a coyote. Heck they don't feed on the bait piles hardly.

Sounds to me that you DONT have a COYOTE PROBLEM...Like others may. We now have a healthy population of huntable coyotes.also, we also now do not have livestock problems from them and we have as many or more turkey and deer than we had before our coyote problem. Kinda like deer i guess, some have way to many, some have great numbers and some have none.

[Terry]

Now theres an interesting question. Let me pose this...If that is the case why then does the city of Chicago now have over 2,000 coyotes living with in the city limits and now causing problems?

Because there is enough food to support 2,000 coyote...

[wooly]

Because there is enough food to support 2,000 coyote...

 

Oh rats..... you might be on to something.

http://abc7chicago.com/news/i-team-rattiest-city-cut-spending-on-rodent-control/379336/

[growalot]

Thats right for they are eating 30% of all urban deer fawn...uncontrolled squirrel and please!!! this is Chicago folks....a healthy rat population that could probably support thrice that many...

[growalot]

Four Seasons........ I just love it when he throws statements out there like that...let me just enlighten the guys on here about something he may not have mentioned...There are many farms that have resorted to purchasing very very expensive working dogs... they are called gaurdian dogs. I know of at least 3 farms using them 2 in the Nunda area and one south of Avoca...mostly around here they are one of 3 breeds that live with their live stock charges. But people use others...He also fails to mention if these kill free farms have plain ole farm dogs that are allowed to have the run of the property...See things like that make a huge difference.....

Komondor

Great Pyrenees

Kuvsz

Edited February 5, 2015 by growalot

[HOUNDS77]

Grow. Usually your statements are biased so I really do not pay attention to them.

[growalot]

I see that as I read...lol

[HOUNDS77]

Show me where Eastern coyotes are bringing $100. And we are at the low end of fur quality in NY. Just goes to show ignorance.

 

http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0LEV0e8v9NUy0YA865XNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTEzYzBvOXJrBHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDMQRjb2xvA2JmMQR2dGlkA1ZJUDU2M18x/RV=2/RE=1423192125/RO=10/RU=http%3a%2f%2fwww.furharvesters.com%2f/RK=0/RS=gHwzNhf1CvYD.UPOZ879y59SGPo-

 

 

[Mr VJP]

Try to help some people...sheesh.   Why do you always need others to show you things?  I posted the link for you.  If you have issues with it, take it up with the writer.

 

Just goes to show belligerence.

Edited February 5, 2015 by Mr VJP

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Four Seasons........ I just love it when he throws statements out there like that...let me just enlighten the guys on here about something he may not have mentioned...There are many farms that have resorted to purchasing very very expensive working dogs... they are called gaurdian dogs. I know of at least 3 farms using them 2 in the Nunda area and one south of Avoca...mostly around here they are one of 3 breeds that live with their live stock charges. But people use others...He also fails to mention if these kill free farms have plain ole farm dogs that are allowed to have the run of the property...See things like that make a huge difference.....

Komondor

Great Pyrenees

Kuvsz

Funny you say this. I just bought a Great Pyrenees puppy from a farm down Nunda way back in Nov. Picked him up on my way home from opening weekend of shotgun. Took him to the vet's last month. He was born in August and in January he pushed 56 pounds. His parents are both 150lbs dogs. If he does not put the run on the yote he will at least alert me to them being there.

[ncountry]

Grow. Usually your statements are biased so I really do not pay attention to them.

Pot, kettle....

[Curmudgeon]

[Doc]

Ok, so I have a question. Please don't anybody have some kind of coronary or put out a contract on me because I happen to get these little brain farts that start me wondering about things. But anyway ... here goes:

 

If it is true that the more you hunt and thin the coyote populations, the more their litter sizes increase, creating a coyote population that is essentially immune to human hunting pressures, what problem would there be to opening up the season year around? Basically it would be a year around hunting opportunity with no impact.

[sweet old bill]

Mother nature seems to have the best way and that is the rabbit cycle of from a high to low is about a 5 year cycle, so when the rabbits is on the high side for numbers they get the mange and pass it  on to the fox and coyotes...that keeps these population down on both...

[growalot]

Doc...The thing about that would be starving litters...for the female still leaves to hunt...That I would have a problem with...thus my suggestion of a 3 month pup rearing break in a season...it would still open the season up more than it is now.

[Curmudgeon]

Making such a statement does not make it true. And if you were to look at the subject without a jaundiced eye, you would see at least half of the hunters in NY are on one side of the issue while the other half are on the other side. The same could be said for wildlife biologists. There isn't enough "science" at this point to make a definite conclusion on the subject.

If you want to do a little research yourself, put up a post calling for the elimination of coyote hunting altogether and see how much support you get. If they are not a threat to anything in nature, especially when there are "Too Many Yotes" in a given area, why not let them all live?

 

VJP - I don't need to do research to know that many hunters - probably more than half - have little use for coyotes. Hating coyotes - or believing they have no value is either prejudice based on ignorance, or a belief that only the things that benefit humans have value - as if we could even know what is in our interests.

 

Go back to the beginning of the thread. NYantler says he was once an "avid" member of the He-man Coyote Haters Club. Then he educated himself. My job is to challenge ignorance and prejudice. That is what I am doing. Anyone with an open mind can find all the information they need on-line. Discussions like this plant seeds. Maybe some will grow.

 

"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe it." Neil deGrasse Tyson - Applies to coyotes and the climate crisis.

 

Ok, so I have a question. Please don't anybody have some kind of coronary or put out a contract on me because I happen to get these little brain farts that start me wondering about things. But anyway ... here goes:

 

If it is true that the more you hunt and thin the coyote populations, the more their litter sizes increase, creating a coyote population that is essentially immune to human hunting pressures, what problem would there be to opening up the season year around? Basically it would be a year around hunting opportunity with no impact.

 

Call me anthropomorphic but I agree with Grow. I have an ethical problem with killing lactating mothers and leaving the pups to starve. We are already doing this since some whelp before the season ends. I have camera trap photos of mating coyotes taken on 1/26/15. The gestation period is 60-63 days. I have other photos of pups ~ a week old taken the last week of March. These early pups and the hunting season were raised with DEC a few years back. They said they were investigating and may adjust the season once they figure out if the early pups are common or an aberration. No word yet. No change yet.

[growalot]

Yet with the nuisense deer permits this happens all the time...shooting doe with feeding fawn....

[nyantler]

Doc...The thing about that would be starving litters...for the female still leaves to hunt...That I would have a problem with...thus my suggestion of a 3 month pup rearing break in a season...it would still open the season up more than it is now.

I think those that are killing coyotes for the reason of eliminating them from the habitat... are probably not concerned about the pups and would kill them as well if given the chance. You've seen it here and probably heard the cry by some of the deer hunters to "Kill 'em all! The only good coyote is a dead coyote". That is a lot of the mentality we are dealing with in NY.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Yet with the nuisense deer permits this happens all the time...shooting doe with feeding fawn....

Thats because the bottom line is...What man wants-Man Gets!   They dont care if they let hunters kill does with fawns because the whole problem to begin with was to many deer. They figure yeah the fawn dies but they got rid of 2 deer out of an area with to many deer already.

[Four Season Whitetail's]

I think those that are killing coyotes for the reason of eliminating them from the habitat... are probably not concerned about the pups and would kill them as well if given the chance. You've seen it here and probably heard the cry by some of the deer hunters to "Kill 'em all! The only good coyote is a dead coyote". That is a lot of the mentality we are dealing with in NY.

Not just Ny my friend..Look at most any state hunting site and you will see the same. Just saw a post awhile back on the qdma website where guys were saying they do/did the same. Sit at the den site with shotguns and ............................Boom!

 

Cant say i could bring myself to that move and we do have a rocky outcrop where they do den at times.

[nyantler]

Not just Ny my friend..Look at most any state hunting site and you will see the same. Just saw a post awhile back on the qdma website where guys were saying they do/did the same. Sit at the den site with shotguns and ............................Boom!

 

Cant say i could bring myself to that move and we do have a rocky outcrop where they do den at times.

Yeah I understand the ignorance isn't just a NY thing.

[wooly]

I couldn't even imagine the hatred running that deep, but I know it does.

I remember when I posted pics from the coyote den I found a few years ago the variety of responses I got from NY residents as well as other states on other sites.

I guess knowing now how many "haters" are really out there that will stop at nothing to eradicate the yotes on a kill 'em all basis is all the reason I need to be "pro-yote"....... to an extent.

8 pups in this litter which came as a bit of a surprise to me and resulted in me doing my own homework on my new neighbors to reinforce my own beliefs.

 

 

[growalot]

Thus my saying a pup rearing 3 months no hunt...Now I have to ask how many feel this way about yote pups but have no problem with. Nuisance permits? I never see full page ads condemning those yet come this time of year they have them condemning yote "contests" due to early pups..

[Lawdwaz]

Thus my saying a pup rearing 3 months no hunt...Now I have to ask how many feel this way about yote pups but have no problem with. Nuisance permits? I never see full page ads condemning those yet come this time of year they have them condemning yote "contests" due to early pups..

 

And nuisance permits go until 9/30