When do you know you have coyote problem?

[wooly]

Whenever they get within view of the livestock.  Does not take much to set them off at times. For about a year they had so many encounters and heard their yipping and yapping they would run from one side of the farm to the other when the heard a police car coming down the highway or any kind of siren pretty much

 

Don't the gunfire when you pop a yote bother them?

Edited July 29, 2015 by wooly

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Don't the gunfire when you pop a yote bother them?

They hear it all the time. I live next to a military base.  Helicopters come down to count the points!

 

There is a rifle in every tractor ready when needed.  Many in this area keep their rifles in their tractors for deer and turkey. Shoot on sight.  Many biggers farms that lease 1000's of acres consider them vermin anymore. If you read the news and look at all the bait and kill going on with whitetails there are many the now call them vermin. Most of them are city folk losing flower beds and hearing of the disease being spread by wild herd.

Edited July 29, 2015 by Four Season Whitetails

[Curmudgeon]

They hear it all the time. I live next to a military base.  Helicopters come down to count the points!

 

There is a rifle in every tractor ready when needed.  Many in this area keep their rifles in their tractors for deer and turkey. Shoot on sight.  Many biggers farms that lease 1000's of acres consider them vermin anymore. If you read the news and look at all the bait and kill going on with whitetails there are many the now call them vermin. Most of them are city folk losing flower beds and hearing of the disease being spread by wild herd.

 

Not to change the subject but can you recommend a good scabbard for a tractor?

 

[Curmudgeon]

Do coyotes eat raccoon at all? There's a lot of them all over the place

 

I don't know but fishers do. I have a friend who witnessed a kill while he was bow hunting. He has a poor quality video. The fisher killed the raccoon and left. My friend put a camera on it. The fisher returned at night and dragged it off.

 

Edited July 29, 2015 by Curmudgeon

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Not to change the subject but can you recommend a good scabbard for a tractor?

 

Just soft sided case sitting in the corner of the cab. Big Case tractors have lots of room inside the cab.

[DirtTime]

OK, so here's a penny in the pond!

How many? 2!

If you see 2 then that would most likely mean a pair. If they have adequate food, they will not be going anywhere soon. They will make a den and mate. Then you will have at least double that the next year if nothing is done, the year after that you will have at least 8. Then 16.......

As long as they have food they really aren't going to leave the honey pot. But when they don't have food, then they will leave and you will not have much to hunt.

So if you are spending money to plant food plots to help grow deer you hunt, 2 is 2 too many. You put your money, time, and work to get those plots in. The only 'competition' you should have to deal with is ( if you allow them there ) other human hunters killing the deer.

[nyantler]

Do coyotes eat raccoon at all? There's a lot of them all over the place

I would guess that the raccoon might be a bit of a fight for a coyote... they aren't much for prey that can fight back.

[jjb4900]

I would guess that the raccoon might be a bit of a fight for a coyote... they aren't much for prey that can fight back.

yeah, raccoon's are pretty ornery creatures when they need to be........I witnessed a raccoon get into it with a Pitbull a few weeks ago and although he wound up losing he put up a hell of a fight, not pretty at all.

Edited July 29, 2015 by jjb4900

[wooly]

OK, so here's a penny in the pond!

How many? 2!

If you see 2 then that would most likely mean a pair. If they have adequate food, they will not be going anywhere soon. They will make a den and mate. Then you will have at least double that the next year if nothing is done, the year after that you will have at least 8. Then 16.......

 

 

You're freaking clueless about coyotes ............rob...., so I didn't bother quoting the rest of your fantasy post.

Seriously, you should stick to topics you have some knowledge about instead of pulling shit out of your ass like you did here.

I bolded the part you need to "Google" more before you keep spewing senseless crap like this

 

Have you ever even SEEN a coyote in the wild?

[DirtTime]

I'm on it now wooly! 

[orion]

When coyote tracks out number deer tracks!

[wooly]

I'm on it now wooly! 

 

Crunch some more numbers and let me know if you've really got the problem you think you do.

I sent you the answer, but don't peak.

[DirtTime]

Let me truly explain my personal point of view. All sarcasm aside!

Where I hunt up north, which actually isn't very far into the ADK's, we hear the coyotes killing deer at night every summer. Not just fawns either. Yes, it ticks me off! Yes there is a problem. Like I also mentioned, they keep coming closer and closer to our camp at night. I am sorry, but this does constitute a problem in that area.

Maybe where you are or hunt they aren't an issue. That's fine. I actually see your point of view to leave them be. It just seems that for those of us who do have a problem, many don't want to see our point of view.

There is a fact though, whether people want to admit it or not, once they are established, it will be much harder to get rid of them if they do become a problem.

 

 

 

[nyantler]

How does one hear a coyote kill a deer??? If hunters are so worried about the coyote population then they should get their asses out and hunt them whenever the season is open. That isn't happening... therefore my conclusion would be it isn't as important as most hunters claim... otherwise it would be at the top of their list of things to hunt outside of deer season. The coyote problem in most cases is imagined not real.

Edited July 30, 2015 by nyantler

[wooly]

How does one hear a coyote kill a deer???

 

I can't answer for anyone else, but I did see and hear 2 coyotes kill a fawn once.

The fawn was the only one making any noise though, so if I hadn't seen it with my own two eyes..., there's NO WAY I'd have been able to say it was being killed by coyotes.

 

I think a lot of folks mistake the yotes pack assembly and territorial howls as a kill announcement.

I better tell this guy it AIN'T safe to come out yet,lol

 

Edited July 30, 2015 by wooly

[nyantler]

great pic wooly of that savage deer killer..lol

[Four Season Whitetail's]

Let me truly explain my personal point of view. All sarcasm aside!

Where I hunt up north, which actually isn't very far into the ADK's, we hear the coyotes killing deer at night every summer. Not just fawns either. Yes, it ticks me off! Yes there is a problem. Like I also mentioned, they keep coming closer and closer to our camp at night. I am sorry, but this does constitute a problem in that area.

Maybe where you are or hunt they aren't an issue. That's fine. I actually see your point of view to leave them be. It just seems that for those of us who do have a problem, many don't want to see our point of view.

There is a fact though, whether people want to admit it or not, once they are established, it will be much harder to get rid of them if they do become a problem.

Same thing happened to my old stomping grounds up in Black Lake, The back side of the lake was some of the best hunting there ever was. Big deer and lots of them. State land of course and when yotes moved in..The deer went by the wayside..Dead-moved out..You be the judge.

 

Started to happen in this next piece of heaven but that got taken care of real quick... Deer and Turkey abound.  Well minus a few Turkeys after this winter. 

[greg54]

I would guess that the raccoon might be a bit of a fight for a coyote... they aren't much for prey that can fight back.

The only place I have seen raccoon dead are on the roadside. When I have been out small game hunting in the state park, I have come across leftover remains of rabbits, pheasant, and sometimes feral cats and few other critters. And it was usually just remnants of what was killed and eaten, but never have come across a chewed up raccoon. Sounds like your right.

[DirtTime]

How does one hear a coyote kill a deer??? If hunters are so worried about the coyote population then they should get their asses out and hunt them whenever the season is open. That isn't happening... therefore my conclusion would be it isn't as important as most hunters claim... otherwise it would be at the top of their list of things to hunt outside of deer season. The coyote problem in most cases is imagined not real.

Really? 

If you think a deer goes quietly when being killed by any predator, you need to think again! Go look at the post around here somewhere where that bear killed the deer. It wasn't quiet! You think it's less quiet at night with coyotes killing it? It's a pretty darn scary ruckus to have wake you up at 3 am! When you aren't in the burbs and actually in the woods, sound  travels farther and is more clear.

 

As for the second red part. I will let the people around where I hunt know that it's all in our heads. Hey, no offense taken though. Must be in the water. 20+ people all hallucinating. Maybe it was a bear. Oh wait, no bears in the area. A fox perhaps? Nope, must have been the fisher cats. WAIT! Big foot, chupacabra, maybe aliens! Werewolves? Maybe a vampire? Maybe the Jersey Devil is hunting NY now?

[Curmudgeon]

NYantler is absolutely right, most coyote problems are imagined. Most are not real. Look at where the complaints come from and compare that to how many DMPs DEC issues and how many antlerless deer are taken. Do that math. It makes a lot of coyote haters look like they didn't get through elementary school. You want more deer, lobbying DEC is a better use of time. If you just want to kill things, do your local farmer a favor and go after woodchucks.

 

I am not saying there are not problems with livestock. Or, that there aren't areas where coyotes have a significant impact on deer. Those areas are marginal deer habitat anyway - due to excessive snow or closed canopy mature forests. What was moose habitat became deer habitat during the late 19th and early 20th centuries. It is now moose habitat once again.

Edited July 31, 2015 by Curmudgeon

[wooly]

Same thing happened to my old stomping grounds up in Black Lake, The back side of the lake was some of the best hunting there ever was. Big deer and lots of them. State land of course and when yotes moved in..The deer went by the wayside..Dead-moved out..You be the judge.

 

You guys got me really confused here.

Are they killing all your mature deer off, or just altering their behavior by chasing them away?

 

If a yote catches and kills a mature deer during the summertime, there's probably a reason for that.(sick, injured, diseased,or already dead)

Winter time is a whole different ball game when things get ugly, but even then they are conserving energy by mostly feeding on leftover carcasses from winterkill and hunting seasons unrecovered casualties.

I wouldn't mind seeing a few summetime kill carcasses of dead deer (non fawns) to confirm any of what I'm reading here that would suggest coyotes are targeting healthy adult size deer with any success.

 

Sorry, I'm just not buying it...

[DirtTime]

There are no DMP's in most of the NZ. Muzzleloader only in most areas. 

But I'm done. You all kicked my ass. Because parts of the state may not have a coyote problem, then none of the state has a coyote problem. 

I admitted to seeing your point of view, but you will never see ours, it's all in our heads. 

[Curmudgeon]

I just found a 2010 letter from just retired Chief DEC Wildlife Biologist Gordon B in my computer. Quotes of interest regarding NYS as a whole:

 

"the New York State Conservation Council, Inc. has opposed various resolutions calling for a year-round season based on their status as a game species."

 

"we view the Eastern coyote as a valuable component of New York’s faunal community and we seek to manage them for multiple values"

 

"A central principle of game species management is that hunting or trapping opportunity should exclude the period of time when young are reared."

 

As I said earlier, you will be hard pressed to find any professional wildlife biologist who retains the 19th century attitudes that are so prevalent here.

[nyantler]

Really? 

If you think a deer goes quietly when being killed by any predator, you need to think again! Go look at the post around here somewhere where that bear killed the deer. It wasn't quiet! You think it's less quiet at night with coyotes killing it? It's a pretty darn scary ruckus to have wake you up at 3 am! When you aren't in the burbs and actually in the woods, sound  travels farther and is more clear.

 

As for the second red part. I will let the people around where I hunt know that it's all in our heads. Hey, no offense taken though. Must be in the water. 20+ people all hallucinating. Maybe it was a bear. Oh wait, no bears in the area. A fox perhaps? Nope, must have been the fisher cats. WAIT! Big foot, chupacabra, maybe aliens! Werewolves? Maybe a vampire? Maybe the Jersey Devil is hunting NY now?

So you're saying the bears are decimating the deer herd now? The fact that wild prey die a terrible and sometimes noisy death is not proof that your coyotes are a problem... especially since that is just a fact of nature and is unavoidable in nature... But, thanks for passing on the word about the imagined coyote problem to your friends it saves me time of having to explain it all over again.. . much appreciated. And if you'd like to hunt some real woods, let me know sometime I'll take you along with me... bring your compass you'll need it.

Edited July 31, 2015 by nyantler

[orion]

"Or, that there aren't areas where coyotes have a significant impact on deer. Those areas are marginal deer habitat anyway - due to excessive snow or closed canopy mature forests"

 

This statement shows why some people feel coyotes have a bigger impact on deer then others. The diets of coyotes in wooded/forested areas have a greater percentage of deer then the coyotes in agricultural areas. Combine that with the fact that there are fewer deer in these non agricultural areas to begin with and you have coyotes having a greater impact on deer populations in certain areas then others.